I’m a middle-aged widow. I don’t want your husband

The one married woman who still invites me to these things is very secure in her own relationship. She likes even numbers, but she'll invite a good mix of married and single people, young and old and not always equal men and women, not an attempt to pair us up but to build an interesting crowd. It's lovely

Most of my couple friendships came about because I was friends with the wives and then when we included husbands in some evenings the men became friends too, but the women still disappeared once I was widowed.

More 'intimate' occasions such as a couples dinner party, or a couples meal out, is different.

Why do these need to be “couples” events, unless you’re all planning on chucking your car keys in a bowl after the meal has finished?

Once time passes you realise that they're no loss, of course, but at the time, you've just lost your DH, then you lose your whole support network and any social life as well.

I think one of the things that hurt most was that DH really thought those people would be there for me. We'd been friends as a group for decades.

But that assumes you were only friends with them as a couple rather than as individuals. Do you really want your friends to see you like that rather than Joan who you enjoy girly chats with and John whose view on politics you enjoy debating (or vice versa) plus enjoying the shared interest that brought you together in the first place?

In the past, I would have said this was ridiculous. But having seen the number of threads on MN in which women say there's nothing immoral or unethical about going after a married man, I'm not so sure. There was a thread the other day where a woman had given her phone number to a man in front of the woman she knew to be his wife - and people were actually saying she did nothing wrong, no one has to respect anyone else's marriage.

I think couple friendship are not real. If a couple separate or someone one loses spouse, the friendship fades away. I think couple friendships are just about socialising with other couples.

It's not burdensome so much as it's just not conducive to an occasion such as a dinner party.
As PP's have said, weddings, parties, even holidays it wouldn't matter - a mix of couples and singles works fine, makes it better even.
More 'intimate' occasions such as a couples dinner party, or a couples meal out, is different.

I prefer going out for a meal with just my husband. Couples dinner parties are a bit of a chore for me, because they tend to be with colleagues and acquaintances more than with close friends (personally I wouldn't want to go to that sort of occasion without my husband).

With 'actual' friends get togethers tend to happen more organically. Maybe that's why newly single people can feel excluded, get togethers often happen when one partner is collecting the other or such like, or collecting the kids, and someone suggests getting together at the weekend.

There’s a lot of difference between being divorced and being a widow.

When the person you to chose to live your life with and made a lifetime of plans with and had children with.
We had many plans for us and our children but it wasn’t to be as he died almost 2 years after his brain tumour diagnosis.

When people who were divorced tell me they know exactly how I feel, I have to bite my tongue, because their child still has two parents, they can go and stay or holiday with the other parent so you get a break, they may get financial support and can share the highs and lows.

They can pick up the phone and talk to the other parent and make joint decisions.

Widows get none of those things, in the widow community we say that a divorced parent can’t wait to take their wedding ring off, but as widows we struggle to do so.

After my husband died I didn’t get invited to stuff like we used to do, the one time I went for a meal with two of the couples we used to go out with, we had a table for six, I ended up sitting opposite an empty chair.

Things do change when you’re widowed. I certainly felt that women were keeping very close to their husbands to ensure I didn’t steal them, I mean I didn’t fancy them before,FFS I was widowed not desperate my morals didn’t die when my husband did.

Well if it is they would be wrong. Quite often it feels like I’m the smug one tripping off to my wee quiet house and my big comfy bed.*
*my friends’ husbands are generally nice men, but I’m generally the one their wives moan to when the bin hasn’t been emptied again.

Took me long enough to get rid of mine- definitely don’t want other women’s husbands. Unfortunately it’s the way women have always been treated- as an adjunct to a bloke so people don’t know what to do with you when you’re single.

I've found my male friends less good at keeping in touch in general, I lost quite a few along the way in my thirties or have only occasional contact with them and this didn't get worse after widowhood, but seemed to be more to do with the social mores around male/female friendships. I do now have a couple of male friends, and they seem to be quite mature about this stuff! I do agree starting friendships from scratch with men is something hard to do, whatever your marital status, due to the potential for misunderstanding. I like hanging out with friends' families as well, that changes the dynamic away from a slightly awkward three.

Jolene has a lot to answer for.😀

I don't think the women consciously thought I was after their husbands but evidently there was some sort of thought process there that meant I could no longer be part of the group.

This is exactly it. We'd been friends with these couples for the best part of 25 years. I thought the men were my friends too, not just the women. I've moved on now and have other friends but I still, 7 years later, feel sad.

It's very real and I've seen it in action - when MIL was widowed in her late 70's she had exactly the same situation. She used to have a vibrant social life which she really enjoyed , she reached the point where she didn't feel comfortable even hosting other couples because of the dynamic.

fortunately for her she met a lovely chap who was widowed and they rubbed along nicely for about 10yrs, each in their own houses but going on holiday together and socialising as a couple. She moved into sheltered accommodation after he died where she has a different kind of social life as there are very few couples in there.

I didn't experience it after my divorce as exH and I didn't really do the couples socialising thing - he was a REALLY fussy eater so that whole scene really didn't work for him. I socialised with my work friends, and that simply continued.

Because maybe the person enjoys spending time with the couple as a couple. I don't want to just talk about whatever the women want to talk about maybe I like diy/football/rugby/cricket but that bores a lot of women.

I was given a plus one for a wedding, I went on my own (mainly because it was abroad and to hell was I taking anyone away with me). I'm not taking a friend for support as I don't need a friend for support, I'm quite capable of navigating a party, a dinner, a bbq, a wedding as a single person I don't need my hand held. I can go to things on my own and hold a conversation with shock horror a couple. I don't feel left out or like a third wheel (if a couple is doing that then they aren't good hosts).

I'm lucky that I have a good bunch of friends who don't exclude me because I'm single. There's the odd one but they can't be that much of a friend if they exclude me for being single.

Yes, you completely misunderstood my comment.
I'm not desperate to spend time with anyone's husband (I'm not desperate to spend time with anyone in fact).
The point I was making is that I don't only want female friends. I am able to be friends with women and men and enjoy spending time with both. Spending time with a man, whether he's married or single, does not mean I'm about to jump on him!

I posted early in this thread from the perspective of someone who's missing the friends who've fallen by the wayside.

But the more I read, the more I realise I should be grateful for the one couple who make sure they catch up with me every few weeks as a couple and who both talk to me in the same way that they did when my husband was alive. They're clearly on the way to being unicorns.

Oh I don’t mean if you are going out just as a couple. I mean if you’re having a get together with other couples and decide not to invite because it’s assumed ‘they’ll feel awkward ‘

Personally, I don't understand this. I wouldn't want to bring a +1 for the sake of it. If I go to dinner or whatever with coupled up friends, they're not responsible for me. I'm an adult and can join in conversation. But maybe that's how they feel, and that's why they rarely invite.

The single friend is a burden. Good thing I like doing things on my own, I guess.

I'm so sorry. I get it too.

I honestly don't know why there are some on this thread that don't understand that singles and couples, males and females, can still socialise together. When you've been friends for so long, being left out is really isolating and sad.

If I became single and still wanted to be included in my friend's couples events I'd tell them to keep inviting me, but I'd take company (a friend, my sister, my daughter).

Genuine question @SloaneStreetVandal . Why would you feel the need to take someone with you? These are your friends, so I'm confused why you feel the need for "company"

I get you op.

Our whole social life revolved around 3 other couples. Dh died 7 years ago and I've never been to a dinner party or seen the other 3 men since.

I still see the women so I know that the 6 of them still socialise. It hurts.

That happened to me when I became a single parent, at least 3 of my friends partners made a pass at me, such tedious cliched behaviour. I never told any of the women, what good would it have done?. Two of them are divorced now so at least they are free of the scumbags