To think Keir Starner is ignoring women and children’s rights?

Um really don’t think the labour party will give a shit about your vote as pretty much the entire country gives a shit about far more froth worthy issues than the two you’ve mentioned. Most can see the political football trans right have become and the vast majority aren’t privately educated. Many will welcome VAT on private fees.

You also clearly never in a million years would vote labour if this is all you deem as important come the next election. F*k the NHS, Brexit, dentistry, education, contracts for mates, arrogance, lockdown parties…… no what really matters is trans rights and private schooling VAT.😂😂😂😂🙄

ilovesooty
People believe what they want to believe

Indeed - there were 17 people there in total;
https://order-order.com/2022/05/16/starmer-revises-count-up-from-6-to-15-attendees-at-beergate/

Labour MP and Labour Mayor attended a party which took place before any of the Number 10 parties (event was 10 May 2020). People were supposed to join in from their own front gardens but it was raining;

https://www.thenorthernecho.co.uk/news/18484861.mp-kevan-jones-defends-decision-attend-100th-birthday-party-lockdown/

The thing is, I want to vote Labour but two things keep coming back to me - that quote "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.", and the old canard about Mussolini making the trains run on time.

The gender thing isn't just a difference of opinion, it's something deeply, deeply wrong and unfair. It's blatant lying and bullying. It's gaslighting women. It's an openly asymmetric application of "rights" and "respect".

And sure, you might think women having a political voice and legitimacy is nice and all but a bit airy fairy compared to the immediate practical needs of a country on its knees, but how do you know it'll stop with women?

When someone tells you who they are, believe them.

So the question I'm dealing with is not "can I vote for party that I think will improve the country even though I don't agree with all their policies?" - of course I can. No party will ever be 100% what I want them to be. It's "Is this thing so so rotten that ignoring it is like voting for the guy who's going to make the trains run on time?"

Jeremy Corbyn was photographed breaking Covid rules at least four times:

https://metro.co.uk/2020/10/02/jeremy-corbyn-wont-be-fined-for-breaking-rule-of-six-at-dinner-party-13360046/

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8849075/Now-Jeremy-Corbyn-breaks-rules-memorial.html

https://metro.co.uk/2020/12/29/jeremy-corbyn-broke-tier-four-rules-meeting-anti-lockdown-brother-13819885/

https://metro.co.uk/2021/02/26/jeremy-corbyn-seen-breaking-lockdown-rules-again-14149007/

Weird isn't it? It's almost as if the Tories haven't been in power for 14 years and done immeasurable damage in the process! Of course Labour won't turn it around overnight. Still, just as long as your taxes are kept nice and low, eh? And don't make me laugh about not knowing where millions is being spent. NHS test and trace app anyone? That worked well. For lining the pockets of Tory chums. This country is on its knees due to Tory social, political and financial mismanagement, and you have the audacity to challenge us to come back in 4 years and prove how Labour have turned things around??

I don't think they have a magic wand but they do have the will to spend money on public services rather than syphoning it off to their rich mates and shareholders.

This is what's happening now and why so much public money was squandered during COVID and is the reason our rivers are running with sewage

Still can't get over how disgusting that was.
Ban people from seeing elderly relatives whilst having parties 😡
If Labour had have done anything like the same you bet those parties would have been all over the press at the time.

It’s hysterical to think that some posters don’t think the Tories will have used their money, contacts and privilege to literally scour every possible place and source to find evidence of labour breaking the law to counteract their prime minister partying whilst people died and the MH of children (reported even for talking to friends outside)plummeted.

"The job's a game!"

Sounds about right

I think some think they've got a magic wand
Or maybe snap their fingers Mary Poppins style 😁

The last time Labour were in power waiting lists shrank markedly and there were 10s of thousands more nurses and doctors, so Labour, judging by experience give at least some hope of improvement.

@heartbroken40 is a Tory voter. She's made her choice. Not worth debating any of her points imo.

You think with the state of public services it's going to be possible to turn everything around in 3-4 years without increased public spending??

@CrappySack when Labour wins (I think it's inevitable) will you come back in 3-4 years and admit they've led this country to further ruin WITHOUT blaming the Tories? Intellectual honesty seems to only work one way. Looking forward to 2028 (I'm sure you'll blame the Tories when NHS waiting lists won't improve, the poor will be poorer etc etc. I'm only sure that taxes will increase but where the money goes will be anyone's guess)

@PoppingTomorrow Exactly. I'm so tired of women who exclusively care about gender issues claiming they do so because they care about women rights.

Absolute bullshit.

They care about gender. That's it.

If the gender issue wasn't there they'd vote Tory anyway even though the Tories have, just as one example, happily tolerated women being brutalised during childbirth.

Well if you've no evidence then I can't respond to it, can I?

They're not untouchable in my eyes but I cannot fathom how anyone can come to the conclusion that labour are "just as bad". If that's true the whole country is fucked.

Of course there will be corrupt Labour politicians - power corrupts, there are bad people and bad behaviours in all walks of life and politics is always going to attract at least its fair share. But I cannot reconcile the total lack of shame at their own behaviour, or compassion for the vulnerable, that this government has displayed.

I'm GC but can still see that saying TWAW is utterly pointless if there is no maternity care, no consequences for perpetrators of VAWG, no early years provision, no health or social care, and no worker's rights. Because women will get screwed over.

Maybe voters who are bleating about TWAW being their single issue actually want women to get screwed over so that TW self-select out of the gender- is that it?

Hypothetically, let's assume every single party had exactly the same views on gender, and they were views you vehemently disagreed with. Who would you vote for?

I suspect there's a fair chunk of people on this forum who say they're voting Tory because of "women's rights" (narrowed down to ONLY GC issues), who would've tribally voted Tory anyway irrespective. I also question how many of these people would be so concerned about women's rights if the gender issue didn't exist.

Like I noted upthread, the Tories have fucked women over so badly in so many areas. How anyone can claim to care about women's rights and vote Tory is totally beyond me.

If you vote Tory in the current state of affairs, it isn't because you 'care about women's rights', it's because you are simply a Tory supporter. I know it's uncomfortable being a loyal Tory supporter these days, but at least have the honesty to own it.

People believe what they want to believe, I suppose. If someone wants to vote for the Tories with their record clear for all to see that's their choice.

If someone lists their reasons for a vote then that’s their call, not pretence.

You list yours as do others.

Yes, louder for all those who still don't "get it" - women aren't all one hive mind!!

Several police investigations found no evidence so it's unlikely the poster will.

Who needs evidence when rhetoric is just as convincing.

https://www.ft.com/content/0832548c-3750-4500-82c2-455e6f92faa7