SAHM

I think it’s sad that even when PP’s have stated that their CHOICE is being a SAHM, they’re jumped all over by working mums telling them how it’s perfectly possible, they manage, after school clubs etc, then get bogged down in the semantics of needs! Kids needs don’t just stop when they get to school and I’ve found that more intense than nursery (no one is saying vs babies, that’s different). This shows there is definitely still an appetite for shaming SAHMs albeit just more covert.

And I would add, there are plenty of jobs that
would facilitate you doing at least half of the school pick ups/drop offs etc, and quite a lot that would potentially enable you to work around all of them. And indeed, there are many jobs that would also support you to carry on with your fortnightly parental meetings etc with the school etc. Lots of people in my organisation have significant caring responsibilities, either for children (including children with disabilities), elderly relatives, disabled partners etc. It's very normal for people to need time out to deal with this sort of stuff, and most people just work around it/make up the hours elsewhere etc. Of course, not all employers will accommodate, but I haven't worked anywhere that doesn't.

I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with being a SAHP if that's what you want to do. Merely pointing out that working doesn't necessarily mean giving up on all the other stuff that people might want or need to do. Decent employers recognise these days that employees have lives and families that are important to them, and work has to be compatible with these.

You said that they have the same needs when they start school as they do as before school. How isn’t that comparing?

You said:

^It doesn’t magically get easier once they’re at school. They still have the same needs..."

How is that not comparing the needs of children at school with the needs of babies/toddlers or preschoolers or whatever you might want to call them.

If you expressed it badly and simply wanted to say that children at school still have needs, then fair enough, just say that. But saying that they have "the same needs" makes no sense at all.

I never compared their needs to that of a toddler or baby, but you infer what you suits you

I already acknowledged that it is different for parents who are caring for disabled children, but we are not talking about carers on this thread, we are talking about SAHPs.

And of course it is silly to suggest that a child in school that doesn't have significant disabilities has "the same needs" as a baby or a toddler. There is nothing offensive about this, it is just a simple statement of fact. Unless they have significant disabilities, most children in school will be able to feed themselves, dress themselves, go to the toilet and do all sort of other things for themselves that babies and toddlers cannot. And they will typically spend 6 hours each day out of the house in school. Their needs are demonstrably different.

If you want to be a SAHP to school aged children and your partner is happy with this arrangement, and/or you can support yourself financially, then crack on. It doesn't bother me in the slightest. But if you're going to suggest that being a SAHP to a baby/toddler is as demanding as being a SAHP to a typical child in school then I am afraid I do think that's very silly.

Well exactly, it's a choice. You said in your post that one parent would have to leave work at 9 and 3 to do school runs. That's not true.

Not making out it’s impossible at all. I’m saying it’s a choice and one I totally struggled with juggling. I choose to be there for my DC first - in my work I just wouldn’t have been able to give them the time and attention I want to. Jeez

Your reality is not everyone else's though. Please don't act like it's impossible to work full time with school age children because it's not. I am a full time working lone parent, also with no family support and have been doing it nearly 10 years.

Profoundly silly? Then you’re profoundly offensive to others’ reality outside your own. As a PP said, my child’s needs have skyrocketed since school began and the staff just don’t have the time to be supportive like the nursery staff were. There’s also some parent involvement every fortnight or so that I’m keen to show up for. My choice to prioritise this over FT work (I squeeze in freelance) and don’t deserve to be called silly for a differing reality

I am a lone parent with no family support, and I can barely manage! But it’s not nonsense, that’s my reality and choice

It's certainly true that school hours are not as good at covering childcare requirements as one might initially think, when dc are tiny and you're comparing it to nursery fees. School holidays are long and the quality/availability of wraparound care isn't consistent across the country.

I do also know that my children have needed me just as much in their older years as they did when small. The needs are different, but no less important. This has surprised me tbh, but I'm glad I've been able to be at home and that my dh had been extremely supportive of it and appreciative of me taking on most of it.

There’s a difference between wanting and has to. You initially said has to when it’s just something you want.

Which is fine if the other parent agrees but also fine if they no longer want to be the sole provider financially once children are at school.

No one is entitled to be financially funded for as long as they fancy.

Nonsense. How do you think lone parents manage?

I’ve been a SAHM, really didn’t enjoy it. Much, much, happier at work.

I absolutely do not need to work from a money perspective but I chose to work (full time and full on) as I find it rewarding and interesting.

I’d work in some form if I won the lottery, either investing and growing that win money or perhaps taking the cash to buy a business which I’d then oversee. It just who I am.

I know plenty of women who work and are happy, just as I know plenty of SAHM who are happy too.

Aren’t we lucky that many of us have the choice

We didn't use any breakfast or after school clubs but we were both able to work full time around dropping dd off/picking up from school. Loads of people work flexibly these days - it was pretty common when dd started school nearly 15 years ago!

They still have the same needs after starting school as they did when they were tiny babies/toddlers? This might be one of the silliest things I've ever read on MN!

I suppose that this is true for some profoundly disabled children, but in those scenarios, we're really talking about carers rather than SAHPs.

It certainly isn't true for most children!

No they’re not babies but they still need getting ready for, taking to and picking up from school. I personally don’t want my DC doing the same hours in an institution as FT work so I don’t want them to go to breakfast and after school clubs each day

Of course they don’t have the same needs. They aren’t babies and are at school from 9-3.

They are also able to attend breakfast club and after school club.

How are their needs the same when they are out of the house for 7 hours a day that they weren't before?

And no one cuts into their workday at 3 here, we use childcare..

I was a SAHM when my children were very small. It wasn't until I went back out into the adult world that I realised just how much I'd lost touch with who I am outside of motherhood.

My children are older now (youngest is upper key stage 2), and I wouldn't want to SAH now. I'm about to go to work full time, have been part time over the past year or so, and I'm so excited.

I don't "need" to work financially, but I absolutely want to.

Whaaat? It doesn’t magically get easier once they’re at school. They still have the same needs and someone has to cut into their work day at 9 and again 3 (which means leaving work at least 30mins before).

Thanks for your support! He does say he’s supportive of me retraining and working out what I want to do but the reality is that I currently do all housework, washing (doesn’t know how to turn the machine on!), food shopping, most of the cooking, all life admin, school runs, childrens stuff, gifts, bills etc basically run our lives whilst delegating the odd thing here and there like mowing the lawn or popping to the shops and a pick up from a club a week. It would take a huge shift in lifestyle for him to participate in some of these daily tasks that I do without thinking about. Just clearing up the kitchen in the day would be a big step!

he’s a high earner which complicates things, I realise that comes with a certain level of stress and responsibility and it’s not always 9-5 but he WFH so he does and can help with the children and he’s brilliant with them he’s just used to having a housekeeper to do the mundane stuff. If I got a job we would have to get a cleaner, he’s never cleaned a bathroom for example. He’s a very intelligent man, great actually and generous and shares all finances completely but the way we run our lives is probably unusual at best

Yes @NeedtostopusingMNsomuch I know a couple of women in that position.

@NeedtostopusingMNsomuch don't let him pull this shit on you! Tell him you expect his financial support while you retrain for a job which matches his in terms of opportunity/pay potential etc. in addition, once you are working you will absolutely expect him to do his 50% of child care (including time off when kids are sick or on school holiday) plus his fair share of housework. Fair's fair, right? He can only take the piss if you allow it!