That The La Leche League have dangerously lost the plot?

Oh I know, it fucking disgusts me.
I've lost so many friends over this and I just don't care, I absolutely will not stop supporting women and children.

its down to male entitlement

and a few woman that will go along with their entitlement under the umbrella of being inclusive 🙄

People seem to have lost their god damn minds.

men have all the power still @Livinginaclock
and don’t give a toss

Yes, it's incomprehensible to me, and yet it's happening.
Why, ffs why?

And for a man's fetish.

This should be unthinkable in 2024

Its a worry for those babies too
No one knows the effects of the chemicals taken by men ( to transition and to try and make ‘milk’ ) on the babies.

They are potentially putting babies at risk

I'd be deeply suspicious of any 'transwoman' or man trying to access these spaces. And I would expect that any decent husband/partner would realise the need for this sort of service being single sex. It's obviously a fetish or perversion as most sane humans realise that men can't breastfeed, however much mascara they wear or 'discrimination' or 'transphobia' they cry.

Slightly off topic, but I learnt earlier today that's there's an international men's day next week. Don't they already have 365 of those days a year?

Two points that I've not seen mentioned: first is that even if a transwoman was trying to induce lactation, an LLL meeting, which is peer support plus expertise from a Leader (breastfeeding counsellor level), is not the place for them because it is aimed at supporting 'the normal course of breastfeeding', encouraging and supporting women and their babies to do what most of them can with the right help. More complex situations - of which this is arguably the most extreme example! - need one-to-one support, probably from an IBCLC which is the top-level lactation qualification (though some LLL Leaders are also IBCLCs), and possibly with input from endocrinologists etc.

Second, if a transwoman is attempting to feed the baby, what has happened to that baby's mother? We know that if a mother doesn't get good breastfeeding support in the early days to bring in her milk and ensure a good supply, then sometimes that can impact her entire breastfeeding experience. So if a transwoman partner is also trying to breastfeed, that could derail the mother's experience too, to the longer-term detriment of the baby and the mother, as we also know from research how mothers grieve the loss of breastfeeding experience if that's what they had wanted to do.

It would be direct sex discrimination to allow some men in but not others (bearing in mind that no human being can change sex so trans women are still men).

So either ALL men are allowed or none.

To everyone taking the piss out of "act like a woman" as someone who is not a trans woman I clearly can't explain it effectively but that is the way it has been explained to me by all the trans women I have ever met. When they act like and are accepted as a female, they feel 'right'.

It isn’t piss-taking, it is a genuine question- which no one EVER answers.

If we are to allow some males into women’s spaces because they ‘feel’ or ‘act’ like women, it is not at all unreasonable for women to ask what that actually means. Otherwise how will we be able to differentiate between men with lady-feels and men without?

Your TW friends have told you they feel like women and you’ve just accepted that without asking them what they mean? I can’t wrap my head around your lack of curiosity!

But I know you’ve left the thread anyway- which is not a surprise to anyone because it’s what people do whenever these questions are asked.

@balletcat

To everyone taking the piss out of "act like a woman" as someone who is not a trans woman I clearly can't explain it effectively but that is the way it has been explained to me by all the trans women I have ever met. When they act like and are accepted as a female, they feel 'right'. When they act like a man to fit in they feel 'wrong'. It's not my experience so I can't explain it any better than that.
So when people tell you they 'act like a woman' but don't explain what that means you just accept it? Because that's not good enough for me. How do women act?

Obviously no one is saying that women who have been abused should be exposed to men in female spaces. Anyone saying that is being deliberately obtuse. That's exactly what some people have said/are saying. I was told (on here) to reframe my trauma which stems from CSA and accept TW in any place they want to be.

Can you "tell the difference easily"? Can you explain how?

It isn't. But somehow large numbers of useful idiots have been co-opted to tell us it's their 'human right' 🙄

It’s beyond ridiculous.

Men pretending to be women accessing groups for breastfeeding women and their babies. How is this logical?

It’s just mind boggling.

I have no trans friends or interact with any trans people. However, if my manager Bob decided to transition tomorrow and turn up on Monday as Roberta, I would be obliged to share toilets with him and his penis under my company's "inclusive" policies. If I refused, I could lose my job.

Trans inclusive policies and accommodations hurt all women by removing single-sex spaces, removing privacy, dignity and safety for women along with them.

Being trans is about gender stereotyping. Lets sort that out, rather than agreeing with a male bodied person that he must be a woman because he wants to wear a dress.

Indeed.

Being trans is about gender stereotyping. Lets sort that out, rather than agreeing with a male bodied person that he must be a woman because he wants to wear a dress.

@BalletCat I don't want to derail the thread but I had to laugh when you said "I don't know any genuine trans people who call having sex with a trans woman "gay sex" do you?"

I don't know if you have many gay friends but my gay mates have said it's quite common on Grindr for men to look for other gay men or transwomen. All the gay men I know are very fond of dick.

Next time you're out when a gay man ask him to do a search - you'll see exactly what I mean.

What really gets me about all this is that as soon as a women gets pregnant (and even before) she is told what she should and shouldn't do, especially with regard to alcohol, medicine, food and exercise - for the good of the baby.

A male bodied person comes along and wants to "chest feed" and is given drugs to facilitate that which could easily have a bad effect in the baby.

It's almost like all the "rules" for pregnant and breastfeeding women are about controlling women and not about the baby at all...

There is no valid social or human rights movement that can be used as a cover by abusers, child abusers, or rapists.
If your movement finds itself fighting for the rights of abusive men, or giving them rights they shouldn't have, you are the problem. You need to stop what you are doing and work out how to exclude those men from your movement.

And trans women absolutely do use women's changing rooms. I remember very clearly when it happened to me in my early 20s at the gym and I was shocked and very scared. I was alone, in my underwear with a naked man. That is not ok. This was before it was talked about in the media. Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

I'm not anywhere near as informed as many of the women on this post, but I just can't get my head round how biological men feel that they are women, without ever having been one? The vast majority of trans women do not go through gender reassignment, so essentially all they are changing is the way they look and sound. Being a woman is far, far beyond this. Women have a biological ability to breastfeed, some choose not to, and some can't, and that is fine, but a biological male inducing lactation so they can give a child the smallest amount if milk that isn't really going to benefit them is performative, and in my opinion a bit gross.

People saying all trans women are men in dresses with perverted fetishes are just uninformed and nasty.

Who has said all of them are? I've not seen it. There are a range of reasons, autogynephilia/fetishism being one. There hasn't been enough research done to see how much of the overall "trans woman" population they are.

I just don't actually believe "trans women" are a type of woman, just like you, I think @BalletCat. That's all. The difference is that I don't think they should ever be treated as women. I simply don't share your ideology and I'm not required to give up my own rights to make male people feel more comfortable. Why would you think that was fair?