To consider leaving the Civil Service?

pension is a joke

Seriously??

I've been civil servant for 20 years. Should have left years ago. Pay on my grade is appalling and pension is a joke. But I'm comfortable, I've gone as high as I can but now stuck.
But worse than that, treatment from SM is shocking, the gaslighting is just so disrespectful.
Looking for new job, definitely.

I left for local authority, the pension was better when I left, as it was final salary but that’s stopped! I stayed just under two years. AA, AO, EO was coming up but I hated it. Had to work long hours, stay until 8pm once a month.

In that time:

One EO had a meltdown, screaming at staff, had to be calmed down by other team members.

Another was only interested in sleeping with as many staff as possible, if you didn’t you had shit shifts.

The clincher was sat there until 8 one night, three members of staff including me, listening to an EO talk about anal sex.

Worst job ever.

Nope, but it's one of the biggest ones!

I mean let's face it, it's not what it was is it? Budget cuts across the board. Pay freezes. Reduced perks. Limited promotion opportunities due to the recruitment freeze. If you can find something better, why wouldn't you!? AO wage is absolutely rubbish. In my experience they are the hardest working. My sister works in a proper corporate job. Decent pay, great bonuses, works from home pretty much exclusively, when she does go into the office they have a free bloody bar. Free private health care for her and her partner.

Gulp, where do you live? As someone with no dependents/home comityments, I would be doing anything to get myself out of there!

If you left and went onto an administrative/office manager/PA/EA role you'd be on a lot more.

London would be £35-£60k depending on the sector.

That sounds quite low paid. Unsure what department in, CS jobs in my area are also very low paid £22-26k being the average.
Local authorities seem to be higher paying if you did fancy a move. CS tried to sell me on the ' great pension ' but in my 30s I'm not really thinking too much about a pension and needed more cash and higher salary for the time being

I agree the 60% is nonsense. I think 40% is totally fine as there’s merit in spending time with colleagues, but 60% is punishing unless you have a short and easy commute.

The reason it’s so hard is that Covid lockdowns and everyone working from home created an “always on” culture that we didn’t have before. So now people expect 60% in the office plus logging on from home in the evening “as needed” (but it’s not needed really) - totally unmanageable if you have any sort of life outside work!

I’m a G7 now, and yes I’d like to go a bit further up the chain

Sorry I think there’s training on applications as well as interviews - plus mentoring is a good idea!

Keep applying for promotions! Also, does you dept have any interview training you could go on? There’s a knack to civil service interviews that you can learn.

The pension is worth more money wise than you think, so you have to factor that in to any decisions re taking a higher private sector salary.

That all said, nearly all CS jobs are very hard work, under paid compared to equivalent responsibility in private sector, and currently demoralising as the govt constantly tells us how awful we are. Plus you are begrudged the slightest “extra” like even tea and coffee whilst at work, and if you look at private sector roles there’s lots more looking after, expenses, paid for staff dos and outings, which can make a person feel appreciated. It’s hard not to feel like you’re begrudged a job in the CS sometimes!

That sounds to me like you could do with a bit of mentoring. Is there anyone in your department who might read your application form and give you some feedback?

I'd consider the Fast Stream and look for jobs in Corporate rather than front line. I've sifted and interviewed HEO and SEO roles quite a lot and it comes across that people just want out of their current job rather than actually want the job on offer.

Also if you enjoy Comms work look at the GCS cadre - really interesting and creative jobs across the CS and in my experience people climb quite quickly.

I get it OP, it’s crushing to put all that time into applications and then not even get interviews, but I wouldn’t leave the security of the CS when the economy is as it is. The CS is huge, there are so many opportunities, different types of jobs and departments. I’m really surprised about what you say about your colleagues - I’m surrounded by incredibly bright people who work their absolute socks off where I am in the CS, so I promise it’s not all bad!

You need to learn to play the game with applications though. I found the Interview Gold website invaluable for learning about what to put in a personal statement and as a starting point for writing competencies https://www.interviewgold.com/ and Jac Williams’ videos on YouTube for competencies. Once I’d learned what to do from there, I swallowed my pride and asked colleagues to look at examples and give feedback and eventually (after a lot of work) my applications are much better. I agree with PPs to look out for EOIs, both because the applications are usually shorter and because it can be a great way to gain experience both sideways and upwards.

I’d never advocate for staying in a role that makes you miserable, but I think that’s the beauty of the CS, you can stay within it and do something completely different.

I was trying to hold out for that possibility but couldn't do it. Our department is being super aggressive about it, it's destroying an already fragile morale.

I will probably have to do the same level of office attendance in my new role, but without the threats of dismissal if I only manage 55%.

Have you considered applying for a graduate training programme within the CS? TSP at HMRC for example?

I suspect once Labour comes in they’ll drop this whole thing as it seems more of a distraction for the pleasure of DM readers and a stealth way to cut the pesky civil service workforce.

That would make my role as leader a lot easier- a boost in morale. Fingers crossed!!

Thankfully I’ve been able to avoid it due to reasonable adjustments that were in place even pre-covid, but if in the future I have to go in for 60% it would cost me another £240 per month in travel so I’d probably find a better paid job be it hybrid or remote.

I suspect once Labour comes in they’ll drop this whole thing as it seems more of a distraction for the pleasure of DM readers and a stealth way to cut the pesky civil service workforce.

Why would you be burdening someone asking for help with applications? Sounds like your line manager isn’t up to much if they’re not coaching, developing you. At least reviewing your PS! Can you approach an HEO or SEO for help? I am happy enough in the CS but have a good team around me. There’s some really weak management out there and too many become managers with no skills.
I second what someone else said. The work can get easier in a way the higher up you rise. AO caseworker is not a great position.
If you got a 1 in your PS you’ve missed the brief in some way. Gone over your word count? Failed to provide what has been requested? Ask your LM who can help you. The answer should never be ‘nobody’.

Sorry if that sounded patronising - what I mean is, have faith in yourself, don't accept less than you deserve and keep trying, but make sure you learn from your setbacks

Best of luck

I'm a HEO in the Civil Service and the 60% attendance and poor pay has pushed me out.

If I was an under G7 I’d also leave if forced to do 60% attendance. It’s ridiculous

That makes sense, it’s fine to stay in that position for a short while as a way to enter the CS, but if you continue to be unsuccessful in applying for the higher grades then yeah I feel it’s time to consider leaving but I do agree with pp about applying for mentorships etc. You probably have all
the skills they want, but you’re just not filling out the application form in the exact way they want!

So there's something wrong with your approach - CV and application writing is a specific skill, it needs to b learned. Get someone who has recently em successful to look I've your application form before you submit

Seniors have a responsibility to support junior staff in their career development, so sign up to an official mentor scheme.

Honestly if you take up all th help available you will climb more easily and hopefully be able to pick and choose the right role for you