Cost of therapy

*@Choux Hmm I don't think it's quite the same as a friend. A friend would not sit and listen for two solid hours a week whilst you exclusively talk about yourself and not offer their own advice/opinion on the situation, or eventually direct the conversation to themselves or other subjects.

That's not how I view friendship anyway. Friendship is a two-way deal and there has to be lightness and fun as well.*

What I meant was, if he had friends to talk to about his problems and stress and worries and they also told him about their problems and stress and worries he would realise that everyone has some problems and stress and worries and that's completely normal and doesn't require 10 years of therapy.

Is he a perfectionist? If he knows himself very well and knows he isn't perfect then maybe he feels he needs to keep doing long term therapy to try and become perfect. He knows his wife very well so thinks she needs long term therapy to become perfect. He doesn't know other people to the same extent and, as they don't reveal their problems and stress and worries to him, he thinks they are perfect and he is therefore lagging behind.

Most counselling on NHS is limited to about 6 sessions so I doubt anyone suggesting this as a possibility has ever needed any long term MH care. The NHS MH provision was crap even before all the austerity years cuts.

Being married I guess it's all one finance pot if you divorce but perhaps if don't already it would feel fairer to have separate accounts so you have equal share of disposable income (post bills & agreed saving portion) then you needn't feel guilty if want to spend your share on what he see's as frivolous things and he will be more aware of what his counselling uses up which as he sounds a bit tight it may make him appreciate affordability of these 2x sessions more.

I've had long term counselling, it's one of few things that helps me manage in life and I work through past and present issues. It's not the same as talking to others as you can't be truly open when need to consider their feelings, possibility of being judged or privacy on what's discussed and they are trained not to let their own issues impact how deal with client, how to listen and respond to help. People also tend to find it draining and selfish if someone appears to need to offload too much or frequently and may offer unhelpful suggestions or thoughtless comments and may get empathy fatigue and avoidance of the relationship altogether.

I'd only have 2 x weekly sessions when in crisis. I have had to change therapists couple of times due to their circumstances and when this is planned they have series of sessions dedicated to managing the exit and possibly would recommend a replacement. If it was sudden guess he would be forced to find another counsellor and use them to help manage the change or get by on his own.

It may well be your right and his job is causing this unnecessary stress but people often struggle with change especially the longer they've worked somewhere so it's understandable they may have a 'better the devil you know' reluctance. Sometimes work is so intertwined with their own identity too.
You can encourage him to discuss options in more detail with therapist as they should be helping him think his way through the problems and work out why he feels the way he does so can make better decisions which should then help him to communicate reasoning to you.

I hate to suggest spending more but you may benefit from some couples counseling sessions just to help you sort through these concerns for the longer term and perhaps it would benefit him to interact with a different therapist.

It maybe worth him checking he isn't also neurodivergent I.e autism/ADHD as it's still overlooked especially in adults and poorly understood even by medical professionals. These can make life harder to manage and the depression/anxiety which gets diagnosed and doesn't ever fully resolve is actually symptom from coping. If they've found a suitable niche they can appear on surface to be successful so are even more likely to go unnoticed.

Or if not mates, what about looking into local initiatives such as Men in Sheds, The Proper Blokes Club, or MenWalkTalk? Meeting other men and discovering that there are other men out there who feel like he does, that he isn’t exceptional, learning that other men are finding ways to manage their feelings and focus on recovering, would be a lot less isolating than one-on-one talking without much perspective.

Reading all OPS updates, I'm going to be 'that person' and reiterate he's taking the piss and just getting an emotional gain from having undivided attention to offload to and be soothed by weekly or twice weekly.

DP sounds incredibly self-absorbed and his therapist seems to be enabling his dysfunction and zero improvement or moving forward.

The fact that OP is worried that without this expensive 'therapy', which seems to be doing nothing helpful, her DP will sink into a deeper depression and it would be her fault for suggesting he stop is a major red flag.

He's had the same therapist for 10 years? Or has he had several?

OPS most telling post was this.

"It all seems like one of those wishy washy 'the journey is the destination' type things but I am just a bit more practical and I want to see a solid outcome for the £7000 a year!"

It's not even being practical, it's just having some sense and realising a 'treatment' should have some tangible benefit.

Just to put across the view that this DH is not totally hopeless, depressed, passive, dependent and weak.

Actually, he holds down an "important" job and he earns most of the household money.

I agree with PP that this doesn't mean that finances are not joint, but this DH is providing financial independence for the household, despite his depression.

The OPs concern is not that they can't afford the therapy, just that they are not saving as much as she would like.

The way some posters talk about him it is as if he is a heroin addict, hollowed out by his addiction to therapy, drained of all agency, capacity, getting thinner and thinner as the addiction takes deeper hold.

Actually, he is creating wealth and providing.

I wonder what it is, that allows him to do that, even as someone with significant depression?

Let me see .... one thing is clear, it certainly can't be that absurd long term therapy relationship with a charlatan bent on lining his own pocket, for sure ...

I think the main thing he talks about is work stress, health issues and about childhood (but no extreme trauma) - it is psychodynamic therapy so that is all part of it. He talks to me about everything as well, and I really don't think there is any huge event I don't know about. I think he just values the space to offload and feel soothed.

It sounds like the therapist is doing what a friend would do. Listening to him and sympathizing. Has he got any mates who don't mind talking about feelings that he could go to the pub with? (Slightly light hearted reply but £7k a year buys a lot of beer and pub grub to talk about work stress)

He feels he needs it and it is helping, but I haven't seen any difference in him since he started going twice a week. He still gets just as depressed and seems to struggle just as much with life.

Is he on anti-depressants? If not he should see his GP. If he is on them already he should be going back to the GP to discuss changing dose, type of medication etc.

I also thought a therapist was to help with a particular issue and that, with the therapist's help, you change your mindset or develop coping mechanisms so you don't need the therapy forever. Out of interest what happens at Christmas or other times when the therapist is away or when you go on holiday? How does he cope then?

Oh I wasn't suggesting he try psychedelics.

Just that as you confirmed, he seems to think that this is part of his identity, that he is 'a depressed person' and possibly sees therapy as just necessary maintenance as a 'depressed person' but doesn't have any motivation, desire or maybe even hope to actually get better or recover in any way.

Which isn't helpful for him or you, and if his 10 years of therapy haven't helped him to improve in any way for at least 6 years despite him increasing sessions, it's not likely to help him going forward if he is so entrenched in that thinking.

It's worrying that he's so attached to this therapy and the therapist despite there being no real evidence it's helping him to move forward even slightly.

Sorry, OP, just read your clarification there he is the higher earner.

Could you get more work and keep your pay to even things up?

I don't think it matters that he earns more, certainly not from the POV of him then getting to decide how to spend things. You have joint finances so it should be a joint decision.

I would try to bring it up from the point of view that you're worried as you haven't noticed any improvement since he started the 2 sessions per week and how does he feel it's helping. It's not really a health need it it makes no difference compared to 1 session per week.

I don't think it's possible to resolve this by making it his/his therapist's problem. The situation may be pro- or anti-therapeutic or both at different times. It's impossible to tell. I say that as an integrative therapist with four years' experience in practice and in long-term therapy myself.

What I think you need to figure out is what you want and how you can get enough autonomy in this situation to make your own decisions and live the life you want.

That could be anything from splitting up with him to redrawing financial boundaries between you so your life is less impacted by his decisions. I find myself wondering (and apologies if I missed this info on the thread) whether he is the higher or lower earner?

There are a few different things going on here I think.

I think it's really for your DH to assess whether the therapy is helping him or not. And if it's a priority for him and he earns enough to afford it then I would agree that it's more important for him to spend his money on therapy than on takeaways. He has long term health conditions to manage and it doesn't seem unreasonable for him to have therapy forever if it helps him.

Although you don't feel you have seen any improvements these may just not be apparent to you but have made a difference to DH. What would he say? Also without the therapy perhaps he would have been much harder work to live with and have struggled more and maybe even lost his job or worse. Again, what would he say about this?

The next thing is the effect this has on you.
I think it's ok to question DH about the benefit he feels and what difference he thinks it would make to drop back to one session per week or to end the therapy. Perhaps he is unhealthily dependent on his therapist, it's a possibility. Maybe a change of therapists could be really helpful. Maybe though he doesn't want to make any changes to his therapy and also maybe he will never be any better emotionally than he is right now.

The last thing is for you to work out how you want to be in a relationship with him and where your own boundaries lie. Are you ok to continue like this forever with no improvement that is apparent to you and with a resulting lack of long term savings/short term takeaways? Many people in reality do decide to leave marriages when their partner has a long term health condition.

I agree. I'd be very interested in how this is addressed in this therapist 's supervision.

Honestly? If you’re not skint then I have NO idea why you’re not supporting your husband in this.

Sorry, but I think you sound mean ( and tight) and a bit like a brat, therapy isn’t really a nice to have luxury! He obviously requires is - do you really think saving for a holiday / car / rainy day, having a takeaway is more important than your husbands wellbeing?

edited to add : imagine if you had posted the reverse of this ‘my husband thinks I spend too much on my therapy and thinks we should save and have treats instead’ IMAGINE THE RAGE OF MN there would be LTB’s all over the shop!

A very black and white view. If you've read the OP's posts, it's clear that she thinks the world of her husband. And I don' think MN would be raging if the OP had posted the reverse.

OP never said that he shouldn't have therapy and has clearly supported him for many years.

She is absolutely allowed to question things if the situation is making her unhappy. It seems to be very one sided if her husband is merrily spending £7000 on something that helps him/makes him happy, but then makes her feel bad for wanting a takeaway.

This the downside of therapy - people tend to lose sight of others' feelings and it becomes all about the individual.

Yes I agree.

If it was meaning you couldn't pay the gas bill then fair enough. But would you really want savings rather than a DH getting support with his mental health?

@lanya It's hard living with other people's mental health conditions and I think, without meaning to be unkind, that sufferers can be very self centred and not see the impact that this has on those around them. I feel for you.

But the OP's DH doesn't want to end the relationship, so it would be down to the therapist to do this. I don't know enough about psychoanalysis to know how the ending normally works, but you're right in saying that it should be planned and worked towards.

I don't know. My DH obviously really rates him and the guy works for a larger organisation of fully qualified therapists. He has been working there for a long time and has all the relevant training and registrations and regular clients who also rate him. So he can't be that 'sus' really can he? I don't know.

My professional opinion is that, just like with any other profession, there are therapists out there who are working unethically and shouldn’t be in practice.

If his therapist isn’t a complete quack, once DH advised that he felt it was time to begin ending the patient-therapist relationship, they would spend a period of weeks doing a “handover” with him, encouraging him to use the resources he’s gained and the techniques he’s learned over the past decade to manage his emotions independently. They would arrange some less frequent sessions to check in and reinforce and reassure. They would provide him with contact details for if he genuinely felt he was spiralling yet encourage him to reflect on whether he needed this contact or whether he could manage himself. It wouldn’t (or shouldn’t) be a case of “well, goodbye, you’re entirely on your own now.”