Manipulated by women that “can’t”

"I can't drive to xyz!" Op: "OK, text me when your Uber gets here."

"I can't sit next to so and so." Op: "Ok, there's a steward, call them over to see what they can do."

If it's impacting their ability to work effectively then as their manager I'd be following up (no matter their age).

If it's causing irritation in a friendship to the extent their behaviour is consistently pissing you off and youre having to "parent" them then I'd say something and if no improvement I'd drop the rope. I find as I age that I give less f and learned helplessness in an adult is unattractive and manipulative in male or female friends.

If point 2 and point 5 are the same person then I'd put money on them being autistic even if they don't know it.

That would be me. Anaphylactic fragrance allergy. I get the impression OP is talking about workplace situations, where disability accommodations are absolutely necessary.

Oh us old bags hey what are we like! I’m 54 on Friday and can manage everything on that list except mornings (due to LC/CF) but if I have work at 8am I am there!

It does. Frankly, the sex and age group that has most often deployed weaponised incompetence in the academic workplace in my experience has been older, senior men who, strangely, have managed to never figure out how to use Excel, or are just dreadful at dealing with minute-taking at meetings, or find pastoral stuff just too hard.

The only person I know who couldn't get put of bed to get to work before 11am was a male colleague who claimed it was due to ADHD. I don't know anything about ADHD so that might have been a perfectly legitimate medical reason. He often worked late into the night though so I couldn't get too exercised about it.

So YABU to imply that this behaviour is exclusive to women.
Also, as per the PP who said that women often spend their lives people-pleasing, I find it quite encouraging when I encounter women who say "no" to things they don't want to do.
You can also put down boundaries if you want 🤷🏼‍♀️

I'm in this age group and can't really relate, but I do know a common side effect of menopause is anxiety and a loss of confidence. Could that have anything to do with it?

I wonder if people have become more confident in the wrong sort of way.

Happy to assert their own weakness as if it is a part of their identity and it makes them special

A lot of people will say, 'Oh I don't eat blue cheese.' (Random example) And they'd expect that to be accommodated. Or they'd come an moan about how they went to somebody's house and they were made to eat this disgusting blue cheese thing or their host didn't offer them an alternative.

And everybody would sympathise and say how terrible the host was.

Whereas I'd go and think, 'Oh hell, I don't really like blue cheese that much but I am going to get this down, just maybe not eat any seconds and have plenty of bread to mute the taste. And actually maybe this will be a really good type of blue cheese.

If I didn't want to drive somewhere that was unusually tricky, I might take a bus or walk or even get a taxi.

But I'd feel a responsibility not to wimp out if it was good friends.

And I also feel pleased with myself when I've managed to overcome my own reluctance.

I agree it sounds like, ‘I don’t want to …. any more.’ I am completely like that these days whereas when I was younger I would have gone with the flow or even put myself out to suit everybody else.

Can't relate to any of your examples and I'd be getting irritated too. They sound exhausting tbh.

Which bit is the manipulation?

This all just sounds like sexist, ageist shite.

People can only "manipulate" you if you let them...

So is the question actually "Am I a bit too wet to work with senior professionals?"

Are you talking about learned helplessness?

I think that if they can't do these things, they should just stay at home and forgo a social life.

I don't like driving or being in unfamiliar places. However I just get on with it as I don't want to impose.

If they say they can't and you also can't , what happens? Time to call their bluff. Two can play at that game.

It's well known that people lose their fucks as they get older. 40 is famously the point where many women realise they have been people pleasing all their life and jack it in. The language of "I can't " is clearly factually inaccurate, it would be clearer to say "I don't want to" . But for right or wrong most people shy away from being that direct!

I couldn't be friends with people who can't tell the truth about what they want.

If it's a work context, then you just have to be firm and clear, but have a think about how much drama or effort you're prepared to invest if they do refuse to get a grip... I personally think if they can't be arsed to do their job then I won't do it for them and I definitely will not cover for them either. Let their manager attempt to manage them.

@Mistressofpemberly - nope, cannot relate even slightly. Although if people find driving at night difficult, I'd really rather they didn't....

Well, if you say this is happening both in your workplace and in your friendships, OP, I think I'd be asking myself why I was surrounded by such unusually helpless people -- because I (also a 50something professional with lots of women friends) have never encountered this among colleagues or friends.

Never encountered anything like that. I’m 59. I think you know very unusual people.

I'm depressed at how many things I used to easily do and take for granted now cost me a lot. I'm 52.

I don't resonate with most of your examples but there could be health stuff underneath and they may say "can't" as a shorthand for "need to use energy for other things and this isn't worth it to me".

Mine would be:

• hold down v senior demanding job, but would not want to go on a site walkabout where I might be 1 hour away from a loo
• I wake up very early through menopause things so might say no to evening meeting

these are all very feeble but can't help it.

I have never known someone in real life who was so allergic to perfume they couldn’t stand next to them. If someone told me to go home for “imposing” my perfume on them I’d laugh my head off!!

Your examples are all crap because quite plainly you're choosing to do it.

They can find their own way to wherever they need to be and either will do or will miss out.

What time they get up is really upto them.

Some people are especially sensitive to strong scents and this has no correlation age.

• has to rearrange seating plans / travel plans as someone’s perfume is strong

Just say no.

For colleagues, are you their manager? If not, ignore it. If so, does it just irritate you because staff are able to work flexibly? Or is it actually causing problems with, eg, a service to be provided at 9.30am that they can’t do because they do not wish to start work then?

let that be your guide.