How the erosion of LGBT rights effects female sex based rights.

So again you're not going to answer any of my questions and you'll defend "feminists" costing up to right wing groups. Not commenting on right wing anti abortion senator's using your words is.costing up as far as I'm concerned. It certainly means you're happy to abandon your principles in pursuit of one issue.

I didn't equate them at all. I'm saying many prominent GC feminists focus solely on sex based rights to the point they end up agreeing with people who are vocally and publicly anti trans rights, anti LGBT and anti women or if they don't agree with them they're still happy to court them. I have seen numerous posters on MN supportive of trans people not having the same right to bodily autonomy that we should all have. I'm not saying you think that, but it is there. And the ignorance is those women supporting attacks on bodily autonomy when they don't even have it enshrined in law themselves.

I was actually initially talking about Helen Joyce but thank you for mentioning so many other names that either court right wing groups or support abusers..

@needatalk

You are aware that LGB rights are sex based rights?

And that they are being impinged upon by TQ+ (gender identity) rights?

Yes i thought so

one poster says JKR posts transphobic tweets

another says where?

and the original poster says here you go, heres the tweets

isnt that how its supposed to work?

plus isnt that ‘1 million if you can prove JKR is transphobic’ thing still going ? I’d be right on that if I were you Lampy

In the US, voters have a choice between the party which knows what a woman is and doesn't believe they should have the right to an abortion or paid maternity leave, and the party which believes uterus owners should have the right to those things but otherwise denies that such a group exists or is entitled to a word for itself or any single sex spaces or services.

This is why feminism in the US has failed.

Thankfully we don't live in the US.

20 years ago, there was already significant anti EU sentiment and tabloids were filled with stories about wacky EU laws about bendy bananas etc. There is no comparable public or media support here for banning abortion. The US is very different because their politics is far more dominated by Christian beliefs than ours will ever be.

Given that Nigel Farage, a hugely popular politician, failed to get elected to parliament seven times, I'm not too worried about this group I've never even heard of gaining power.

Please email your MP and let them know you want and expect them to vote for decriminalisation.

20 years ago I would have agreed with this, but in a post Boris/Brexit/Trump society, I would say never say never.

"Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay? Do you not think she could use her financial clout to help women in other ways than using it to attack trans people?"
Well what about Lumos trying to keep "orphans" with their birth families/communities. Or funding a women's only refuge in Scotland.
I haven't seen her using money much to attack trans, just to defend her and others rights to free speech. And mainly that is by being brave, and having the financial ability to engage top lawyers.

I think I'm going to go and read a Eurovision thread. Obviously I'm in league with WRONGTHINK.

But can you post anything anti-trans she's said?

Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay?

Ah you've blown it now, Lampy. And it was all going so well for you on here ...

I mean I was just coming round to the wonderful argument 'if Liz Truss is wrong then women are wrong and you are wrong and men are right on everything', oh and of course then I was going to (quote) 'LMAO' in a Socratic froth.

Another one who can't counter any points or answer any questions then.

Is asking you to post these anti-trans tweets not countering a point?

So you are doing the 'if you agree with anything a right wing person says, you're in bed with the right' thing? I think GC campaigners are busy being GC campaigners, not making comment on other people's views on other issues. People are allowed to agree with each other on some things, and disagree on others. That's normal. Purity spirals don't generally lead anywhere useful.

You seem to have equated wanting women's sex based rights, with 'denying right to trans people ' or 'attacking' transpeople. Transpeople have the same rights are everyone else, but they, like everyone else, don't have the right to try to force others to believe what the believe. Me saying I don't believe what you do, is not me attacking you. Plurality of views is allowed, in a democracy.

I still don't know who this 'fave' is who supports men who abuse women. JKR? Maya Forstater? Kathleen Stock? KJK? Helen Joyce? No idea.

All your points were nonsense though. Those tweets?

What rights do you think trans people are being denied?

I've heard this statement made many times and it's always by people who do not seem to understand what the debate is about.

Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the EA 2010. You do not need to have a GRC or any medical intervention to be protected from discrimination by this law.

In contrast a trans person can apply for a GRC and be given a new birth certificate which aligns with their identity. Who else in society can legally obtain a fabricated birth certificate?

OP I think you are missing the main reason that the religious right is gaining traction, it's a backlash against accusations of bigotry against anyone who understands the material reality of biological sex, thinks single sex spaces are important and that children should not receive experimental medical treatment which has lifelong consequences.

The gaslighting and bullying by trans activists has done the recruiting for the religious right, which I agree may have long term consequences for women and anyone LGB.

Another one who can't counter any points or answer any questions then. Such an interesting contribution for everyone. Thank you!

Aye, sure you were 😂

I've never seen JKR post an anti trans tweet but I'm sure you'll point us to them. Or do they go to another school too?

Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay? Do you not think she could use her financial clout to help women in other ways

Like this?
https://philanthropicpeople.com/profiles/j-k-rowling/

Lmao no I wasn't actually but thanks for bringing up another one who is supported by right wing groups. I was not mentioning names because tbh there's too many to pick from so it's interesting to see who people name for themselves.

Speaking of JKR do you applaud her for supporting abusers? How many anti trans tweets doe she have to write to make that okay? Do you not think she could use her financial clout to help women in other ways than using it to attack trans people? Not even using her words to denounce support for example from right wing senators who don't believe in abortion who quote her publicly? Is she using her platform consistently to call for full decriminalisation of abortion for example? More than she's using it to argue with random trans people online?

Do you think there is no risk to people not publicly and loudly critiquing the actions of the right wing who are attacking women's rights? There are prominent GC campaigners who do not do this because they know that right wingers are boosting their tweets and posts online and they don't want to alienate them -yet.

You're talking about Kellie-Jay Keen-Minshull aren't you?

Why can't you just say it? She's not fucking Beetlejuice.

Yes, gender critical views cross political lines. I disagree with many of KJK's views outside the basic fact that men can't become women.

I also don't completely align with Julie Bindel, another prominent gender critical person who can hardly be accused of trying to erode women's reproductive rights.

I also don't completely align with JK Rowling, as much as I applaud her speaking out for women and using her considerable financial clout to to do amazing things.

Your forced-teaming game is poor.

Do the vocal prominent GC campaigners loudly and unequivocally criticise the right wing parties attacks on LGBT people and women's bodily autonomy when they express support for these GC campaigners? No in fact you rarely see some of the GC feminists using their large platforms for anything other than anti trans stuff so no suprise they don't get around to highlighting the dangers of right wing groups and their attacks on women's bodily autonomy. Are there not numerous GC posters on here posting their support for the Tory party regardless of how deadly they have been for women in this country and encouraging people to vote for them because they agree with them when it comes to denying rights to trans people? The same MPs who won't decriminalise abortion are being praised and voted for by "feminists" because they publicly attack trans people.
I think you know exactly who your GC fave is and I don't think anyone should be a celebrated "feminist" when they support men known to abuse women.

I'm sticking with my opinion that 'LGBT' is a construct.

And there you have it. Three women who believe in sex, not gender. This is a bad faith thread.

The actions being taken against women right now are removing sex based rights and language, including the rights of lesbians to be same sex attracted.
Its indefensible. Its not inclusive, its not kind and its not progressive.