To think sportswomen shouldn’t have to forfeit competitions because male fckers are stealing their places?

10 years ago it would have been entirely uncontroversial to say women deserved their own category and men infiltrating that are cheats. What the hell happened?

Just to summarise the link I've posted above - in relation to darts, a woman performing the same movements will need to make more physical effort for each throw, which over the course of a game (which are long) is going to have an impact, putting them at physical disadvantage and at increased risk of injury.

This is where the 'transwomen are women!' brigade gets you. And there are plenty on here. Surprised the usual suspects haven't popped up.

Thanks - I probably have it wrong as it was a friend's kid competing who was a girl and the winner was apparently trans girl in a girls league (I'm not horsey!).

Do the sports clubs not ever think adding more options would increase interest? I bet the Trans community would be a supportive one if they had their own leagues. It can't be worth putting off athletes that clubs have trained all of their lives.

Perhaps it's time to get the Terminator out to do track and field events against the lads at the Olympics?

Interesting study here looking at increased risk of Muscoskeletal damage to women v men - I think it's relevant to darts.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4589903/

The higher prevalence of neck/shoulder WMSD in women can generally be attributed either to sex differences related to anthropometry and strength, or in aspects related to motor control 11] . The anthropometry and strength differences have been well described before. For example, it has been shown that men have a higher muscle strength and aerobic capacity 12] , exert more torque, work and power during functional work tasks 13] , and produce less effort and muscle contraction for the same task 14] , as compared to women. Specifically in the neck/shoulder region, it has been shown that women have weaker and smaller necks compared to men of similar height 15] , have a lower strength and 45 % less muscle cross-sectional area in the biceps brachii 16] and have a different shape and anatomy of glenoid fossa

Dressage (and other equestrian sports) are very rarely, if ever, split by male/female... it's one of the few sports where men and women are able to compete against each other on a level playing field, as it were

This is happening increasingly - two I heard of recently were junior fencing and dressage.

I still think the solution, much like the loos, is to have 3 options, or 4 if Trans Women don't want to be confused with Trans Men. Increase the options and spaces, not reduce and certainly not force the target group to withdraw to make a valid point clear to people refusing to listen.

There's already a word for that. Woman. It doesn't need any prefix. A man in a dress is a Trans Woman, regardless of whatever he says he is.

A proper woman is just that. Not a bloke with a dress on saying that he is a woman.

Like I already said in my first post

blokes should not be competing in female events

If I could type it in a massive font, you might not miss it then.

I wonder how men would feel about losing their category? Would they not mind , as they would still win, or would they mind?

But anyway, the trans identified males would not like it, because apparently when women lose and lose out on places women should not mind as it happens to so few of them. But when a (trans identified) male loses to other males, this is awful, just awful, and unfair and discrimination and some sort of sport genocide against trans people.

Trans identified men don't want an open category as they will never win. Just like most trans identified females stay in the women's category.

I can't see any reason why a proper woman cannot go on to beat the best man in the world.

What the hell is a "proper" woman?

I don’t think men should be able to enter women’s competitions even when there isn’t a competitive advantage. That isn’t the only thing that matters. They exist to give women equal access, and somewhere out there is female darts player who didn’t get a place in this tournament because that entitled bloke took it.

Can't vote because I'm on the app but you are definitely definitely NBU. I gather that the darts authorities were originally going to safeguard women's competition but then the TRAs threatened to sue, so of course all women are sacrificed. About time the women players sued them for every penny they have. Data sounds like an incredible woman - I hope she does.

I guess it shows how hard it is to maintain a die hard genderist position in the face of reality. But you are right, we should be happy it is only 3% when shit has been so crazy for so long

🤣

Actually I'm surprised it's not more. I imagine 3% would cover the stubborn contrarians on MN before you even get to the die hard genderists.

Why should women have to play against the men?

The men's game is also the open version so there is nothing stopping any woman if she wants to play against the men.

I need the 3% to explain their reasoning

Tell me why women need to include men in their sport.

There is a category for males. If males are properly inclusive and accepting they will welcome ALL men, even the ones who say they have that womanly essence. No? What, are the men... transphobic??

Exactly! There’s no separation by sex in equestrian sports because it’s not required.

I agree and think along the lines of a previous poster, there should be 3 classes of sport: Men, Women, Open. Those who want to compete with the opposite sex may (ala Billy Jean King & Bobby Riggs) and those who identify with another sex than they were born to also may. If its really that big a problem, there will be more than enough participants and if not, still an option for them and they may race, lift, swim, etc against the clock if no others participating.

If sports are segregated by sex, then men shouldn't compete against women.

Eh? It's darts. The only sport I can think of where the participants supped pints of beer and smoked cigarettes whilst playing (back in the 80s, of course). Jocky Wilson, for instance was 5'4". How did his 'wingspan' contribute to his success?

I can't see any reason why a proper woman cannot go on to beat the best man in the world.

Men have a greater 'wingspan' than women and about 40% more upper body strength.

Just been reading about a boy/trans girl in the US who has been given a woman’s scholarship due to competing in girls sport. It’s a man’s world.