Schools insistence on uniform rules are behind the times

So why do they need to spend years at school in uniform to prepare for this? In Europe there are plenty of jobs requiring uniforms; strangely, it doesn't seem to present any problem whatsoever despite the fact that there is no tradition of uniform wearing in schools.

No need for blazers, or anything white so it can all go in one wash, but I approve of school uniforms in principle. I don’t think hoodies are a good plan either, would like them a little bit smart.

One of the problems is that the government makes no attempt to implement its own uniform guidance, which makes it clear that schools should not be opting for pointlessly expensive uniform or insisting that it be purchased from suppliers who will thus be able to load their prices. They really need to be brave enough to put legislation in place that actually enforces the guidance so that, for instance, funding for academies will be withdrawn and Ofsted will mark them down if they continue to insist on uniform that isn't widely available in generic shops.

In the meantime, it would also be good if the schools themselves reflect on the fact that ignoring government guidance isn't exactly setting a great example when it comes to complying with rules.

Yes - I agree. Teaching students to think for themselves, to be independent, be able to self-manage, work properly with others are values and skills that aren't taught by wearing the correct uniform.

Find another school is a pretty silly argument. For most people, catchments and distances mean they have very little choice of school if any. And most people don't have the choice of a non-uniform school even with other constraints removed since the vast majority of schools have uniforms.

I don’t know anyone outside school children who wears a nasty 4 pocket polyester blazer.

They’re archaic. And based on the times when men wore formal
attire to work. And those days have gone.No one wears them anymore unless they’re fashion based things.

Do 'they'? Not always, not in my experience. Look at the poor state of mental health of young people in the UK. Is wearing clothes that demonstrate conformity helping that?

The reality is, however, that "find another school" is often just not a viable option in many areas. So what should parents do in that event?

'intended to' - but there's no evidence it actually does. If you don't like it, find another school is a pretty poor attitude - say if it's the main secondary school in the area?

I have.

Of course they are capable of behaving properly with or without uniform - but compulsory strict rules allow school management to be very tough indeed on those who don't or won't comply. Wearing uniform is also intended to suppress individuality and to generate esprit de corps. As I said, the zero tolerance theory. If you don't like it, find another school!

I'm not opposed to the idea of uniforms but the strictness of many secondary school uniforms today is ridiculous. My DD's school are supposed to wear kilt-like skirts below mid-calf. I can't think of any reason for this (other than not distracting the boys but I can't see them putting that in writing) and can't think of any workplace with a similar dress code (convent maybe?). They get around it by saying the girls can wear trousers but as hardly any of them do it makes it challenging for those who don't want to stand out from the crowd. Blazers are restrictive and uncomfortable and don't even get me started on the rule that you can't remove then, even in blazing hot weather, unless the teacher gives permission.

It's also so expensive. When I was at school you wore a grey skirt from any shop, a grey jumper from any shop and a white shirt from any shop. Now the vast majority needs to come from expensive uniform providers, despite recent DfE guidelines.

But poverty must not be made more obvious than it has to be. Children who are poor are very much aware of the difference between themselves and better off children.They don't need to be publicly stigmatised.

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That was the case at DS's non-uniform school too. I've never seen anyone on here mention an non-uniform school where the DC were bothered about clothes.

Don't get me wrong, I would be happy with them 'looking like kids.' But there's always the insistence for them having to 'look smart' as to why they need to wear a tie and blazer. I'm just pointing out, it's not needed at all.

They.express themselves loudly, repeatedly,.and.cheekily all the time.

My primary school uniform was yellow and brown, secondary was burgundy and grey.
I used to go into 'Chelsea Girl' (it was the 80s) and look at the trendy black skirts / blue or green jumpers that were on sale and wish I went to a school with that colour uniform!

Oh sorry missed the sarcasm 😳

Why do kids need to look 'smart'?

But if course milord 😂

They don’t look smart. Children, especially, young children in Reception and KS1 should wear ties, collared shirts, polyester pants and blazers. It is even better if they get rid of their Peppa Pig and Paw Patrol backpacks, and carry briefcases. Then they will look even smarter.

My area of the USA doesn't have uniforms. Catholic schools do, and some urban and southern schools do -- it seems to be higher in areas with a lot of Black students. Usually there it's khaki trousers and a polo shirt so everyone looks like they work at Target, Catholic school uniforms are a bit more like English ones. A friend of mine in NZ was shocked to discover that in her area high school girls still wear calf length woolen kilts that cost over $200 each!

To be quite honest I don't think uniform makes any difference but it's an article of faith in countries that have it. I must say at the high school I could swear a substantial proportion of girls were wearing pyjamas to class when I was there.

If I understand you correctly, I think the uniforms actually discourage independent thought. Imo, it's far better for a child to be able to police their own behaviour and clothes. They're learning how to function in society, without a gun to their head so to speak. From what I've seen this far, it works very well. And seemingly no time wasted gawking at miniscule logos on shoes.

I agree as well. The over-policing of uniforming indicates a massive distrust of students, a ridiculous message that sartorial conformity in itself indicates discipline and in fact creates more distrust of the institution itself, and less 'buy in' because it's so overdone. Teenagers are sentient beings, not just biddable humanoids that need to be removed (eg detention) for not following the minutiae of rules that serve very little purpose other than to give school management the feel that they're exercising power.

@Blondieblueeyes I have dresses for the summer. My trust allows us to wear shorts with tunics. It makes my teeth itch. It looks dreadful and so unprofessional. I'm dying to start wearing the silver belt buckle I was given when I qualified, quite fancy a cape and a starched head dress as well.