I am surprised at the level of Islamophobia on Mumsnet

As with so many things it’s very difficult to discuss. Any concerns are shut down with cries of bigotry. But IMO there are things worth discussing. I do not think sharia law or Islamic caliphates are as worthy as democracy and equality. I don’t think there are any Muslim countries where women have equal rights (I can’t think of one but could be wrong) , and I think homosexuality is illegal in all (and punishable by death in some). Afghanistan is the only country in the world where all females of any age are denied education.

some but not all people with links to those parts of the world hold views which aren’t compatible with British values.

and the weekly marches in major cities aren’t helping the optics - people supporting Hamas and the houthis and not being removed from the marches, people carrying foul anti semtic signs not being removed from the marches, people calling for infitada and jihad (and no, when you’re marching on the streets calling for it I don’t believe you’re referring to personal internal struggle), police removing Jewish people from the vicinity of the marches for their own safety. None of this is ok. And I’m sorry if that makes lives harder for the millions of peaceful, integrated Muslims, but it is an issue for the Muslim community to sort out. I can’t pretend not to notice it or think it’s ok.

OP I'm from a similar background as you - Hindu from a country with lots of Muslims.
I think you need to distinguish between 'Islamaphobia' and general 'religiob-phobia'.

The majority of religious, rule-following people in the UK are Muslims. Ramadan, halal food , prayer breaks , headscarves etc such a massive fuss is made.

There aren't many strict Hindus. We also have religious festivals, fasting etc but very few follow it. Similarly, Sikhs cannot eat ritually killed meat , so they can't actually eat halal food, but again many dont know, because they don't kick up a fuss.

I don't think people have anything against Islam in particular but there really isn't any other comparable. Maybe Latter Day Saints, and they get no support here either for their proselytising or not allowing blood transfusion. There's less of them than Muslims though. Also Jews, but they tend to keep to themselves. And in turn face prejudice from Muslims who support Palestine.

When people say 'Muslim' they usually mean 'religious Muslims'. The balance between that and progressive is quite delicate...

I have several friends who are atheists in Iran.

It always annoys me when people from the Middle East are called "Muslims".

This is a religion, not an ethnicity!

Would we like to be defined everywhere as being "Christians"? Especially when the talk is about US evangelists?

Why on earth does London hold celebrations for ANY religion? It is a made-up belief; sure, it helped the development of literacy, art, culture... but so did fairytales.

Religion should be like voting: everyone can have their own personal preference, but you keep it to yourself and the media are not allowed to priorities one over the other or any at all.

@toomanyy the way you are attacking everyone who doesn't shares same viewpoint as you tells it all we need to know about tolerance and acceptance. May be start with making some improvements on your part of you want to be a better reflection of your religion than crying islamophobia.

I have an issue with any way of thinking that is repressive towards women. All religions are to an extent and also homophobic etc... I can't entertain it. And I grew up Catholic and feel the same way about Catholicism.

I do understand that some people can be culturally Muslim but progressive in thier way of thinking though and 'westernised', just like I am a much more watered down Catholic than my grandparents.

Seriously, you want to get into an exchange on who has experienced more attacks in India?

You will lose.

Not really. A lot of the attacks on Christians I see on Mumsnet are precisely because they are associated with the traditional white-working class (the most maligned and ridiculed group on Mumsnet) and therefore beneath the intellectually superior middle class warriors who know best and who have no problem making fun of Christians and Christianity in a way they wouldn't dare treat other groups.

There is a large element of racism in Western Christianophobia highlighted by the fact that black Christians in Nigeria who are currently being massacred en masse for being Christian get no news coverage in the West because Christianity is seen as being a "white" religion amongst Western "intelligensia" so attacks on Christians worldwide are not worth reporting as it doesn't fit into the neat "oppressor/oppressed" paradigm.

@toomanyy oh really, you mean these incidents
https://insightuk.org/two-hindu-children-murdered-by-muslim-extremists-during-ramadan-in-india#:~:text=The%20killer%20Sajid%20came%20to,boys%2C%20severely%20injuring%20the%20third.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/7/5/fear-and-anger-in-indias-udaipur-where-hindu-tailor-was-killed

You mean like hate towards gays, non-believers, apostates, women, free speakers etc etc? OK

No hate here. Just a deep conflict in values

Maybe those who are saying that they don't like certain aspects of Islam and treatment of women could clarify exactly what they mean. Then those of us who are Muslim could comment on whether that is truly an Islamic principle (and the purpse of it. Or if its cultural.

Maybe that will help some of those who are upset by certain things they have seen/heard/ experienced

Phobe away, just don’t inflict hate on people.

Given the hatred towards Muslims in India, your post made me laugh.

Have a look at the BJP’s anti-Muslim rhetoric and report back.

Here’s a hint for you: the BJP are claiming that the opposition intend to take wealth from Hindus and give it to the Muslims.

There are direct responses on why threads on religious ideology are important. I don’t think the answer is to get rid of all discussion

Especially when it relates to women and girls

Of course if people want the Muslim board then that can be a place to chat to other people which is likely important too, but on the main board I would not go for deletion on discussion

@toomanyy

"Her posts are Islamophobic despite having two best friends that are Muslim. I bet she keeps that side hidden from them."

I can't seem to remember any Hindu or Sikh inspired terrorist attacks in the UK.

However I do seem to remember the Sikh community response to the 2017 Manchester bombings:

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/manchester-sikh-temples-food-shelter-people-terror-attack-suicide-bomb-harinder-kukreja-gurdwara-a7750881.html

There are several areas around a 15 minute walk from the museum, which is why I asked @DrJoanAllenby Why are you so reluctant to specify the area you are talking about?

As a lifelong atheist who has never had any dealings with or interest in any religion whatsoever I can’t comment on the benefits or shortcomings for those who are involved with any religion.

I can however comment on the external impact it has on those of us who are on the outside. From a UK perspective there is only one religion that causes noticeable issues for those who are not at all interested in religion. This negative impact may be perpetrated by a minority however it is insidious and not welcomed by many.

If people want to point at the clouds and structure their life around made up fantasy figures then that is of course their own choice but please respect the rest of us who think it is nonsense and leave us in peace.

There has been a Muslim board on MN for some time.

You've been lucky then. Meet a fundamental christian -they are blind followers

Whenever I've expressed a dislike of practices common (or embedded) in certain majority-islamic countries (mainly those I consider to be misogynistic) I've been told these are cultural, not religious.

I think it’s a bit disingenuous to say that any of the negative things associated with a religion are just culture and nothing to do with religion.

Most mainstream religions preach largely peace and love (although obviously there are often a fair few sexist and homophobic rules mixed in there). Despite this they have collectively been the cause of significant harm. Whilst the pure doctrine may promote only good things, the fact is that the religious ‘infrastructure’ often facilitates people acting very badly. Sometimes this is due to a particular interpretation of religious doctrine or just a by-product of religious institutions or practices becoming corrupted.

As a non-Muslim example: sex-abuse in the Catholic Church. I think most people would agree that Catholicism doesn’t promote sex abuse, that it is not in any way ‘Catholic’ behaviour, but equally we’d still say that this is a Catholic problem to sort out.

I think there is a fear of saying that some Muslim communities need to sort things out. Partly because there are also racists who get on the bandwagon.

Just to add, I think religion also does many wonderful things in the world.

You are not unreasonable at all, most Muslims are as you describe. I know, and have nearly always known, many. People are thinking of the fundamentalist extremists so feted by tabloids - but rarely know one.

Fundamentalist religious groups always pose a danger. You only have a look at some far right Christian groups in America, gay-hating, to see that.

I've been appalled by comments from some posters on a couple of facebook groups. They don't like Muslims but they don't like 'foreigners' in general, especially those who do not have white skin. They go on about England as it used to be, how great it was (of course, we know different, there were good and bad times just as now), want to wave England flags and celebrate St George, It's horrible, and shocking that people feel that way in the twenty-first century. As an English person, I feel ashamed of those attitudes.

@JediKnightingale

Excellent post. And pretty much sums up how I feel about ANY and ALL religions.

I assume it's Grangetown.