Male Nursery Staff

What nonsense. I certainly have never heard of read anyone anywhere - and certainly not on MN - defending or excusing Vanessa George, or regarding her as anything other than the utter piece of shit she is. I doubt you have either.

But the reason her name is (still) so well known is because of how unusual and shocking the case was: 1. because it was a nursery, where young children should be safe 2. because George was a woman. Male paedophiles are less famous because there are so many more of them.
To recall one woman who has been convicted of, for example, rape, mugging, murder, CSA etc. does not go to show that men and women are equally capable or likely to commit these crimes; men are still overwhelmingly more likely to be the perpetrators.

Presumably you’re happy for unknown women to touch her genitals at nursery?

You are teaching your child to be nervous of men.

You either trust the nursery, or you don't. Plenty of people having given their opinions and other perspectives on here but you dont want to hear it or listen to anyone. You are convinced this male worker is a predator, so just move the child to another provision !

Thanks for not answering the question.

Mumsnet is a brand name and nobody is prevented from using it.

So it's equal for certain groups to have access and privileges that others do not, on the basis that they are "typically oppressed"?

Three clarifications please:

1. How long does said oppression last before it no longer counts?
2. Is it unfair to expect the indigenous population be dominant in their own society?
3. Where is the tipping point? How much demonstrated risk (imagine a ridiculously high overrepresentation in sex crimes for instance) would be necessary to outweigh the "oppression" before you were allowed to discriminate?

Completely agree, but you'll get some apologist along in a minute saying she was a poor little victim herself, as a woman she's not capable of this herself, women don't "do" violence
It's and men "made her do it."
Oh and that women as a sex class don't usually sexually assault so it's all OK or some such shit.
Some people's thinking is so messed up (to put it politely)
It's sick

Vanessa George. Enough said.

I hardly think telling the tiny minority of men who may want to work with small children that they would be barred from the dubious honour of nappy changing is on a par with centuries of historical exclusion of women from all manner of industry and profession, and the continued gatekeeping of the same.
If male staff were told not to change nappies, it would be ONE (low status, unpleasant and unenviable task) in ONE specific job, leaving the rest of the wide world of work to remain their oyster. Is that really something worthy of tears?

@Crackalac

These figures are for the US but unless you think men in the US are completely different to those in the UK you can see your fears are aimed at the wrong people.

Cases of abuse in childcare are very small compared to domestic settings but they do occur. The vast vast majority of childcare providers are women and the rare cases that do occur are mostly perpetrated by women therefore you are basically going to have to take the view that no childcare setting at all is safe.

Daycare/Child Care in the US:
• FACT: 90% of children who are sexually abused are abused by someone they know.60% of children who are sexually abused are abused by people the family trusts. 30% of children who are sexually abused are abused by family members.1,2
• FACT: 40% of children who are sexually abused are abused by older or more powerful children.1
• FACT: Most children under the age of five receive child care from someone other than a parent. Almost one-quarter (23.4 percent) of children five and under are in some form of organized child care including daycare centers, nurseries, and preschools.3
• FACT: More than 4.1 million reports from CPS agencies were received in 2017 alone.These reports involved more than 7.5 million children. Reports included neglect, physical abuse, sexual abuse, emotional abuse, and medical neglect.4
• FACT: In 2017, 2,237 daycare providers were found to be abusing and neglecting children in their care.4
• FACT: Of perpetrators who were child daycare provides, more than 20% committed sexual abuse.5
• FACT: A mandated reporter is any adult professional who works with children; legally responsible for reporting suspected or disclosed abuse. In some states, all adults are considered mandated reporters.

Here we are posting on ‘Mumsnet’. Is that discriminatory? Are we supporting that discrimination by posting here?

No, because Mumsnet is a site for ALL parents, mums and dads.
Both welcome.

FFS! Just move your kid. The nursery isn't going to pander to you.

sure, but the reason she's given that she thinks he's creepy is that he's a man working in a nursery. From reading her posts, she doesn't even let family members change a nappy.

If she's not happy she should change nursery, not go on an online stalker witch hunt because she has randomly decided she doesn't like him.

Women abuse too though and you don't automatically suspect women of being abusers.

This.
You can't help your feelings, but it's your issues, nobody else's.
Of course men can look after children, and it's ridiculous and discriminatory to say otherwise.
Take then out of the nursery /school and find another one if men bother you that much.

I had a male midwife he was brilliant father of four professional and really kept me calm and reassured. I also had a surgeon student male attend one of my births.

My sons had a couple of men childcare providers they adored them because they were individuals who had to work probably twice as hard because of prejudices displayed here.

My children's father is involved and was the first to hold and feed our sons. I feel sorry to live in a world where you are seeing such poor men.

Whether you like it or not employers can employ both sex working in all roles. So you can move your child but you don't have the right to impact an innocent individuals career.

no, male staff shouldn't look after male children. as a previous poster has already explained it is the sex of the carer, not the sex of the child that is important

why do you feel that men's career choices is more important than safeguarding young children?

Voice your opinion at the nursery and see what they say. If you don’t like what they say then change nursery? They might be able to accommodate your wish and if not move her?

At the end of the day you are her parent and her advocater. If you are not happy do something about it.

Show them this article https://safeschoolsallianceuk.net/2019/09/21/parents-uncomfortable-with-male-practitioners-changing-their-childs-nappy/

At no point have I said that it’s more important. I just think it’s a dangerous mindset to immediately believe the worst about everyone. Should we condemn all police officers for the minority that abuse their power? Should we condemn all teachers for the minority that abuse children?
My point is the focus should be on the systems in place to prevent rather than excluding people ‘just in case’ they turn out to be one of the bad ones.

hold on hold on. she hasn't 'stalked' him at all. she has looked him up on social media. which is very normal these days. employers do it for job applicants (or maybe not in this case). it's information about themselves that THEY have put in the public domain

I'm interested OP what in his SM makes you think the nursery shouldn't have employed him?

For our own intimate care, it would be reasonable (and legal) to request a member of the same sex or a same sex chaperone. Same should apply to our children. You can say you want her to receive same sex intimate care or at least have a female chaperone. It’s safeguarding and also protects the male member of staff. Males commit majority of sexual offences and that’s why safeguards are put in place. Can’t be nice to be assumed to be something you’re not but safeguarding women and children trumps men’s feelings.

just put it in writing that you want same sex intimate care for your daughter.. not sure how it would be for male child but you could reasonably request that you wanted a chaperone for him too and for that person to sign their name too.

so men cannot ever work with young children then even if it's what they really want to do, are very good at it and are looking for a career in child care. wow. so could male staff look after boy children then, is that okay, segregate boy and girl nurseries.

it's really important to listen to your intuition as regards to 'creepy men's. I thought women knew this already?

if you have a concern about a member of staff you talk to the manager, not stalk them or gossip with another member of staff, that's really unkind and if I were the manager I would probably suggest you find a different nursery.

I really simple measure to avoid having young children sitting around in urine and vomit soaked clothing, whilst they wait for a female member of staff is to only employ female staff in the first place, isn't it

all staff are unknown until you meet them, not just at nursery. there's no need to be sarcastic, if you don't like the male staff at the nursery changing a nappy then just speak to the manager and sort something out but there may be times when your child is looked after by a male member of staff and they need changing nappy or clothes if they're sick, if it means waiting for a female or another member of staff to be available then so what, that's what will happen so it's entirely up to you what you want to happen. i am pretty certain no member of staff will beg you to change a dirty nappy.