To wonder about the OP whose daughter had ASD and she was going zero tolerance any associated behaviour for the happiness of her other child, herself and husband.

Yes but this tells you absolutely nothing because the children may not have had identical capabilities in the first place.

@fieldsofbutterflies ok. I think it's patronising AF to refer to helping an autistic child cope as training. We'll have to agree to disagree.

I referred to the person whom I quoted about 'training' an autistic child, what a shitty and inhumane way to talk about an autistic person. The behaviours mentione in OP were "control over the TV etc".

@fieldsofbutterflies yet you never see people talking about or referring to 'training' their children when they're NT, do you.

I don't think anyone is talking about "denying autistic people the one thing they enjoyed" but they do need to learn that they can't always do what helps them, regardless of the circumstances.

The word training might seem off, but I don't see it as any different to teaching neuro-typical children about table manners, or how to behave in restaurants etc.

Yes, you have to approach them differently and maybe use different techniques, but the general idea is the same. Children (autistic or otherwise) need to be taught how to behave in certain scenarios, and in autistic children, that includes dealing with sensory overwhelm or overload.

I say all that as an autistic adult who was taught how to handle scenarios that overwhelmed me as a child. It means that, as an adult, I can handle lots of scenarios that would have terrified me as a child or even a teenager, and it's made my life a lot easier. I'm also now confident enough to say when I'm overwhelmed and need space, whereas as a child I wouldn't be able to say that and would meltdown or shutdown as a result. I rarely need to do that these days.

What 'one thing that they enjoyed' are you talking about someone being denied?

Because this thread is talking about people being controlling of others, or harmful to others, or aggressive/rude/violent/breaking things/emotionally abusing and manipulating the household

No one is talking about being able to move about, or stim or do hobbies or have time out.

The abuse that is created to others in the household from controlling and manipulative behaviours is never or rarely acknowledged here. Unless its from a husband though. Then there is a recognition that no matter where the behaviour is coming from (MH, ADHD, ASD) it is still abusive.

That also stands for teenagers.

I think part of the problem, seen regularly on MN, is that we have people who aren’t ND themselves deciding what’s best for people who are ND.

Just because your child is ND, or you teach/work with ND people does not mean you get to speak over what ND people are telling you.

So often ND voices are spoken over by NT people who have some experience of living/working with ND people. That is NOT the same thing. Until you experience things for yourself, you have no idea what it’s like. None. And it shows in the comments made here.

Neither myself or any of the other ND voices here are suggesting that ND children should always get their own way. The full needs of the family need to be balanced and considered, and there are often conflicting needs which makes it hard for everyone.

I remember the last post and I’m so pleased that the OP is finding a way that works for her family. It’s bloody tough for parents, but don’t forget it’s tough for the kids too. They’re not “being difficult” for a laugh.

The problem is that NT people often view success as training an ND child to mask well and pass. Suppress their own needs. Thats what’s been repeated in many posts on this thread, often with misplaced pride. In the majority of cases this approach causes psychological damage which typically manifests as a burn out in the end. You might not see it yet. It might take years to reach this point but it’s so frequently the case for autistic adults who weren’t helped to develop healthy coping mechanisms. And by that I’m talking about mechanisms which are designed to support the needs of the autistic person rather than being designed to make the people around them happier.

Just for emphasis, I am at no point saying violence is acceptable. I am referring to all of the other behaviours being described. An autistic person never has cart blanche to hurt anyone else.

Of course us autistic folk still have to function in a world which is desperately lacking in compassion. Someone in a wheelchair? No problem, legit disability and everyone is happy to make reasonable adjustments. Autistic people though? Nah. They have to fit in with the rest of the world and fuck how much harm it does. Asking for adjustments is seen as unreasonable because you can just train autistic people to look more socially acceptable. So much better, right?!

Gah.

my points stand- willfully ignoring a child’s needs is traumatic. The stats say it all, other people have said it I don’t need to repeat them.

Most people aren't talking about ignoring a child's needs, though. They're talking about managing the needs of one person against the (different) needs of everyone else in the home.

I'm autistic myself and I'm eternally grateful that my parents had boundaries and taught me that certain behaviours weren't okay at certain times. I'm also glad they helped me overcome my sensory issues around maintaining personal hygiene - especially with brushing teeth and taking showers.

Helping autistic people cope with the real world isn't about ignoring their needs, it's about helping them balance their needs with other people's, and about teaching them appropriate ways of dealing with (eg) sensory overload or overwhelm without controlling other people's environments in order to do so.

That doesn’t sound like a success to me.

The person who posted it was quite clear it was not badly worded.

Hello, that was me!

I did wonder if I should post an update.

The biggest change has been that DD1 takes herself to her own bedroom to have a meltdown so she is no longer punching or kicking DD2, me or DH. She is finally using the strategies she has been taught over the years by us, teachers, outreach workers and counsellors.

I ended up having a rule that both DC go to their bedrooms when we return home from being out of the house. That has reduced my hyper-vigilance which has left me with more energy. DD2 (NT) is quite cross about this though.

DD1 seems much happier with far fewer meltdowns than before.

@fieldsofbutterflies yet you never see people talking about or referring to 'training' their children when they're NT, do you.

I think part of the problem, seen regularly on MN, is that we have people who aren’t ND themselves deciding what’s best for people who are ND.

Just because your child is ND, or you teach/work with ND people does not mean you get to speak over what ND people are telling you.

So often ND voices are spoken over by NT people who have some experience of living/working with ND people. That is NOT the same thing. Until you experience things for yourself, you have no idea what it’s like. None. And it shows in the comments made here.

Neither myself or any of the other ND voices here are suggesting that ND children should always get their own way. The full needs of the family need to be balanced and considered, and there are often conflicting needs which makes it hard for everyone.

I remember the last post and I’m so pleased that the OP is finding a way that works for her family. It’s bloody tough for parents, but don’t forget it’s tough for the kids too. They’re not “being difficult” for a laugh.

The problem is that NT people often view success as training an ND child to mask well and pass. Suppress their own needs. Thats what’s been repeated in many posts on this thread, often with misplaced pride. In the majority of cases this approach causes psychological damage which typically manifests as a burn out in the end. You might not see it yet. It might take years to reach this point but it’s so frequently the case for autistic adults who weren’t helped to develop healthy coping mechanisms. And by that I’m talking about mechanisms which are designed to support the needs of the autistic person rather than being designed to make the people around them happier.

Just for emphasis, I am at no point saying violence is acceptable. I am referring to all of the other behaviours being described. An autistic person never has cart blanche to hurt anyone else.

Of course us autistic folk still have to function in a world which is desperately lacking in compassion. Someone in a wheelchair? No problem, legit disability and everyone is happy to make reasonable adjustments. Autistic people though? Nah. They have to fit in with the rest of the world and fuck how much harm it does. Asking for adjustments is seen as unreasonable because you can just train autistic people to look more socially acceptable. So much better, right?!

Gah.

I think part of the problem, seen regularly on MN, is that we have people who aren’t ND themselves deciding what’s best for people who are ND.

Just because your child is ND, or you teach/work with ND people does not mean you get to speak over what ND people are telling you.

So often ND voices are spoken over by NT people who have some experience of living/working with ND people. That is NOT the same thing. Until you experience things for yourself, you have no idea what it’s like. None. And it shows in the comments made here.

Neither myself or any of the other ND voices here are suggesting that ND children should always get their own way. The full needs of the family need to be balanced and considered, and there are often conflicting needs which makes it hard for everyone.

I remember the last post and I’m so pleased that the OP is finding a way that works for her family. It’s bloody tough for parents, but don’t forget it’s tough for the kids too. They’re not “being difficult” for a laugh.

The problem is that NT people often view success as training an ND child to mask well and pass. Suppress their own needs. Thats what’s been repeated in many posts on this thread, often with misplaced pride. In the majority of cases this approach causes psychological damage which typically manifests as a burn out in the end. You might not see it yet. It might take years to reach this point but it’s so frequently the case for autistic adults who weren’t helped to develop healthy coping mechanisms. And by that I’m talking about mechanisms which are designed to support the needs of the autistic person rather than being designed to make the people around them happier.

Just for emphasis, I am at no point saying violence is acceptable. I am referring to all of the other behaviours being described. An autistic person never has cart blanche to hurt anyone else.

Of course us autistic folk still have to function in a world which is desperately lacking in compassion. Someone in a wheelchair? No problem, legit disability and everyone is happy to make reasonable adjustments. Autistic people though? Nah. They have to fit in with the rest of the world and fuck how much harm it does. Asking for adjustments is seen as unreasonable because you can just train autistic people to look more socially acceptable. So much better, right?!

Gah.

I think part of the problem, seen regularly on MN, is that we have people who aren’t ND themselves deciding what’s best for people who are ND.

Just because your child is ND, or you teach/work with ND people does not mean you get to speak over what ND people are telling you.

So often ND voices are spoken over by NT people who have some experience of living/working with ND people. That is NOT the same thing. Until you experience things for yourself, you have no idea what it’s like. None. And it shows in the comments made here.

Neither myself or any of the other ND voices here are suggesting that ND children should always get their own way. The full needs of the family need to be balanced and considered, and there are often conflicting needs which makes it hard for everyone.

I remember the last post and I’m so pleased that the OP is finding a way that works for her family. It’s bloody tough for parents, but don’t forget it’s tough for the kids too. They’re not “being difficult” for a laugh.

The problem is that NT people often view success as training an ND child to mask well and pass. Suppress their own needs. Thats what’s been repeated in many posts on this thread, often with misplaced pride. In the majority of cases this approach causes psychological damage which typically manifests as a burn out in the end. You might not see it yet. It might take years to reach this point but it’s so frequently the case for autistic adults who weren’t helped to develop healthy coping mechanisms. And by that I’m talking about mechanisms which are designed to support the needs of the autistic person rather than being designed to make the people around them happier.

Just for emphasis, I am at no point saying violence is acceptable. I am referring to all of the other behaviours being described. An autistic person never has cart blanche to hurt anyone else.

Of course us autistic folk still have to function in a world which is desperately lacking in compassion. Someone in a wheelchair? No problem, legit disability and everyone is happy to make reasonable adjustments. Autistic people though? Nah. They have to fit in with the rest of the world and fuck how much harm it does. Asking for adjustments is seen as unreasonable because you can just train autistic people to look more socially acceptable. So much better, right?!

Gah.

Worked perfectly for my DC. She no longer vocal stims

Yes I do thank you and the difference between the two.