Do Italians hate the English or is it the language barrier?

This is the polar opposite of my experience of holidays in Italy! Both times we've been, DP and I have actually remarked upon how nice and helpful and friendly everyone's been, even when there's a language barrier. So much so that I'm now having Italian lessons because I want to learn the language properly.

@SoreFeets

What are we doing wrong!? I’m autistic so I do struggle with eye contact and I’ve read Italians like eye contact so that is something I’m working on … any other suggestions would be appreciated.

Perhaps your husband could make a bit of effort and also learn a few useful Italian phrases, instead of leaving it up to you? That would be supportive of you too, especially given your autism?

Also maybe those Italians who you've perceived as rude still don't forgive because of Brexit? 🌹

I think the stereotypes about English tourists are pretty outdated. Depending on the type of resort (I am only talking about family-focussed resorts here - I’ve not been to any ‘lads abroad’ type resorts) the English tourists at their worst might have sunburn, leg tattoos, be out of shape from a bad diet, be a bit sozzled and be a bit loud, but there is a warmth caringness and consideration for others.

I have always felt anxious about how I’m perceived as an English tourist, but the really obnoxious people who stake their claim for some ‘territory’ using their towels, seem scary and hostile and so on, never are from the UK in my experience. English people are much more likely to say “sorry am I in your way?”, “After you”, or ask “Are you okay love?” - that sort of thing.

Even though football hooliganism is seen as having English origins, it’s spread to other nationalities. Even the stereotypes about Germans with their towels on the Sun loungers is no longer true. When I was in Greece, the staff were afraid to remove towels according to their policy because a Polish guest had beaten up an attendant over it in the recent past- they were much more afraid of men from Eastern Europe.

Rather than ‘everyone hates the English’ because there is something wrong with us, it’s more ‘everyone bashes the English because they are an easy target and they’ll probably still apologise when they’ve done nothing wrong’. It’s getting really old.

OP - Thank you for this post. It echoes my experience.

A few years back, we visited Rome then drove to Sorrento, stopping at various other places on the Amalfi coast. Enjoyed Rome and Amalfi is stunning but we were taken aback by how frankly unfriendly and rude everyone was. NOT the 'bellissimo' welcome we were expecting. At. All.

Not sure why it's like that - it would be very unreasonable if it was a language thing. Who really learns a language to visit somewhere for two weeks?

It’s probably just bad luck OP, there are nice people and rude people everywhere, just the luck of the draw who you encounter. I have to say mostly people were lovely when we went to Italy but DD was a cute baby back then and we couldn’t move for Italian admirers wanting to chat with her 😂

They do hate it if you order a cappuccino anytime after 10am. They see it as a breakfast drink.

@Kyokyo
People in the Liguria tourist industry are famous for their bad attitude. As you say, like the Cornish. Even the locals are embarrassed.
A few years ago there was a comedy sketch about them. “What’s on the menu today, please?” “A kick up the bum or rice pie. And we’re all out of rice pie!”

As an anecdote, on my recent trip to Helsinki, I twice came across a situation where the customer service person didn’t speak the native finnish at all. All convo had to be in english.

Unfortunately decent travellers get lumped in with the general view, and the nly way to show you aren't 'Typically English' is by learning a bit of the language , enough to order in a cafe or restaurant and exchange pleasantries, and observe other customs.

You can be a decent traveller even if you don’t speak the language.
It also takes quite a bit of time and dedication to learn a language to a level where you can “exchange pleasantries”. For most it is just not realistic. And I say this as someone who’s not a native English speaker.

Do mumsnetters really learn conversational spanish/french/croatian/greek/arabic/dutch etc when they are off to their one week holiday? Don’t think so.

Just came back from Italy (Cinque Terre to be exact) and had a similar experience too. We tried to say a few basic things in italian (e.g. ordering coffees, saying thank you), were always polite in resturants and always tipped, but its like as soon as they knew we were English they were annoyed! Although I did notice that other tourists (noticibly french) would converse in English too.

I do wonder if this is specific to areas though as we have visited Italy twice before and don't remember it being like this.

All the towns of the cinque terre were very small and extremely touristy, so I can imagine locals finding the crowds annoying and it must be frustaiting living somewhere beautiful that is overrun by tourists for half the year ? I actually felt a bit bad going there.

I wonder if cities are more tolerant of tourists because they are used to it being busy all the time ? for example I have lived in two popular tourist cities and its so busy that tourists aren't necesarily an issue and even if they weren't there, it would still be packed so what difference does it make ?

I guess its sort of similar to how cornwall doesn't appreciate becoming a hot-spot during the summer and losing local homes that are turned into private holiday rentals.

I’m amused at people thinking the rudeness is maybe because OP was skimpily dressed or they had tattoos Half the Italians dress very skimpily and are covered in tattoos.

I’ve travelled all over Italy and have always received good service. Even in August in Lake Garda. Sometimes maybe bit abrupt but this happens everywhere.

I can only say Ciao and grazie mille but this has never been a problem at all, no-one has ever been rude because of it. And before anyone starts, I already speak another language English being my 2nd learnt language. I always have my best intentions to learn italian too but so far haven’t got round to it!

30+ years in Italy here, living in several tourist places.

I’m so surprised ALL the staff speak German.
As a PP said it’s very much in the minority. All Italian students study English right through school. Maybe 1 in 10 learn it as their second MFL. The only place I’ve heard it spoken fluently by staff was in Grado, a historical spot for Austrian tourism. Even in the Rimini area they speak to German tourists in English. Same for Lake Garda IME.

On the whole Italy is very Anglophile. They recognize we have a similar level of population, class and culture. They were dismayed at Brexit and I often hear “If the British can do it, why can’t we?” about free motorways, social benefits or the NHS.

Some areas have simply had enough of mass tourism. Take Venice as an example. Cruise passengers come for a day, have their photo taken for social media, make life difficult for the locals and spend relatively little so why not fleece them when they DO stop for a coffee? €30 for two sit-down cappuccinos at Florian is not unheard of. And now there’s the Venice tourist entry tax. Good for them.

Some areas have 4 months of Summer trade to see them through the year, so the staff is short contract and the owners have to cover the rest of the year with the Summer profits.
So have a thought for the overworked waiter/receptionist/shopkeeper who might not have time for a leisurely chat with you.

I agree that knowing “good morning/evening, please, thank you” are a nice touch and will endear you to an Italian. But not “Ciao”, that’s like saying “Alright, mate?” to a lady shop owner!

One thing for the OP. Did you sit down at a table without being seated by the staff? That’s one way to get on their nerves and ensure they serve you slowly or even ignore you!

Ordering a latte after breakfast of the wrong wine with food. Italians are very passionate about food and drink.

Ive always had great reception from Italians. Lovely people.

Honestly I’ve never found this. Were you in super touristy spots perhaps? Did they think you were American?

They have a saying down there along the lines of it is not officially summer until the first brit has plummeted from a balcony. How many Germans or Swiss do the same? None

Look up German Ballerman culture.

Interestingly we got chatting ( in English) to a restaurant manager and he said a lot of Italians envied Britain in securing Brexit 🤣

I'm sorry to say that I had the same experience, while holidaying in southern Italy. I had been learning Italian on Duolingo and was trying to use it, greeting shop keepers politely on entering the shop, always smiled, was suitably dressed etc and it really took me by surprise because I was expecting Italians to be warm and friendly (which has always been my experience in Spain). It wasn't all the Italians I met, or even most of them, but it happened often enough to be quite noticeable and I do wonder what was behind it.

We were in Italy last month and no-one was rude, in fact most people were very friendly. None of us speak Italian beyond a few basic polite words i.e. Good morning, please, thank you (which we did use). I think you might have been unlucky.

Argghh, just read that back are universally disliked......are Australians, Americans.

i can’t speak a word of Italian and always been treated well in Italy. Maybe you have had just a lot of bad luck, not sure! Italy is my favourite country, I find them much friendlier than the French when on holiday

I spent a lot of time in Italy and the most frustrating thing for me was trying to learn Italian by speaking it, and then everyone just wanted to practice their English. We had the weird situation of each speaking each other's languages, and correcting as you go along, by the end of the day you are exhausted! I did help though tbf.

Now I do much the same. My speech is very rusty, but my understanding is excellent. Very useful when waiters are gossiping assuming you don't understand, and then are contrite when they realise.

In general, 99.9% of the time, Italians are polite, helpful, and make every effort to make holidays relaxed and enjoyable. The hotel where we go now has visitors from all over the world. The ones that are not universally disliked are the Russians, they've gone now, and the Australians and Americans, who are generally loud and obnoxious, and entitled.

True. The French aren't exactly known for their patience or their love of the English!

I learned French in school - up to AS Level. I got an A at GCSE. Went to France with a friend that very year. Couldn't speak a word! I spent far too much time trying not to get it 'wrong' in the school sense that I just clammed up.

At AS they threw us straight in the deep end - teaching the lessons fully in French and I was so out of my depth I stopped going to class at all after just a few weeks as I had no idea what she was saying. I still somehow managed a C grade, which shows what a joke learning languages at school in the UK is.

It's definitely something to do with the way you look or act.

I've been all over Italy many times and I haven't bothered to learn anything beyond "ciao" and I've never had an experience like yours.

If anything, on the very few occasions we've had an Italian speaker in the friendship/family group, the people we've encountered have been surprised that one of us speaks fluently, but doesn't seem to be happy/interested/show any other emotion beyond that.

Typically people smile when a foreigner speaks a few words of Italian to them because the person speaking is like a puppy and clearly trying so hard to get it right and they're trying to be encouraging. Same is true in pretty much any country.

They are not mortally offended if you don't speak Italian. Just like you wouldn't be offended here if someone didn't speak English, even though it's one of the most widely spoken languages.

If you're getting receipts thrown back at you and people annoyed when you give them money, maybe you aren't tipping enough. But I would guess more it's something about how you look/act as it seems to be more far-ranging than that.

Tbf, I think this is very individual whether people ard charmed or not.
I have family in France and have visited somany times I can't remember how many, mainly Brittany, central but also Paris and the alps too.
I've found most people are friendly and humour my not particularly good French but occasionally you meet a real stinker. I thought I was holding my own quite well when chatting to madame who we were staying with but she wasn't impressed by my French and demanded to know why it wasn't better and had I not learned French at school 😳

I told her, in French, that it was 30 years since I'd done French at school and she should cut me some slack 😂

I feel like a lot of other countries don't do the fake smile thing that we do in the UK/US. If they smile it's genuine. Obv a generalisation but one I do believe has some truth.