To have found my first mammogram really upsetting?

Absolutely you should have been treated with dignity and I don’t understand these comments from people saying you are lucky to be offered the test. I have never had a mammogram, however I went to routine cervical smears for many years until the one instance where I was treated like a piece of meat on a conveyor belt, and spoken to as if I was an idiot by the nurse. I did not return for smears at that hospital. It’s a bad enough experience without having someone talk to you like you are just a lump of coal with no feelings.

Ok, so imagine you are going for a smear test. The nurse tells you to strip from the waist down, and position yourself on the table. After that, she does not talk at all... just carries out the test with no explaining or warning. Would that be acceptable? If not, why not? After all, you knew what the test entails, and consented by being there

Yes, that would be acceptable. I don't need a blow by blow account of what she's doing!

You're only proving my point. I actually already have been treated like dogshit by the NHS. I've been permanently injured due to neglect, actually, amongst other things.

But you want to believe it's literally impossible. That scares me.

I have had numerous PET/CT and MRI scans as well as ultrasounds for breast cancer. My breast surgeon said that the mammogram is the most effective screening tool. Those other tests are useful images to see the extent of an existing mass and can give very clear images. But the mammogram is the most effective for screening and detecting early changes.

I don't know why women still have to suffer mammograms anyway when we have PET/CT/MRI scanning. Studies have shown these methods, along with contrast media are more effective at detecting cancers. Mammograms are 2D and are inferior, but presumably cheaper.

Ok, so imagine you are going for a smear test. The nurse tells you to strip from the waist down, and position yourself on the table. After that, she does not talk at all... just carries out the test with no explaining or warning.
Would that be acceptable? If not, why not? After all, you knew what the test entails, and consented by being there.

for the express purpose of a mammogram or smear, they cannot do either without touching me. Impossible to carry out those tests without touching. I willingly went, I don't need to be asked if I want them to carry out the very test I attended for. Absolutely ridiculous.

I still expect a little preamble - "I'm about to insert the speculum, try and relax," rather than just putting it in without saying a word. And in the same way, I expect someone to mention they're about to touch my breast to move it. I know what is expected over all, but I still like to have at least a moment's warning before specific parts of the procedure.

@Naunet I am truly glad you were treated with kindness in the NHS and I hope your surgery was successful.

I used to work in a non clinical role in the NHS dealing with members of the public. I found it so hideous that I swore I would never ever work with the public again. So I genuinely do have a lot of empathy and regard for people who work in the service industry, or any area where they are dealing with the public. People can behave in such a hideous way that I have the utmost respect for people in the NHS who perform such a difficult and vital role.

Ok, and do you cut the same slack to people in other client facing roles? Are hotel staff allowed to be rude to you, or a masseuse to roughly grab you to get you on the massage table, or check out staff to grunt at you and snatch items out of the hand to be scanned?
On top of that, this is an intimate examination, and that needs to be acknowledged as a factor.

Im not a NHS hater, I had to have surgery recently that I’d put off for 5 years because of my trauma. Every single member of medical staff I met along the way was amazing, I couldn’t have asked for better. I was very upfront about my history which I’m sure helped, but not all women will feel comfortable or even able to do that.

I think some of the responses on this thread are very strange. Anyone who goes for a mammogram must surely understand that it must involve some manipulation of your breasts. When I had my first mammogram several years ago, it came with a leaflet which explained this, and if it hadn't have been clear what to expect, I would have googled.

I've probably had over 20 mammograms over the years, and have been thankful every time that I live in a country where they are free and readily available to anyone who needs them. I've experienced a range of attitudes from different radiographers, many of whom have been very matter of fact and clinical. The last thing I would want is to have a chatty radiologist - I'm there to have a mammogram carried out to see if my cancer has come back not to talk about the weather or how I need to be positioned! No-one has ever asked for my consent to manipulate my breasts into the right position or to move any other bit of me out of the way, and I would never expect that to happen. It's part of the mammogram process.

As for comments about that the machines could only have been designed by a man - i have no idea whether a man or woman designed the scanners, but as they've been I use for many years now, I'd assume by the law of averages thst it would have been a man. But I've often thought whether there could be a better design, and I can't think of a different way of producing the images that are needed.

I've often found mammograms can be very painful but I wouldn't be here now if it wasn't for the screening service and the grumpy, slightly rough woman in the portakabin in sainsburys car park who carried out my second routine mammogram.

I don't think you get it. And I have never bashed someone over the head in my life, with my opinion or not!

You literally did:

Incorrect: informed and implied non verbal consent is given by the free will of turning up, the clear information provided in the leaflets that show your breasts will need to be placed on the machine. You are the one who is talking 'bullshit' I am afraid.

That was said in response to me saying consent can be withdrawn at any time.

Keep up indeed. Who made you judge and jury?

Though I see it's not just me you're bashing over the head with your 'opinion', which is largely irrelevant in this instance.

The only opinion that matters is OP's who said she felt uncomfortable with HOW her procedure was handled.

Why don’t you think women should be asked before being grabbed by a stranger, why isn’t their comfort important to you? Why do you think it’s too much to expect a medical professional to ask before touching? It takes seconds. You’re insisting it’s not needed, when many women here are telling you it is, yet you decide to ignore them, why?

If I go to see a health care professional because I've got say a lump on my back, then I fully expect them to say "I'm just going to take a look and feel the lump, ok?" If go for the express purpose of a mammogram or smear, they cannot do either without touching me. Impossible to carry out those tests without touching. I willingly went, I don't need to be asked if I want them to carry out the very test I attended for. Absolutely ridiculous.

I hated having mammograms, the first one was shockingly painful (literature and info talked about 'discomfort.' Having your boobs squashed flat in several directions fucking hurts. )
I get some people might find it less painful than others but I felt absolutely side-swiped by it. The manhandling wasn't too bad. I think i lifted each breast into the plate myself and the technician then put it into the correct position (and positioned me as well, i had drape myself around the machine and hang on to it for dear life.)
But l never had anyone who was other than pleasant and courteous, a cold or brusque technician could have made a huge difference and I completely understand how someone might feel bruised by the whole experience.

If I am having a bad day I can hide behind my emails. I literally cannot imagine what it must be like to have to deal with patients when you are stressed, worn out and/or feeling full of anxiety and despair. I think that they should be cut a bit of slack. But there seems to be no latitude for this at all on this site.

Don't be ridiculous - but a hello, or a 'just going to do x' wouldn't go amiss.
As for info, I looked at everything provided. Maybe I was daft to assume that the NHS would provide the correct information.
As for abrupt - I would say she was downright rude. But again perceptions eh?

I was just surprised - I've been accompanying my elderly mum to a variety of hospital appointments recently - including procedures and surgery, and the staff have all been polite, informative and helpful. From cleaners through to consultant without exception.

Of course they’re allowed a bad day, but just like every other industry, that doesn’t mean you get to take it out on the ‘client’. Being professional means acknowledging that the woman is in front of you half naked and possibly feeling vulnerable and having some empathy for that. It doesn’t mean coldly barking orders and grabbing someone unexpectedly.

The ahps are radiographers...not nurses. They should be couteous and kind even when rushed.

I did not say that I said you can withdraw from a procedure irrespective of whether consent was given. Keep up.

I think that consent can be ascertained as the procedure goes along if the HCP keeps talking to the patient throughout, just casually along the lines of "I'll just move you over to the left here if that's ok, now the machine is going to do x or y." For an uncomfortable procedure, it just makes sense to err on the side of being friendly.

Because you piped up when I said consent could be withdrawn at any time, saying that I was talking bullshit. Then, when challenged, you said: 'Yes, obviously consent can be withdraw during the procedure'... which is exactly what I had said initially.

So it's not me that's confused love!

I believe this started about consent in the context of the OP and not in the sense of kindness. I believe that kindness is desirable but maybe in the context of an horrendous work load with lots of patients it is not always prioritised over professionalism and the need to get the right outcomes. If the person themselves is going through something should they be allowed to have a bad day? There is so much to this.

• radiographer not nurse.

Given the sheer number of mammograms performed each day, this would be a huge waste of not only of the radiologist and the patient's time, but the appointment itself.

I have to admit that I find this whole topic odd, particularly the idea of expecting to be asked to consent to be touched by the clinician. I had my first mammogram 30 years ago at the age of 15, and dozens since, both NHS and privately. I don't recall anyone ever asking me for consent.