To think schools should get with the times re working parents.

Childminders seems like a more sustainable option because there's also the opportunity to get a full time wage from it by working during school hours too. Wraparound is never going to be full time hours, and it pays accordingly.

Yes let’s look to schools to fix another societal issue. I have already commented on this but I read it again and got angry again haha.

I think employers should give better hours to working parents, to fit around the school run. I would have stayed in the last job, if better hours were possible. I became a sahm because of it.

Jesus Christ!! I did NOT SAY THAT. I said take precautions, meaning use a couple of contraceptive methods clearly, not kill an already conceived child FFS.

Stop hitting out at other people for your own lack of financial planning in life.

Unbelievable. Shall I start a sister thread named 'AIBU to think that parents should get with the times re. education versus babysitting?'

It’s not childcare, it’s education. 🤦

So because something doesn't operate exactly how you want it to OP, it is behind the times and should change?

What a selfish, arrogant way to view the world.

Because funding cuts. In primary longer lunchtimes cost more as lunchtime supervisors need to be there longer. It's hard enough to recruit for them as it is, many of them in my primary are older retired staff whose kids or grandkids went through teh school. They are just loyal to the school and like the kids and wouldn't WANT to stand in a cold playground in winter for longer than is necessary. We barely get any external people applying for lunchtime supervisor jobs when we advertise.

In both primary and secondary kitchen staff would need to be there longer. School staff doing lunch duties need to be paid for it. If TAs stayed for a longer day they'd need to be paid more too. In many secondaries the kids can be WILD at lunchtimes, and some behavioural issues which take place at lunchtime take all afternoon to sort out. Nowadays there are many more (often pointless) staff meetings straight after school. Often weekly.

There are many reasons but it mostly comes down to money.

The main issue is that childcare is not the job of teachers. If we put child care into schools, childcare will become the job of teachers by stealth. When a school can't recruit, has childcare staff off sick etc it will be the expectation that ratios are managed by existing staff stepping up. So teachers. They'll be expected to do that without pay and at a moment's notice. Over time, it will just end up that teaching staff are responsible fior their class 7am till 6pm.

I do think childcare in schools is important for parents but it can't be the case that every child is entitled all of the time. It's complex, unwieldy.

As the thread goes on and judging by the op’s responses I’m beginning to think it is.

Extending teacher contracts would be very difficult. Many would not wish to or be able to provide after school and before school care for three main reasons

Own family circumstances and lack of childcare
Need to work on prep and attend meetings after school
Work life balance and burn out

Also govment unlikely to wish to increase pay to incorporate extra hours

Schools would struggle to recruit other people who just want to work before and after school.

Numbers in after school clubs are generally low anyway.

Many kids want to go home and rest after long day.

I think what would be better are more childcare settings that offer this care. My dd went to a primary with a pre school at the side if the playground that also offered a before and after school club. This was great for working parents.

OP you do know there are no teachers left these days don’t you? Who is going to staff this? The supply teachers and TAs who bridge the gaps already?

This thread has got really long and I'm sure this has been mentioned by school staff already but what on earth makes you think that school buildings and playing fields just "sit there" locked up during the holidays? Haven't you considered cleaning staff, caretakers and school business managers and the hours that may be in their contracts? Have you seen the state of many school sites? They are old and in a state of disrepair. Annual maintenance of buildings and grounds has to be scheduled for the times that children are off site. ie. holidays. Normal deep cleaning. Painting. Relaying flooring. Fixing roofs, replacing outdoor equipment sheds. Installing new routers or phone or entrance systems. Tree maintenance. Overseeding playing fields (spring and autumn). Repairing fences. Cleaning inside windows. Replacing kitchen equipment. Resealing the hall floor.

Teachers come in and have a good sort out of their stock cupboards. They set up their new classrooms. In primary, all the new labels for books and pegs etc need doing. Office staff come in and do all the archiving and shredding and setting up systems for the new year (because the last few weeks of the summer term is manic and you don't have time to do it all).

INSET days usually involve full day mandatory safeguarding or first aid training or curriculum updates so it's not like all this stuff can be squeezed into those.

Please, just engage your brains and try not to think that the only things that go on in schools are what you see as a parent. There is SO much more that goes on that you haven't got any idea of.

But no one can ever answer about the jobs that CAN'T be more flexible. Everyone just kind of shrugs and says well it doesn't really matter because most people (??) have office jobs.
Doctors and dentists CANNOT just wander in and out only working 9-3. I remember years ago working in a dental surgery and one of the dentists worked 9.30-2.30 only due to childcare. Hardly anyone wanted to see this dentist when they realised her hours. All working people and those with children would say no sorry can I see someone else because I need to be seen outside school/ work hours.
(Besides the point but it also caused issues for the nurse working with her who didn't get a lunch break until 2.30 despite having to be in at 8am when the clinic opened. And the dentist didn't want to keep having her nurse chopped and changed throughout her session)

Because the UK votes conservative ie for low taxes and a small state. Then we belly ache about the state of the state.

I don’t mind paying for wraparound care but it is massively over scribes at the school which DS is starting at in September 2024. There are 30 spaces for 450 children. There is also ONE childminder that may do wraparound and pick up and school so that’s a handful of extra places.

When my DS1 was a newborn, i remember voting for Ed Miliband, promising wraparound childcare in every school. Pretty sure the SNP promised the same at the last Scottish election (confusingly, given they are currently in power, and yet I still have no childcare).

Clearly, this is not a wildly outlandish concept. I don't think anyone expects teachers to provide it, or for children to spend three extra hours drilling times tables.

It was not a surprise to me that children need childcare. I do admit that I did expect to be able to spend money to get some though. I did not foresee private provision closing, all council provision being closed to save money, and childminders quiting or having waiting lists years long. I expected to be able to increase my hours when my DC started school, not to be forced to cut them.

Birth rates are falling so clearly a lot of people are NOT having children until they can afford them and are finding the work/life balance of having kids difficult. We do need a new generation born in this country at some stage.

I’ve been a working mum with difficult hours and it wasn’t a great stage of my life. Britain needs some solutions to this problem - whether in better working conditions or more childcare.

As for work, you know the reality is that the men and the women without kids are generally the ones who advance. The mums in high raking jobs in companies with a bad work/life balance are unicorns.

@Cheepcheepcheep I earn £75k and I’d love to spend more time with my children, but I have to pay a mortgage (to keep a roof over their heads) and food (so they don’t die) and childcare (so I can earn the money for the housing and food).

Would you like your children brought up by robots or slaves? Because you do realise that many school staff are on WAYYYYY less money than that, are already doing lots of extra hours for nothing even on their shitty wages, and also have their own children, and mortgages to pay for. Many of the TAs or lunchtime supervisors or wraparound staff only do it because they love the pupils they look after and it fits in with their own family life. If they had to work any more hours at the pittance rate they get they'd just leave. So what's the alternative? Plug the gaps with people who can afford to work only 3 hours a day? Where do you honestly thing you're going to find such people?

YABU

I don’t want my children in school all day, what sort of childhood is that?

Maybe working hours should be reduced instead or jobs allowed for more flexibility

Some seem to think teachers are baby sitters and school is free child care.
Well news flash its not it dont work like that.
If you cant afford to take care of your own kids dont try to put it on others.
Or simply dont have have children until you can afford it.

Childcare and club options need to be in place in schools run by specialist providers.

They don’t even need to need to be in school-that isn’t always the best option. If the government funded childminders properly, they wouldn’t all be closing-mine much preferred the ‘watching telly/reading on the sofa and chilling with a biscuit‘ type of afterschool activity so a child minder was much better for them.

Children in my class go to swimming lessons, cubs / scouts / brownies / guides, dancing lessons, horse riding, art lessons, karate, different music lessons, football, ice skating lessons and loads more different things. Some go home and play, some see grandparents etc etc

Children need their down time. Time to relax and be at home. School until 6pm is not doable and anyone who thinks so has obviously never stepped foot in a classroom as a professional or they can’t remember what it was like to be a child.

Mental health concerns and school refusal are SO high at the moment - this is not going to help.

My class go home at 3:20. I leave at 5:30 having worked for those hours after school. Most nights I work at home. When would I plan lessons? Prepare all the resources? Mark the work the children have done? Display my class’s work? When would I run a club? 6pm at night?? When would I meet with parents? When would I do parents evenings? Report writing? When would I read the books my class give me to read because they love them? When would I read books to recommend to them? Professional development and research is done in my own unpaid time. SEND paperwork??? Apply if for EHCPs??? Supporting the families who need the additional support?? When would any of these things be done?
My class would suffer, their families would suffer (home, dinner and bed - what joys that would be for them all!) my own family would suffer and I would be a jibbering exhausted wreck.
Schools are at crisis point and this is a fucking stupid idea.

Rather than calling for a whole country to change its ways for your lifestyle, why don’t you change your lifestyle?

I see where you’re coming from OP and you’re getting a pasting here but your title literally says it’s schools that need to catch up. Schools are just a venue when the teaching stops, it’s private companies/sports clubs that <could> step up and offer childcare after school using the schools’ facilities. That said, you need people to be prepared to do that. It’s not for schools to do this, they already have plenty of after hours work.