A son is a son until he finds a wife, a daughter is a daughter for life

From the outside looking in I think that's how it would appear in dhs family but the reality is his mum favours her daughter's and granddaughters over her son's and grandsons. The females get financial help, unlimited free childcare (because they have girls) constant calls, constant meet ups and communications and endless praise for doing relatively normal day to day things.

The sons get hefty childcare bills whilst hearing how hard life is for said "poor" female relative from MIL, virtually no praise, the slightest mention of her favourites "struggling' financially prompts her to help financially and ignore the fact that the favourite has spent hundreds on nights out. The sons also get what little time MIL has left for them because most of her time is dedicated to her favourite female family members and there relentless demands but even then this time can often be interrupted by the females as they "need" aka want more childcare or her attention.

As a result MIL has a poor relationship with her son's and grandsons. She blames everyone but herself. I always encouraged DH and our boys to have a relationship with her but had to stop as she only hurt them by always putting them bottom of her list. Her other son's pulled back to for the same reasons I believe.

Thankfully not all the females in DHS family are only out for what they can get and actually do try do what's best for MIL but certainly a couple are and have fully taken advantage of MIL but she lets them.

You reap what you sow. If a mother chooses her daughter's over her son's then it's a self fulfilling prophecy that a "son's a son till he takes a wife"

I think everyone knows it’s not really ‘the norm’ for many people today. But it came from a description of social norms and is based in those sexist norms.

The posters saying dismissively that it’s ‘just bollocks’ are missing the point.

No idea but I hope not! My MIL considers me the daughter she never had and we model a good relationship; so am thinking my boys will do the same.

Definitely not true in my case , my mum and I have a dreadful relationship, I get on really well with my mil.

That's so true and that's one of the reasons why boys are more valued in Indian culture: they are expected to financially support their parents when they are older and live close to them.

That's the thing - the people who trot this saying out are just very invested in the idea that everyone conforms to an old-fashioned norm, and they can't really comprehend that many people, for many reasons, simply don't, and it's not a norm any more.

Just out of interest, have you read the thread?

I think everyone can see that it’s a sexist saying!

Do you think there is such a thing as social trends/ norms or do you think everyone operates in a sort of vacuum?

Yes, there is a lot of truth in that. I get on well with my SIL and DIL, as well as my son, but DD and I have the closest relationship.

Load of sexiest rubbish. We’re much closer with my husbands parents than mine. It’s about personalities and effort in relationships. And a very heteronormative comment to make.

My brother contacted my parents on birthdays/Christmas and mothers/father’s day. When in a relationship or no 😂 no more no less. I flit between could contact every day, might not talk for weeks. It’s whatever.

My dh contacts his parents when he wants/needs something. His sister will be in phone/text contact daily, always asking for childcare how to make this food or that food.

I do recall however even at the start of our relationship getting the “get him to come home more” “get him to call more” we got together as teenagers and my mother welcomed any random into the house by that I mean me or my brother could rock up with a new friend and they where in could sleep over, could wait for us if we where out, I wasn’t really allowed or welcomed at dh’s family home for many years so as such he wasn’t home much.

Then we moved into our own place. So I guess in their eyes he got a gf and fucked off, but if I had been welcomed and not made to feel so uncomfortable when I was allowed round they would have seen him far more.

I don’t push him to make contact, I buy the presents and cards mostly. With the odd reminder so maybe invite for a bbq or something.

My husband must have missed that memo thankfully.

I broadly agree with you here. This bit stood out though:

and where for some reason women persist in going head to head with each other competing for the limited attention he is willing to offer them.

I think the reason for this competition is based in misogyny too. Women have been hardwired to compete with each other for millennia; power was tied to men, so women competed to align themselves with men. Male attention was the prize because it equalled security and second-hand power. These patterns are hard to break.

From experience, I've found this to be frequently true, most sayings have some truth in them.

My own DH remained very close to his mum until she died. It's very normal in his culture for adult men to stay close to their parents though.

I do see a lot of truth in that statement in what I read on MN though. Men who are deemed to be too close to their mums are often frowned upon by people who seem determined that they should put their wives first. I don't usually see the same insistence that women shouldn't be too close to their parents.

I suspect that there are probably some double standards going on. Some women want their sons to remain close to them forever, but they don't necessarily want their husbands to be too close to their MILs.

Meaningless doggerel.

I’d never thought of it that way, but ain’t that the truth!! We tend to take on the mental load of present buying, arranging get togethers etc.
My in laws used to send my DH’s parking and speeding fines to deal with (his car was still registered at their address) until I told them where to stick them!!

Sorry but I’m another one who thinks it’s broadly true.
My friends and I all have children in their 20/30’s who all went off to university and now mostly live in different counties to their parents.
I have noticed the young women all regularly call/test: visit their parents whilst the young men due so much less. Even then it’s usually mum who is making all the effort with contact.
eg my friend's son is getting married in June. I was asking her about the arrangements and she seems to know very little. When her daughter got married she would spend lots of time telling me every detail,

If you'd always assume that, you'd be wrong and should check your agism and sexism because your one experience shouldn't be projected on to everyone. It stands to reason surely that there are going to be as many possessive controlling DiL who want to keep their sons mother in her place than there are the other way round, because that type of behaviour is based on the character of the woman, not her role, and women don't suddenly go from being perfectly reasonable to a nightmare the day their son marries. You can bet your life that women who treat their son as a possession and believe their DiL stole him were once DiLs who treated their husband as their possession and were jealous of his mum. Just as the sons who dont bother with their mums when they have a wife to run around after them are the same men that one day have wives that complain about their neglect of them and their family.

Anyway, the saying isn't women 'bleating', it's mainly just women commenting on what they see to be the case in our society where men are not encouraged to keep close ties with their family of birth in the way women are. Where they're excused familial and caring responsibility and where for some reason women persist in going head to head with each other competing for the limited attention he is willing to offer them.

Well of course it’s sexist but you only have to spend a couple of hours on munsnet to realise it holds water! Look at all the women on here who are mothering their husbands- doing all their washing feeding them every night, doing all the bloody cleaning, getting very little thanks. Their DHs are just extra kids!!!
Don’t like the saying don’t buy into the set up!

I was the only girl in my sibling group, I have quite a lot of brothers.

My mum used to say this to me. It drove me mad and made me feel like she expected me to be tied to her forever whereas my brothers got to go and live their own lives.

It's turned out that I've moved much further away than any of the boys. In fact, most of them still live less than 5 miles away from where we grew up. Only one has moved away.

With comments like this, it's no wonder that gender confusion is such an issue. Why would you want to be female with messaging like this?! When I was a child, I really wanted to be a boy, because this was the messaging I heard.

Was going to say the same!

My MIL had two sons - neither of which care for her very much because she's an absolute nightmare. Certain visits and birthdays etc are all done out of duty.

Whereas I'm very close to my mum, and DH is too.

It's easier for MIL to make out that I stole her child from her when in essence she's toxic, overbearing, negative and doesn't bring much to relationship at all other than asking for favours.

My MIL quoted this to me and it upset me but I don't understand why it was upsetting!

It seems mostly true in my experience too.
I have two older teen sons.
Maybe the fact that daughters (IME only) are favoured over sons all their lives has something to do with it. Like some kind of conditioning.

So to phrase it another way, a man achieves full independent adulthood when he has a family of his own to look after, whereas a woman will remain in the childlike role of “daughter” for their entire lives.

I’m surprised so many women embrace this sexist shite.