To think if a pharmacist refuses to dispense medication due to religious or personal beliefs

she had the right to make decisions regarding her own health and her reproductive choices without being forced to give up that right to give somebody else a warm glow of superiority

100% That is so awful that a young women would be denied medication that has been prescribed by a doctor simply because someone else “doesn’t agree with it”.

I actually feel quite angry reading this thread. Imagine being a young women already feeling perhaps nervous/embarrassed about filling your contraceptive prescription to then be faced with judgement and told no.

This should not be happening. 😔

YANBU.

Again, it isn’t their job if they choose not to do that part. It’s explicitly not their job if they don’t want to
do that bit. They have fulfilled all the requirements of their job if they choose not to. I don’t know how else to explain this.

We had a catholic nun as a pharmacist a few years ago ( never heard of this before and I’m catholic) refused to give me the pill ( it’s for my periods and I’m a lesbian anyway) she refused to give it me but did get another one to give it to me. It’s absolutely ridiculous and wrong, it’s obvious that type of job you might not agree with things but it’s THEIR job

Pharmacist here.

The GPhC does allow pharmacists to refuse certain services based on religious beliefs. I am unsure how I feel about this, I hate that women's health is compromised by an individual's personal belief but I also think forcing healthcare professionals to make choices they are uncomfortable with is a slippery slope.

However if they refuse a certain service they should signpost you to the nearest available service provider who can meet your needs.

They must also refuse in a non judgemental and professional manner.

I've sadly heard very uncomfortable patient testimonies (often when I am the second or third pharmacist they have tried) of these two caveats not being met. It's not good enough.

I’ve met many nurses, doctors, surgeons and anaestitists whose beliefs mean that they refer patients who need this care to other colleagues.

You have chosen to live in that town. A pharmacist may well have qualified long before the rules on dispensing of MAPs changed. So should they just pack in their job, or should they be forced to do something that goes against their protected beliefs?
I the law in education were to be changed to make it compulsory to teach children that gender identity is more important than sex, should all of us teachers who do not believe this be forced to teach it? What about critical race theory? Or communism?
There are many things that we have the legal right to not be compelled to do. That should remain the case.

Well, I wasn't impressed that my DD had to tell me that she'd been prescribed the Pill but the pharmacist attached to the GP practice refused to dispense it to her because she was under 18 and it was 'against his beliefs'. She was competent to make that decision, the GP had agreed and prescribed it and frankly, the alternative that could have happened if she'd felt unable to tell me was far, far worse, never mind for those who are at actual risk of physical harm from their parents if they were found to be pregnant/sexually active/a victim of sexual abuse or rape. But his beliefs could have destroyed the lives and posed very real risks to any number of teenagers. She should have been able to fill that prescription unchallenged and kept her medical matters confidential, not be forced to tell me - the fact that I supported her is neither here nor there; she had the right to make decisions regarding her own health and her reproductive choices without being forced to give up that right to give somebody else a warm glow of superiority.

Still anecdata - but at least I'm talking from the position of direct experience, not a friend of a friend.

If you joined in good faith, under an explicit policy that gave specific opt outs (that have not changed or crept) and have done exactly the job you are contracted for, then no I don't think someone should be sacked or disbarred.

If the policy is to be abolished, then it is probably better to abolish it for all those qualifying or arriving in the country after a certain date. Managing even a small exodus would be problematic because of demographic trends and staff shortages (planned age retirement is already causing headaches in some fields - notably GPs and pharmacists - so it wouldn't take much of an increase in early retirements to cause conspicuous problems - "grandfathering" avoids that)

I agree.
And it needs to be remembered that it is not only gynaecologists. Anaesthetists and theatre staff may also object to participating in surgical abortions on ethical grounds and this is likely to represent a tiny part of their job, especially these days.It would be ridiculous to tell them that they can't be in that profession because of it or to force someone to act against their core beliefs.
I've been the rota master for a number of anaesthetic departments during my career and it's not generally a difficult thing to manage, you just allocate someone else. I have never known an abortion to be cancelled in any hospital where I have worked as a result of staff being unwilling to do it. It can generally be planned for and if something unexoected happens people generally just swap duties. In theory it may seem like a problem, but in my experience at least, it seldom is in practice (in England - I've never worked elsewhere.)

Yes I'm aware that they are allowed to be exempted, I just don't think they should.

That is shocking and IMO she shouldn’t be a Pharmacist! Imagine working in a restaurant then refusing to serve people alcohol because of religion. It just wouldn’t happen.

@veilstone 🙄🙄 if your supermarket job says you can optional provide cover in the alcohol aisle, are you then not doing your job if you choose not to?

@veilstone if your contract said you can optionally cover a shift every Saturday morning. Are you then refusing to do your job if you choose not to work Saturdays??
This is what map etc is equivalent to for pharmacists.

Pharmacies don’t have to offer emergency contraception, it is optional . Our local pharmacy has a sign up stating what services they offer. They should all do this really, saves awkward conversations all round.

Yes… but a lot don’t. My time is fine but the next town over has a pharmacy who won’t sell the MAP. They sell condoms though.

If your job might make you do something that's against your moral code then don't take that job. Would it be okay for a vegetarian to work in a supermarket and not sell meat? Or someone who thinks drinking alcohol is wrong to get a job as a waiter and refuse to serve wine? Although these cases aren't quite as bad as they don't involve denying health care which may have a huge impact on the health and wellbeing of the woman involved.

What about other forms of contraception? Are they against her religion? I assume she doesn’t use any contraception?

@supercalifragilistic123

Termination/abortion care is as far as I know the only area of healthcare you are able to opt out of. I am OK with that because I'd rather not have somebody doing something they don't feel comfortable with.

But the morning after pill isn’t termination or abortion care. It’s preventing an unwanted pregnancy, therefore avoiding a possible abortion, so surely that is something they would support/encourage?

But apparently it’s ok for the employer to deny women customers basic reproductive health care if they don't feel like it?

Yes it is. And there’s a legal exemption allowing them to do so. Would you be willing to work for an employer who compelled you to do something that went against your moral code?

Pharmacists can indeed opt out of all contraception services if they wish

My friend is a pharmacist and she said she can and does legally refuse to sell the morning after pill as it’s against her religion. I’ve had the same argument with her.

But apparently its ok for the employer to deny women customers basic reproductive health care if they don't feel like it?

This blithe assumption that "other pharmacies are available" is simply not realistic and as ever its the most vulnerable women who can't exercise the option to "simply" travel to the next town.

This is such a bullshit comparison design to close down discussion on women's rights to health care.

Women are not being denied health care by the existence of women only spaces. Nor are men.

In terms of unevidenced religious belief - that would be gender ideology, not developmental biology.

I don’t think you understand how pharmacies work & that the vast majority of pharmacies are actually private businesses (exceptions usually being hospital pharmacies).

From Community Pharmacy England:

“A pharmacy can be registered only by a pharmacist, a partnership consisting entirely of pharmacists, or by a body corporate (usually a limited company). In the case of a body corporate, a superintendent pharmacist must be appointed, to take responsibility for the way in which the company carries out its professional pharmaceutical activities.”

So when we are talking about independent pharmacies & not the large chains (which is what you usually find in the rural locations people are talking about), the pharmacy is likely to be owned by the pharmacist themselves i.e. it is their business so no, you can’t just move them elsewhere & neither are they under any obligation to provide an OPTIONAL service if they don’t want to.

Let’s say a particular pharmacist is not the owner though but an employee instead & can somehow be moved, you’re assuming that there will be another pharmacist to take their place but in the arse end of nowhere, that’s extremely unlikely. What’s more likely is the pharmacy will have to close down as you can dispense without a qualified pharmacist on the premises & then no one gets their medications; you are thereby increasing the risk for a larger number of people not mitigating it & women are still not getting the MAP they need.

The current shortage of pharmacists mean you’re lucky if you can find one at all in certain areas, never mind having a large list to choose from.