To think there needs to be a public inquiry into child development

Crossed post!

I definitely don’t think this holds much truth..

I don’t think it can be underestimated how much of an effect Covid had. I called it at the time - the country had people living in fear, getting them to follow crazy arbitrary rules to keep them ‘safe’ (these kept changing), kids would have been scared for their own lives and also worried that their families could suddenly die. It was very similar to how I lived my life in an abusive relationship…and I can tell you that over a decade later my mental and physical health never recovered. It’s easy to think oh well it’s over, let’s just get on with it, but when you stop and think about what an enormous headfuck it would
have been for children old enough to understand, it’s really quite chilling.

The ones that weren’t old enough to understand missed out on crucial social interaction, and only ever saw people wearing masks out of the house.

And also for the kids already in school, the break in education that Covid gave kids with the lockdown showed them a different way. They had been institutionalized into just going to school and that was the end of it, but all of a sudden school wasn’t a thing and I think some kids could just never get back into the groove of going.

What I don't get with these threads is the general overall lack of acknowledgement of lockdown on everyone. Of course there would be a sudden shift in behaviour after all spending a year or so completely divorced from anything social. Not to mention all the people who just didn't resume normal social behaviour after it all finished.

Not at all surprising we are having all these issues with children and young people now really.

@anxioussister but your getting a snapshot of a mum whose probably with that child 24 /7 and the bus maybe her small breather?

Children also need plenty of down time to just potter around and watch a parent and have that solid connection.
Being in a nursery from a baby, every day from 7am to 6pm is a long day isn't it.
For one and two year old that a long time day with some one paid to care for them and the others.

a formal education system isn’t good for autistic children. I still don’t think addictive screens are good and they should be doing hands on learning, physically doing something that they can see and interact with

Stimming is done for an autistic person to regulate themselves. Toddlers move their hands and show excitement by moving.

I don't think COVID can be blamed for the behaviour in early years now. I do think has effected teenagers though. My son suffered with school refusal after lockdown, as did many other kids. His mental health hasn't been the same since.

I'm autistic and I disagree with you.

In order to get my autistic son to engage with learning, whether that's academically or otherwise, you have to appeal to his interest.

He is interested in technology.

He is in a mainstream setting at school where all materials available to him are books and paper and pens and social carpet time, and nobody can get him to sit and write and spell, or practice reading and phonics.

At home, on his tablet he spells and writes and uses a stylus.

We've read every day to him since he was born and his interest in books is limited and self led. We can't always read to him because he would like to just flip the same page backwards and forwards.

We sing songs, he engages, but it doesn't teach him practical applicable life skills.

I don't think he would be talking like he does now if we hadn't eased up on the no screen time rule, because that is how he picked up on his gestalt and before he was allowed access to technology he had several injurious and harmful stims because of his boredom and inability to engage with many things that did not interest him at all.

I'm not advocating for absolutely unfettered access to screen time for all children but simply pointing out that technology is advantageous for learning, even self directed learning from being young and I think it's very closed minded to assume otherwise.

If technology didn't exist, my son would certainly have a lot of damage from self injurious behaviour and if he was born in a time from the past he would have been institutionalised.

Parents not talking to their kids - prams world facing no interaction.
Screens on all the time for an easy ride.
Not even greeting them after school - just carry on on their phones.
Excusing everything as them 'not being ready' when it means the parents are ready for the effort it takes.
Parents expecting every problem to be snowploughed out of their child's way preventing kids developing any kind of problem solving skills or resilience in the face of minor issues.
Excusing behaviour and not holding them to account with consequences.
Bullying staff.
Inability to say no so kids struggle when they meet someone who does (teachers).

Add to this, many more single parents who often have little support, financial or otherwise, many more acrimonious splits, where children are often used as weapons, blended families, which can work, but often don't.
I'm generalising massively but at a population level it is also an upwards trend.

Exactly

In my opinion, we are living very unnaturally now in so many areas and alike zoo animals we are expressing our unhappiness through many self destructive ways.

I dont think people became less tolerable of DC in public, I think more parents became entitled and supported by forums like MN, refused to do anything like try to take their DC outside to calm them or feel slightly awkward or embarrassed when their DC were disturbing everyone during a wedding, church service, school performance, cafe restaurant, museum or even in a theatre or cinema.

So people got less tolerant about DC in 'public spaces' because the parents didn't GAF about how their DCs behaviour was ruining everyone else's experience. It was their 'right' as parents to continue to access the things they wanted to despite having an antisocial tiny human with them, and their tiny antisocial human DC 'right' to access anything they're not legally excluded from.

Tiny humans are inherently antisocial btw. I'm not blaming them, I'm blaming their parents.

Same as the whole entitled dog owners thing. Most people didn't give a shit about dogs in public till they were expected to not complain about dogs behaving badly in the spaces they previously weren't in, or were behaving well in. Or just complaining about dogs behaviour in public became taboo since they're 'part of the family'.

For the last time, a diagnosis isn't enough to get any disability benefits!

I see a difference in kids I know.

The kids who have parents who chat to them from birth, whose parents are engaged and interested, whose parents don't deploy screens as a default way to entertain their kids, and whose parents don't spend all their free time on a screen generally seem to be more able and school ready than many of their peers. The kids who are allowed to fail (obviously in an age appropriate way!) seem to fare even better. This has nothing to do with income or education or class btw.

Obviously this is all anecdotal. A public enquiry feels like a step too far, but for sure we need to look at how society treats children and families.

My view is, as a society, we massively underestimate what children are capable of. That's not new - it's always happened - but when that's coupled with smaller families, the "professionalisation" of parenting (e.g. mummy bloggers, parenting 'experts', the idea you only have kids when you're totally ready etc.) and parental guilt about not being present enough it's a bit of a shitshow.

Parents feel that when they ARE around their kids, they need to be on their A game. So rather than the 70s/80s (and earlier) somewhat laissez-faire parenting of "they'll be fine, I've got some roses to manure, go and play in the shed" you have too many parents who constantly hover, feel they have to buy the latest gadgets, and who structure time to the Nth degree to ensure Junior is getting the utmost exposure to X.

The net result is kids who've never really been given the space to just be kids.

This isn't a criticism of parents btw - most people are trying their very best. It's a criticism of society. Shit pay and shit housing mean that parents who'd love to spend more time with their kids simply can't afford to while we simultaneously denigrate and underpay those who work in early years. It's a very sad state of affairs.

All that being said, most kids I know are great. And while there are real problems with not enough kids being school ready and with discipline, and the effect social media has on kids I maintain that the vast majority of children are doing well. I work with a lot of Gen Z and the way in which they advocate for themselves and their needs is impressive; I wish us Gen X and Millennials had been like that!

I actually don’t worry about that so much. When my son was at nursery - he had a key worker who was super engaged with him. She wasn’t allowed to be checked out on her phone - it was her job to plan interesting activities, chat to him, engage him.

If a child is in a consistent and well managed environment I think that is better than being at home with a permanently distracted parent.

I see parents in doctors waiting rooms and on the bus all the time - on their phones and only looking up to tell their child off or complain about their behaviour. I see women on the phone while holding their children’s hand on the walk too and from school - ignoring their children in the park because they’re engrossed in a digital world.

I get it. If’s the easiest way to make time for yourself when you’re feeling overwhelmed or touched out. But a lot of people seem to be really unable to manage themselves around it and I worry it’s really really damaging their children.

Exactly, I just don’t understand why everyone needs a label even if they’ve lived life perfectly without it. I know people in their 60 - 70 ‘s getting tested, it’s ridiculous. Apparently it’s become a money making business now diagnosing Autism etc, everyone wants a test, it’s a trend.
It’s ridiculous it makes those who genuinely need help pushed to the back of the queue, it seems as if parents somehow want to label their kids with something/anthing! The financial side of it definitely drives some people, as mentioned in other posts.

With their dad outside fixing a drone

Judgement from across the board then. 🙄

FYI, my child when a small toddler, would happily stim over picture books. 😆

I doubt screen time is causing autism or all speech delay. There have always been children with asd. You see them as adults and they weren't recognised as such. And there are links to older fathers, although this isn't nearly as well publicised as women ' leaving it too late'
But I do think screen time is related to generalised lack of concentration and poor behaviour. It is designed specifically to be addictive, and to ensure people have constant dopamine hits. That is bound to affect young children when they are taken off screens for school.

The existing extremely expensive covid enquiry needs to be asking this; but so far the rhetoric is still “we should have locked down harder and longer”. Yes, I know lockdown is only one thing that has harmed children’s development, but it was extremely obvious to many of us from the very beginning that months and months of school closures and blanket lockdowns were going to cause massive harm to children. Children were thrown under the bus to protect the older generation.

And some us tried to say this at the time, but we were told to shut up and stop murdering grannies.

My son barely got any screen time when he was a baby and toddler and he still got an early autism diagnosis.

When we started allowing tv, his speech developed because he's a GLP, now he's still not conversational, I couldn't say "what did you do at school today?" And get an answer, but he's extremely verbally adept, and when people work with him and his gestalts that he's picked up, you can see the cogs whirring and he learns how to use words in sentences outside of those gestalts.

I certainly don't think technology is the devil's work or that technology is the primary factor that some people believe it is.

No.

Things got worse with covid but it was happening for several years before.

I am autistic.
Autistic children didn't go into the Apple Store and buy iPads themselves. Those kind of electronics didn’t always exist and being autistic is no excuse for using an iPad as a child. They are drawn to screens because iPads and the like are designed to be addictive!! It is better to show them picture books or get your child to be doing things hands on. I think iPads are unhealthy and shouldn’t be used as a teacher or nanny