Islam groups calling for caliphate in Germany, aibu to be petrified?

Indeed- in fact, the danger of fundie Christians achieving power in the USA is greater than that of Sharia supporters achieving any power in Germany.

The fundie Christians are already in charge of the Supreme Court in the USA.

There is a difference between being critical of Islam and 'openly hating all muslims'. From what I can see on this thread, most of the comments fall into the former category (and any that fall into the latter should be reported).

My comment was in answer to your question. I didn't say the Michaela trial did not happen.

Let me spell it out as you seem confused.

You asked the question Are they working for a Caliphate step by step?

I replied "No. Don't be so utterly ridiculous."

OK?

@IClaudine you say to me "No. Don't be so utterly ridiculous."
Did these events actually happen, or do you deny them?

It won't happen. 3.5% of Germans are Muslim, and most of these wouldn't want a caliphate.

I don't like religious-right looneys of any religion, but Germany is a secular democracy which will have no truck with the extremists.

I do worry about Islamist undermining of democracy under Erdogan in Turkey (even there, however, there won't be a caliphate). But I also worry about Fox News' undermining of democracy under Trump in the USA! It is a most unreliable news source.

No. Don't be so utterly ridiculous.

Meanwhile in Germany:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/29/alleged-far-right-plotters-on-trial-in-germany-accused-of-plan-to-overthrow-state

As usual, it's always fine to openly hate Muslims and say things that you would never dream of saying about any other group of people. Not even surprising or shocking anymore.

I am as worried (if not more worried) for my friends in the US of fundie Christians than i am for me and my friends here in Germany being forced to live under Sharia law.

Seriously? That's ridiculous. Fundie Christians have much more sway in the US than the possibility of Sharia law in Germany. As a pp mentioned, they have managed to overturn Roe vs Wade in the US, which is frightening.

Recently the school that Katherine Birbalsingh is head of had to defend itself (at it's own expense) from pressure about neutral on religion. The Muslim accusers received government money to fight the school in court (Legal Aid).
Ms Birbalsingh also complained that moderate Muslim female pupils were being bullied to wear the Hijab, opt out of sport and withdraw from the choir.
Are they working for a Caliphate step by step?

I'm just impressed I can translate the sign with my A'level German.

But why do you think it's new? It's a common slogan/demand/intent from the fringe and has been for yonks.

In history the majority of people have not wanted extremist dictators. Guess what happened?

In Berlin they protested against Hitler, in St Petersburg thousands of sailors died at Kronstadt to protest against the Communists. In the French Revolution the middle class protested against the extremists and were guillotined. The term democracy was a chilling insult against the concept of the popular vote for decades after the revolution.

Frequently well organised minority extremists take control when there is a power vacuum.

I am staggered at the confidence that this ‘Will not happen’ etc. What this will do is inflame and encourage people to support the far right parties. It’s a very serious escalation. Seemingly not content to live together respectfully, but to turn Germany into a war zone.

Of course you are right to be alarmed op. It’s a very worrying development for so many reasons.

Six years ago there were posters on the walls of the London university I worked at asking for a caliphate. I stopped working there so have no idea about new but there are always extremists in religion and politics. Hopefully the more balanced of us continue to be the majority.

Ah nice 10 meters behind 🙄 lovely.

I am as worried (if not more worried) for my friends in the US of fundie Christians than i am for me and my friends here in Germany being forced to live under Sharia law.

I would also like to remind everyone that here in Germany governments and individuals have to be VERY careful about appearing to discriminate. Becausee the danger of people just ignoring the actual events/issues and shouting "see, once a nazi always a nazi" is very real.

I literally got asked on my last visit to UK how i handle living among nazis given my trotskyite-style views. An actual honest question.

This specifically is obviously a bit OTT reporting, but the wider threat of Islamism to the world is not. I recently read Unveiled by Yasmine Mohammed. It's obviously very personal as a story but it's still a bit disconcerting, where it's all going.

for all the "haha Fox news" Kaliphat and Islamisten is trending on German twitter.

Interesting post generally

No I'm sorry, that's a completely unacceptable response.

What you have effectively said here is that it is understandable for safeguarding to be made secondary because people are scared of political interference for fear of being seen as racist and because we don't want muslims to feel stigmatised.

No that's categorically not what I'm saying. (Maybe I'm overwriting for fear of lack of clarity and paradoxically making myself unclear.)

What I'm saying is that a lack of nuance in the public discourse causes multiple problems.

So that broad brush dismissals of Islam as a bad thing, "backwards", "misogynistic" etc, are a) wrong, b) give understandable offence and therefore c) cause a justified backlash - or an over compensation- which makes it harder, rather than easier, to tackle honour violence, grooming gangs and so on when they crop up in sections of the Muslim community.

No. Safeguarding ALWAYS needs to be the main concern. Safeguarding children ALWAYS needs to be the main concern. We all have a responsibility to put that first no matter how difficult or problematic that might be or how far it pushes it outside our comfort zone or makes us fear backlash.

Yes absolutely we should be able to do these things (law enforcement, policy implementation...) on a purely factual, justice is blind, rational basis, but the realpolitik's not like that currently.

I get that there is a lot of support for the AfD, and in many respects that is more tangible. Problem is, the Muslim Interaktiv has a large following online - we have no way of knowing how many of those followers are sympathetic to the idea of a 'caliphate' and how many are a threat to democracy.

that's true. But i can't see any German government, even a coalition of Die Linke and Bündins Grünen/90 (who will have to cozy up to the SDP) putting up with actual serious calls for a caliphate. How are they going to enact that into law (having said that, i really didn't think we'd actually end up with SelfID here, so what do i know?)