To hate the vacuousness of some young girls nowadays?

I kind of agree but then that means you’re writing off a young person because they like/ enjoy appearance related hobbies (which is kind of what that is) and then that brings worthiness into it-it’s saying something someone enjoys is less worthwhile than the crafters/ readers/ sportspeople, which is horrible. My sons are all mad into gaming and at reunions/ meet ups/ on our WhatsApp groups listen to all the ‘isn’t such and such great, they just got onto x team/ they’ve just completed this race ‘ etc etc. People just look at them like ‘oh ok so you stare at a screen’ when I say they’re amazing at their gaming/ creating content etc. I think they feel like the black sheep because they’re not playing county football/ rugby etc etc but their passion is gaming and they’re great at it (even though we do have to sometimes brace ourselves against them wanting more screen times as they can be addicted)

When I was their age I was mad into make up but also an avid reader which relatives thought was great. Started writing rom coms and the amount of times I’ve had to jokingly stand up for the fact I don’t write literary fiction. Sometimes you’ve got to let people enjoy what they enjoy!!

Saying that, as with ALL teens- sporty/ gamers/ make up fiends- I think as said above they do still need to be patented and reminded of the other pleasures out there, even bribed into board game nights, hikes etc

I am very cautious regarding the use of social media and smart phone for young children. I personally limit and control these strictly for my teenagers, the youngest is just 13 and has only been allowed to use Instagram for example. TicToc is banned. The oldest is 16 and has now more or less free rein but I still remind him to take breaks from screen use. That's just part of parenting.

But OP isn't really talking about this though, she's being unpleasant and snobbish about young girls who are caught up in what is their social context and who are, to all intends and purposes, doing the best they can. If anything they are victims but OP isn't complaining about the tech industry, she chooses to belittle kids who are only finding their way in this weird world that their elders have created.

I'm wondering if OP's daughter, if she has one, is much too refined for such superficial frivolousness and as a result feels unable to bond with her peer group. This would explain why the tone of this thread is so judgmental and bitter.

I'm almost 40.

I dyed my hair, wore ridiculous amounts of makeup, followed all the trends and fads, wore skirts that were stupidly small.

I certainly wasn't vacuous.

Meh when I was 12 I was into blue mascara, ra-ra skirts, backcombing and enough hairspray to single handedly kill off the ozone. Body shop dewberry, Heather shimmer etc etc. it’s just fashion and prices that have changed.

one of my dds was full on fake tan, false eyelashes, sharpie eyebrows and bum hanger shorts. Now at uni studying nursing. Not vacuous, just teenage

My daughter was very into make up brands, short skirts, fake tan and hair products since being 12. She also got all 8s and 9s at GCSE, 3 A* in her science and maths A levels, secured a place at a top University, spent a gap year in Italy working, volunteers at a primary school and works as a climbing instructor in her holidays. Now she is 20 she still wears fake tan and hair extensions and buys tons of clothes and she looks beautiful but is anything but vacuous.

I think a lot of people are choosing to ignore the new level of narcissism we see right across the board. It’s not the same as liking Charlie perfume (1970s).

As my name suggests, I am of a certain vintage. When I was 12, 3, 14 and 15 I was pretty vacuous. Rolling up the waistband of my school skirt once I was out of sight of the house until I had a proper mini. Treated Jackie magazine and everything it said as gospel. Could only talk about Davy Jones, David Cassidy et al, hardly opened a book which wasn't a text book. And now, decades later, here I am with a first class honours in English Literature, a distinguished career in the media, and a library of classics and popular modern books which I read and re-read. I'm still madly interested in beauty and style though. So, perhaps let the young teenagers be young teenagers, you really don't know what the future holds for them.

I have a DSD of this age and it's a nightmare. She's such a lovely kid - well mannered, polite, funny - but the obsession with TikTok and make up / beauty is just unreal.

The problem we have is that her mum is very into all of that so often takes her to get her nails done, eyelashes extended, fake tan etc. We're the complete opposite but only have her half the time. We try to get her away from it all (as much as possible!), get her outdoors, walking the dogs but then she goes back to her mums and it all starts again!

I don't mind her using my (expensive!) beauty products (moisturiser, cleanser etc) if she wants to, I let her do some face masks and anything that should "help" your skin. It's the ridiculous fake everything that gets on our nerves.

Some vacuous nostalgia, since I've been enjoying it so much! Honey,19 and Petticoat magazines from 1970-ish.

The average full-time wage in 1970 was £13 19s 10d a week for women aged 18 years and over. My Saturday job paid £1 1s if I recall correctly. Clothes were a hell of a lot more expensive, proportional to wages.

Magazine resources:
https://lizeggleston.com/
https://elegantlypapered.com/

It's bad parenting. If you're encouraging or even allowing your 12 year old to put expensive chemicals on their skin, that's on you.

But I wouldn't say these kids are vacuous. At that age their minds, bodies and social dynamics are changing by the day and extremely confusing, it's no wonder that they try and latch on to something physical like make up that will help them blend in and seem "normal". Plenty of time to work through this stage and emerge as well rounded young women.

The fake glued on eyelashes are everywhere!
As long as the girls are not pressured, painting themselves up as a result of low self esteem, bullying etc and as long as the beautification is not all consuming and snobby, brand based images for social media then it could be just fun and they will grow out of it.
Kids have a lot of external influences now.

Not the children’s fault.

The adult is allowing unfettered access to the internet.

The adult is allowing the child to buy the advertised brands or is buying the advertised brands as gifts.

Make sure you are looking in the right place. It goes government ➡️ tech company ➡️ business ➡️ parent ➡️ child.

I was into Anne French make up remover, niven and shampoos that made my hair smell nice when I was a teen. We didn't have access to Korean beauty products etc that cost a fortune.

I worked from 16yo part time throughout school and uni until I was done with education and could get a full time job. I learnt the value of money from this. Do the younger generation do the same or do we as their parents give them everything because we didn't get everything?

Our children need to learn supported indepence. They should earn their spends and as soon as they can, get a part time job and manage their own money - no debt or credit cards obvs.

When they can afford it they can buy whatever beauty products they want.

Social media has a lot to answer for....

You can do all of that, we had and have many conversations about these things. And I am very circumspect about what I spend my own money on for my daughter. But many, perhaps most girls of 12 and 13, unless they are part of a very distinct sub-group who are the opposite extreme (they'd be known as Emos here - and they have their own challenges) at least tinker at the edges of everything described here. I think you have to pick your battles, aim for some sort of balance and put the quality of the relationship above very understandable misgivings about all of this. In other words, try and focus on the foundations and not worry too much if the house is painted a hideous orange. I have very strong feelings on all of this, I bought The Beauty Myth in hardback when it came out, but on the long and winding road of life, sometimes being your own person involves breaking away from parental norms and being like ones peers. To quote Clair in Derry Girls, "I can't be an individual on my own".

I find it interesting to theorize that this 'pressure' is attributed to social media. However, it is clear that this is a misconception because there have always been societal trends to follow. These trends are created by us and then become established in various communities.
I certainly believe becoming self-aware exacerbates these trends during the teenage years. Some grow out of it and this then becomes of less importance personally some however quite like the popularity contest and fitting in.

My make-up obsessed 12 year old has turned into a fake-tanned, make-up wearing, extremely hard working, poised and confident young woman, rocking her university course and holding down a demanding part time job.
Im sure older women in Neolithic times were whinging about the amount of wode their teens wore.. and the length of their furs.

I agree . I say teach your kids to be their own person and that social media is mostly there to sell things and it’s all fake . I was nothing like that at 12 , I honestly hope neither of my daughters is ( 9 and 3 now ) . There is no way I’m financing fake tan and false lashes to help sexualise 13 year olds

There was a good piece about young girls and the dangers of copying tiktok face cleansing/moisturising regimes, especially with ingredients containing retinol. It was on the BBC1 programme thos morning after 9. Dr Rang was basically saying young girls don't need all this on their skins but mums were saying how their daughters see it all on tiktok and want to emulate what they see.

Its so sad.

What's with adults obsessing over skirt lengths? Try thinking about something a bit more meaningful.

I was in my teens in the seventies. 'Fancied' boys from about 12 and bought bright blue eye shadow and garish pink nail varnish from the make up counter in Woolworths with my pocket money. Hitching skirts up on the way into school was definitely a thing then. Nothing new under the sun, just it wasn't on social media then!

YABU it’s always been like this, minus tic toc.

I remember begging my parents for moon boots and butterfly clips. We were all clones

I’m in my 30s and loving makeup and fashion from age 12/13 is nothing new really. I don’t remember so much emphasis on expensive brands though. Ugg boots were a big thing but literally nobody in my year group had the real thing just the nasty fake ones that make you walk funny 😂

Now it seems very much the norm to have the expensive brands, virtually every child walking out of the local secondary school has a North Face coat when it’s cold. My nieces and cousins all have expensive branded trainers and clothing. There definitely seems to be more pressure and expense concerning brands, but maybe that’s just a fashion that will change again 🤷‍♀️

I'm sure the boys are into current affairs and astrophysics.

My mother didn't allow me to wear makeup when I was 13. And coming from a country as hot as I do, she still wouldn't let me wear shorts to go high school, W
When all the girls did it.
Good times😁

couldn't agree more!

Let the girls obsess - puberty is all about being self obsessed.

Just make sure to take them outside to run up hills, and go camping once in a while....

Stop having a go at them.

I promise you, you were like it once!