Do you begrudge high earners?

That’s always been the way though. My great uncle was a director of a few companies, mining mostly and travelled a lot, all over the world and was an expert in his field. He left a lot of money when he died, and earned equivalent to £300K apparently back then.

He didn’t have a laptop as this wasn’t around back then but he would’ve had one now. His lifestyle probably cost him his first marriage, he never had DC (not 100% sure why) and he doted on my DM (his favourite niece).

He worked bloody hard though compared to his younger brother (my grandad, DM’s DF) but he was the youngest son and spoiled (as well as lived through 2 world wars as a child).

I think that the main issue is that 'normal' jobs have become rubbish. The expectations on regular office jobs for unpaid overtime and extra hours and stress alongside the reduction in terms and conditions (final salary pensions etc...). 20 years ago it was possible to buy a house and have a 'normal' job along with a good work-life balance. My friend works for a failing private sector institution and noted that the board members were on hundreds of thousands of pounds while she was paid much less than colleagues at similar institutions. This organisation was also in a huge amount of debt. I have also noticed among my friends and family that a number of the higher earners are now going to live in places like Monaco, Dubai and Singapore. They can pay no income tax and their families can stay in the UK accessing schools and health care etc...Not sure what the answer is - I think if Labour raises taxes then lots of higher earners will leave - it is very easy to transfer to another country of residence if you are a high earner.

A lot of high earners sit round a table all week playing yackety yack, admiring brightly coloured-in reports and discussing strategy, while in the next building, hundreds of skilled employees on not much more than minimum wage are working their fingers to the bone manufacturing the goods.

They forget who, in that situation, the company needs the most.

When I was at school toward the end when we were about to leave a career officer came round with a selection of jobs for us to apply for . He kept offering me factory and shop work. When I asked about office jobs he laughed and said "Oh no dear they are for the Grammar school girls "

WHAT, only 1% of people earn over £180k and only 5% earn over 87k.

I would consider 300k to be an extremely high salary and I would expect them to be working very long weeks for this.

But a high salary say 90k I've seen people not actually doing more then those on lower wages, just depends on the sector you work in really rather then how much effort you put into the actual job. Plus often very high earns often have people underneath them who they can delegate work to.

It depends what they do. I know some high earners who admit to me that they don’t do much, but get paid a lot. Usually at a high level in their career and sometimes it’s more for knowledge they’re employed.

Some high earners I know do work hard, bankers eg. But most retire earlier and some it’s affected marriages due to long hours and stress.

DB earns a lot in his job but it’s long hours and often away from home and it’s not really doable with a young family. Or if it is, it’s better when you’re younger, not when you’re his age with a few health issues.

I used to be a high earner, in the top 1% or so. I will happily admit to tax avoiding - I paid into a pension and saved into an isa. Other than that I paid every penny of tax due, over 90k in some years. My job was always stressful and often toxic. I'm now self-employed and there are definitely a lot more ways to play the tax system if I wanted to.

Has the op came back to enlighten us yet

I had no idea about legacy spots. Reading about this now. This is a daft thread, but this post has taught be something so thank you!

I don't begrudge them what they earn.

What I do have trouble with is their sneering, contemptuous attitude towards people who earn less than they do.

Yes and No. Most of course not, I wouldn't want their positions. But I've met a few who I couldn't figure out why: some managers on £80k who are useless.

This may well be the case for many high earners. It’s definitely not the case for others.

I know a few men who earn this sort of money (over 300,000 a year, a couple of them are nearer a million a year). I don’t know any women earning that much. I’m caught between admiring these men, envying them and wondering how the hell such a thing is possible as they can often seem uninformed, unimaginative and lacking in empathy. I can only assume their specialist knowledge and skills are enough for them to carry out their roles and their ability to operate at a high level in the real world is not important, but I still find it odd.

As others have said, high salaries and working hard are two separate topics. I don’t begrudge anyone anything they’re entitled to but I do begrudge the idea that we live in a meritocracy.

The hardest work I’ve ever done was in takeaways as a teenager to pay my bills and rent and I earnt £3.50 an hour (NMW then for u18s). I now have a middle management office job and it’s more stressful but nowhere near as hard. When I look around me at work, middle class well educated people are massively over-represented (proportionate to general society) esp in the highest paid jobs because education and opportunity breeds better earnings much more than hard work.

When I read the title my initial belief is that, no, I don't begrudge high earners at all. Then I read your post with do they "actually" and it annoyed me. I don't begrudge high earners but to think that only high earners put a lot of work in, have a lot of stress, or have high skills to earn that wage is nieve. Many people work extremely hard and are ridiculously underpaid. It annoys me when some high earners can't see this.

No I don’t care. It’s obvious that some jobs pay way more for the same hours, and that some people’s families will prepare them way better to go for those jobs than others. It’s also obvious that the people who end up at the top often are even not the smartest/most hardworking/“best” people. that’s just a fact of life - you can’t pretend life is fair in any way.

However, I do wish there had been much more education earlier on at school about different types of jobs, what makes money, and why a typically higher earning job is valuable (or not!). There was very little career education beyond school and anything we were taught was very stereotypical black and white - things like “finance makes money but is only suitable for certain people/personalities (men)” and so on. Most people I know invariably ended up doing what their parents did (or wanted them to do). I have some really brilliant friends who have really struggled salary wise post school/uni as they never had proper guidance or support in terms of the next stage of jobs. I recognise there are a lot of structural inequalities but I think the education system could focus way, way more on helping students understand all their options, do work experience etc.

Have you ever had a cleaning job or worked in a factory?

it isn't just a job, it ends up being a lifestyle. Your whole life revolves around work. Families have to fit in, children have to fit in, holidays have to fit in and around work I remember my dh taking his laptop on holiday and working

This isn't always true. Ive never worked on holiday. We have busy season once per year when i'll work a little on the weekend for two, max three weekends on the trot and do 12-14 hours days in the week. The rest of the year its 9-5.30 and my life doesn't revolve around work.

I earn a high income and i know i don't work any harder than a teacher or nurse for example.

However, i understand its simply supply and demand. What i do is a bit technical and most people find it boring, so there just aren't that many people willing and able to do it, and it needs doing, if not done well it can cost a company millions, so it pays well.

One of my son’s friends earns £500k a year. He invests other peoples’ money. That’s a huge responsibility

I think, if you've never been in the position to either be a higher or live with a high earner, you'd probably struggle to understand the time and effort it takes to maintain that wage.

it isn't just a job, it ends up being a lifestyle. Your whole life revolves around work. Families have to fit in, children have to fit in, holidays have to fit in and around work I remember my dh taking his laptop on holiday and working, whilst me and the DC we're sat by the pool. Equally I remember my DD telling me off for using my phone during my youngest Christmas play, as I had to respond to an urgent email.

The time it takes is one thing, but the stress and responsibility is also another part to it. You may not be 'doing the work' but you have overall responsibility for it, and the lives of the people who work for you, so if something goes wrong, your neck is on the chopping board, not to mention people's livelihood, ability to pay mortgages etc are on the line.

Exactly.

How could you generalise and say that you admire or don’t admire high earners based purely on their salary? Having money isn’t admirable, how they got there might be.

I don’t begrudge anyone for earning well but equally they don’t belong on a pedestal purely because they make a good wage.

Not really the begrudging type. I don't even care if you didn't earn it.

The company should not put itself in a position where one person leaving would cost millions, and I highly doubt many roles carry that kind of weight anyway.

I am very conflicted, it’s definitely made me change my view and don’t think the friendship will last.
It has been a slow drip feed of all the things they write off tax wise that I pay for after tax that is just making it hard to listen too. They won’t be the only ones, and that is what is scary about how much more tax should be raised to help society as a whole.