To think I'm absolute shit at raising girls?

Sorry but the only problem I see is you being too soft and allowing your rude, disrespectful pre-teen to dictate you. She has zero right to talk to you like that, and she is the one trashing your relationship. Her gran also needs to be on your side. What a brat!

You need to grow a back bone and parent your daughter. Stop trying to be her friend and stop letting her speak to you like shit and walk all over you. She needs boundaries.

I have 3 girls. They can be hard graft.

Op is your eldest not your mil's blood grandchild?

sitting, breathing, existing, growing hair, making blood cells

😂

Stop pussyfooting around her! If she can give banter she should be able to take it. She’s got you walking on eggshells.

DD is 12 and certainly hormonal and stroppy at times. I feel we have a good relationship without too much stress or bad words. She is worse when she is tired, hungry, 'stressed' (e.g. lots of homework) or has had too much screen time (typically 20 mins. on her phone on Sat. and Sun., no social media but she can and does watch YouTube videos, and she can watch TV at the weekend but not before 10am and not for hours on end, but as we don't lock the TV she has sometimes watched 'too much' when we've had to go out or occasionally has been with a friend who has more screen time - we really notice that DD is much more irritable afterwards.)

Obviously every child is different and what 'works' with one doesn't work with anotherw and children develop so having a harmonious relationship now doesn't mean it will be that way forever.

So, without wishing to sound patronising, I try to be really clear about what needs to be done and when, e.g. we need to leave for swimming at x time and you need to pack y and I will bring z. Everything for school is prepared the night before. There are clear 'non negotiables' that have to be respected.

I try not to get angry and I don't think I shout. I want her to know she can come and ask me for help and also come and tell me when she has made a mistake.

I do not cut her off when she is speaking and I try to listen to her point of view. I try to be positive e.g. 'today we didn’t have badminton as the teacher was sick'; I think, 'that's shit, it's the third time that's happened and we pay for it!' but I will say, 'oh, did you do something fun instead? I hope your teacher is ok' (DD seems to adore most of her teachers and gets frustrated if DH or I criticise or question the school.) I listen to her very enthusiastic and long accounts of her school day etc. even though they can be extremely boring.

I do not sweat the small stuff. If she has a big day ahead and just wants to eat one bite of breakfast I let it go. If it's raining I tell her but if she doesn't wear a coat / take an umbrella I remind myself she is not a Victorian waif who will catch consumption and keep my mouth shut.

I praise her and thank her for what she has done well.

Where applicable / appropriate for an adult and a child, I hold myself to the same standards, e.g. no phone at mealtimes, no excessive screentime, dirty clothes straight in the laundry bin, tidy up after myself, make the bed (well, DH does this), open and close the bedroom blinds, put away keys/travelcard/papers in the right places, being on time.

Also I try not to compare DS and DD.

DH is great with DD in that he is very patient in helping her with homework and he has a lot of energy (and other things I have mentioned above.)

I hope some of this helps, OP.

Think about your good cop/bad cop vibe. Sounds like you’ve been the good cop with the boys and DH has been the bad cop. Does your DD get on with your DH? Maybe you’re the bad cop here?

that’s absolutely normal when they get to an age when they want to push back against authority and boundaries. However at this age they need and should have those boundaries.

i went through this with DS and I had to learn to step back and bite my tongue. Just let it ride out and not take it personally. Bloody hard but it improved and as he’s matured it’s become much easier.

Kids are all different. I don't think you can generalise that girls are awful /boys are lovely. Mine are late teens and that hasn't been my experience

Your eldest dd asking thst you promise not to leave your younger dc with MIL unsupervised should be screaming warnings to you op.

Your failure to recognise this is concerning.

I would be monitoring every interaction with MIL like a hawk.

IMO it depends on the personality of the person regardless of sex. I have two girls. Eldest (16) is a delight, youngest (12) is more like me in personality
I take the approach that she can dislike stuff I say and do but she doesn't get to be rude and disrupt the household and there are consequences for that and how she treats people - good and bad. Ultimately it is up to her- she gets out what she puts in. Stick with it and be consistent and loving while not being a pushover and fingers crossed it will pay off in time. That is what I'm hoping for anyway.

Blimey, my mum would have walloped me for daring to speak to her like your daughter spoke to you when you came in her room. Fucking hell. Obviously not the right way to go these days! But there should be consequences and a clear explanation of you pay for the flipping house so can come in her bedroom (obv if she’s getting changed wait outside).

I'm wondering about the girl vs boy thing too. Is it maybe the case that you find it easier to parent boys because you're not afraid of offending them? That maybe you think girls should be mmoredocile and polite naturally, without the need for firm boundaries?

I can walk away in response to rudeness, but I don't think I can correct her behavior if I'm also avoiding being hurtful. She was hurt last week because I said something about how she was treating one of her brothers. I was careful how I put my words together and she still became very upset and refused to talk to me afterwards.

This is ridiculous. Of course she's going to give a 'hurt' reaction when you call out her behaviour. That doesn't actually mean that you did something that was objectively hurtful. What you did was actual parenting. You can respond to her hurt reaction by saying 'I'm sorry you're upset, but your behaviour was unacceptable. Getting upset about it doesn't change that. You don't get to be rude and unpleasant to us without consequences'. And then if she does it again, actually impose some consequences. Come on, this is parenting 101.

This. You’re on the back foot all the time and she knows it. She’s testing you and you’re not pushing back. You need to parent her firmly. She needs to learn that she is not in charge. No child should be in charge of the house.

I think you need to stop agonising about how you’re speaking to her. Clearly, she’s going strop whatever you say. So if she needs a telling off, give her one. She’s walking all over you!

And it sounds like your DH needs to have a word with his mum.

Agreed. Timid is the last thing I am. I have no idea why some parents tolerate this rudeness from their DC. You don’t have to scream and shout at them - but you do need to speak firmly to them and insist on respect. No respect? No allowance, no treats, no lifts.

Your daughter is throwing her weight around and trying to provoke you to get a reaction. She's doing it because you're so afraid of upsetting her that you pussyfoot around her and don't establish firm boundaries.

I don't think your comment about the phone call sounds like it was sarcastic.
I suspect it was more placatory and submissive. She is pushing and trying to upset you in order to test where your limit is (even if she doesn't realise that's what she's doing), but she can't find it your limit, because it sounds like you just try and appease her whatever she does. Kids need boundaries to feel secure.

I see this differently. I think its great of MIL to let her know she would be welcome there.
When I was early teens I moved out briefly after a huge row with my mum. Everything she did irritated me and we didnt get along at all. I packed my stuff and left. Luckily I went to my grandmas house and stayed with her about 10mins from home. I went back after a few weeks voluntarily and my mum or my grandma never made it an issue.
This short break from each other made a huge difference in our relationship. It was still difficult until i moved out later, but much better than before.
I dont know what would have happened if i didnt have my grandma to go to.

I have a wonderful relationship with my parents now. We live very close and see each other several times a week, holiday together etc. No issues at all. I cant believe teenage me was such a cow. But Im glad my mum left me too it and was patient and i had a safe place to go.

I have 4 dds and the eldest was difficult, and the youngest seems to be heading the same way. Yes hormones have a lot to answer for but I wouldn't tolerate rudeness like that op. Assuming you are a reasonable person that doesn't make unreasonable demands of your dc then you are entitled to a modicum of respect and you should insist on it. I would always knock as a courtesy before I went into their rooms but I also maintained that this was their space in my house. I found the only thing that worked with my dds was removal of their phones/the Internet if they were rude or wouldn't do their homework or whatever. Teenage years can be difficult for everyone, and dc need to learn their limits. You need to think about what behaviour is acceptable to you, what expectations you won't compromise on, and what stuff you can let go. She needs to know that you love her and you absolutely have her back, but you expect a certain amount of respect in return. Its not going to be easy, but believe in yourself, and that this too shall pass. Good luck.

I just cannot get my head around why people allow children to speak to them like this.

I know. Why are some parents so….timid?

DD tells her she wishes she lived with her and the answer is always that MIL would love that, too

You MIL is a big problem here.

The only appropriate response to this is 'Oh that's nice of you to say! You have a lovely home with mum and dad though, that's your family home where you belong' or similar.

If I found out my MIL had told any of my dc she'd love them to live with her I would step on that HARD and quickly and if there was any pushback from the relative then contact from that point would be reduced and always supervised. It's wholly inappropriate and damaging to a young child.

It sounds like your daughter lacks respect for you and is trying on pushing boundaries.
You and your husband need to firmly explain to her that it's not on, and she is not to be rude to you again.