No phone for secondary school

If you don't think your child needs one then don't get them one. It's not compulsory. But I don't really see why you wouldn't get them one if you can afford it.

This idea from your OP - " I’m expecting dc to walk home with friends talking and socialising without the inclusion of a screen or mindlessly scrolling social media instead of listening to friends." - is outdated and based on your own experience of childhood that you are projecting.

That is just not how things are now, children/ young people relate in a different way to how they did when you were a child, and denying your kid a phone is denying them social opportunities.

It's not a fallout from lockdown times.

I'm in my 30's now and I had my first mobile phone when I was 11, most of my classmates did too.

I got a smartphone as soon as they were a thing, so did most other kids I knew.

Kids having tech is not a new thing.

I think YABU other than they don’t need a hugely expensive one. Smartphones are part of life whether we like it or not and kids have to learn to use and manage them.

Making sensible decisions about what WhatsApp groups to join is part of that - neither of mine are in class etc groups. There is one for my youngest daughter’s year group at secondary - I mean why? She just leaves immediately whenever she gets added. So is periodically talking to them and checking phones. They both avoid adding ‘randos’ (ie kids they aren’t friends with) as contacts - why would you want to message people who aren’t your mates or want them messaging you? It’s boundaries like any other type.

The most important thing as a parent of secondary-aged kids is for them to have interests and do things that are constructive outside school. So many have basically no hobbies, so they are bored and as a result entertain themselves on social media. Is gaming for example any better?

I’ve also taken phone away for a week or two if I’ve felt it’s needed. Tbh though neither of mine are overly obsessed with them.

If we applied that same logic to other things which have an age limit like drinking, smoking, 18 certificate films, driving etc. It wouldn't stand up. There is a reason we restrict some things for children.

The difference is, no one (even adults) needs to do those things, especially the vice ones. So of course it's better to never start to begin with.

They will eventually get a smartphone though.

This isn't a new thing. My DS got his first phone when he started secondary and that was in 2003. I thought he needed it because his school commute went from a local walk to 2 buses and I wanted him to be able to contact us if anything went wrong.

And as for kids walking round with their heads in their phones unaware of their surroundings -that describes 75% of the adults I passed in central London yesterday.

Half way through Year 8 and my child doesn't have a smart phone ...

I was a little unsure as to how this would work out once he started secondary as he is definitely in the minority.

He can check the school apps on the desktop computer at home and has no problems accessing homework. If there was a problem with homework then I would have a word with school as mobile phone ownership shouldn't be a requirement to an education!

He has a dumb phone in case we need to arrange any pick ups / meet ups or he's walking home. We also have a landline he can call people on.

He is very computer literate, and creative but doesn't do social media.

The sky hasn't fallen down on our heads! And there have been no real problems that I can think of, it's actually worked really well for us.

I think it has given him the chance to observe others behaviour around smart phone use and if he gets a smart phone in the future I think this will be really helpful as he can see the pitfalls.

I don't buy the argument that they need to learn how to use a phone at a young age otherwise they will be somehow naive and run into it blind when they eventually get one.

If we applied that same logic to other things which have an age limit like drinking, smoking, 18 certificate films, driving etc. It wouldn't stand up. There is a reason we restrict some things for children.

Kids do not have the level of emotional maturity to fully understand the world of social media. Teenagers are proven risk takers and it is the most dangerous age to be statistically for this reason.

Just my perspective, but I think it's worth holding out as long as you can!

I do wish there was a dumb phone available with a better text function, so like a smart phone but without the smart features! Or just limited features. Surely this would be worth making and would be a compromise! There is most likely a reason it doesn't exist, and I suspect the tech company's have a vested interest in keeping us all hooked!

YABU.

We live rurally about 7 miles away and mine catches the bus to and from school. If during the last lesson of the day the teacher keeps them in a bit later, he can easily miss the bus.

However, he keeps his phone in the bottom of his bag all day so doesn’t use it in school.

School required us to buy a (£700) laptop for him when he started secondary despite him having a perfectly good laptop at home already! Supposedly to do all his work on and use online course materials but some (dinosaur) teachers still insist on them carrying textbooks too. We get through a lot of bags with broken zips from the weight and strain of the laptop and books in it. I hate to think what it’s doing to the child carrying such a heavy load.

I found cohorts massively differ. The worst one we had was about 4 years ago and it was truly terrible from many points of view,the one after was largely uninterested ,the next one was split , but more kids used their phones appropriately and safely than not, the current one is largely uninterested again and we had no issues so far(knock wood).

The only other phones I know of are the old Nokia type where you had to keep pressing the same button to get to the letters you wanted. I’d be very happy to have a non-smart phone but has a proper keyboard, what brands do this as I’ll happily get one (I didn’t know they existed tbh).

@willWillSmithsmith there are a number of those kinds of models available in other countries, the US for example but not currently the UK. Another area being promoted by the Smartphone Free Childhood movement.

But they won't be leaving out friends on purpose, will they? They simply won't be able to tell the friend what's going on if that friend isn't part of the WhatsApp group. Its not rocket science. Oh & youre in for a shock if you don't think brands of trainers are a big deal to some teenagers (mainly boys) either 🤣 Don't you use your smartphone all the time to organise your entire life? Teenagers are no different. Put as many parental cobtrols/rules/restrictions in place as you need but just bear in mind once your DC are 18 & off to college/Uni there's nothing you can do about how addicted to tech they may or may not be. Best to introduce it early and gradually relinquish control to the point where they automatically put it on silent overnight etc & don't spend all day on it. My DS (16) has a friend whose Mum still treats him like a baby despite him being a really hard-working kid who is no trouble. No ps4, barely any phone data, no sleepovers during Easter (he wanted to go to one sleepover) as exams are a month away etc etc. I honestly feel sorry for him. I see a future where this kid moves out of home as soon as he can as his parents are just too controlling.

Schools shouldnt be asking children to use smart phones in class.

Dumb phones are fine for the purpose needed of being able to contact them.

Just because it's normal doesn't mean its right.

Parents need to take control of their childrens access to smartphones and stop trying to justify them as necessary. We create societal norms. Parenting is the greatest force for social change.

I get that parenting in a world that doesn't value the role of parenting is hard but outsourcing socialising our young to algorithms that don't have ethics or a soul is a recipe for disaster.

So no YANBU.

Lol, the stuff my friends and I got up to on desktops and laptops was pretty awful - porn, rotten.com, adult chat rooms, distance "relationships" with god knows who on MSN messenger... Our parents didn't even know how to check the browser history and relied on us to tell them how the computer worked and what emails were blatant scams.

Millennial parents have no excuse not to put safeguards on their kid's phones and check them, as we've been there and done that!

Not saying your kids have it, but I'm early 20s and I remember a stage where me and all of my friends in secondary school 'werent allowed social media'
Can't think of anyone not having it though. The kids who had phones had social media and hid it from their parents .
I think most parents are very naive when it comes to what their kids are doing on their phones

@StillCreatingAName I wrote a very long post , which I now lost so I'll try to summarise .

1. Smartphones aren't necessarily the issue. Usage is the issue. If it can be done on a phone, it can probably be done on a tablet or laptop . If your kids has a device with internet, it can happen.

1. I honestly believe you can strike a balance. Yes she had a phone in y6. The condition was that I get to check it, whenever ,wherever. I said no to tiktok and snapchat and explained why. She had no interest in other SM bar whatsapp. The phone has strict settings on internet usage. She doesn't have the password to her apple ID , so she needs permission and me actively putting it in if she wants an app. She always asks anyway. She asks permission to go on call and stays within hearing range.Phone goes away to charge at night and it also has usage limits. If I say the phone goes, it goes, no arguments. I might be completely deluded of course, but there have been a lot of advantages in her having it compared to none/very little issues. These rules are still in place now she's at secondary and she's still largely unbothered by them. Hopefully, by the time (if) she starts to rebel she'll have good/safe phone usage habits instilled in her.

The main advantage was the vast increase in her independence,freedom and confidence. From knowing she has me as backup in her pocket, to starting to problem solve herself (checking in with me if needed) , to having new experiences going out with her friends , to being home alone by herself (the kid would follow me to take the bins out!) and so on. I could tell you all the instances when having a phone was useful and even necessary, and it made HER life easier(it's not about me) but I'll end up writing an essay again.

Work in a school. No one wants them there. Including management.

this is where they are at. They want them prohibited.

https://educationhub.blog.gov.uk/2024/02/19/mobile-phones-in-schools-are-they-being-banned/

Yeah this @MoroccoMole Some secondary teachers would say 'get your phones out & take a photo of this too'. All homework is on phone apps plus laptops too. We buy reconditioned/secondhand phones from Music Magpie or CEX too so don't spend a fortune or buy the latest models. I honestly feel sorry for kids whose parents say no mobile til the kid is much older as they are definitely the odd one out & can't join in on group WhatsApp chats etc. I guarantee those strict (controlling/helicopter) parents have lovely smartphones which they use all the time!

I completely agree with this

I agree with you to a certain extent op. My DS currently uses my old phone and I bought him a new SIM card to put in it. I have refused to buy him a brand new phone for Xmas or his birthday because I know they can easily get lost or stolen or even dropped. However, I feel that now he is at secondary school and has more responsibility ie. Walking himself to and from school, I feel some comfort knowing that he has a phone with him should anything happen to him. I know that during my school days mobile phones weren’t around but I feel in this day and age, and with all the peado’s and weirdos hanging around, plus bullies now seem to be more aggressive than ever, I do feel that he should have a phone with him for this reason. Otherwise I’d make him wait until he was older to have a phone.

@StillCreatingAName OP are you a member of Smartphone Free Childhood? There are communities in every county. If you join your local one you'll find likeminded parents galvanising and sharing resources which might help you.

smartphonefreechildhood.co.uk/get-involved

@TickyTacky you say your son is only 11. So do you think that status quo will remain? That he'll still only be playing Angry Birds when he's 12/13/14, and not looking at Pornhub for example?

Its not just about school, but the transition to secondary school, and Y6 for many kids comes hand in hand with more freedom, walking to and from school, hanging out with friends aftershock with no set plans.
A phone of some kind is really useful in that respect. The world has moved on and just because we managed without, no everyone has one it's silly not to let pre-teens have some sort of mobile communication device.

I also advise getting a smart phone in Y6 rather than Y7 or later.
You know their school friends and their friends parents and they can learn how to use it sensibly in a lower risk social circle. They are more likely accept parental controls and regular checks on what they are sending....and other parents are checking too.

By the time they get to Y7 its difficult to control.
Unfortunately not being on snapchat does significantly limit social interactions and friendship groups once they get to high school.
While I have concerns about social media etc, I don't think my child being an outsider due to lack of a phone is a helpful or proportionate response to that.

The only other phones I know of are the old Nokia type where you had to keep pressing the same button to get to the letters you wanted. I’d be very happy to have a non-smart phone but has a proper keyboard, what brands do this as I’ll happily get one (I didn’t know they existed tbh).