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Original poster

AIBU to be angry about the benefits system

690 replies

Daffodilsinfebruary · 07/04/2024 16:23

I have recently discovered by using a free, independent benefits calculator called entitledto that had I applied for Universal Credit over 2 years ago, me and my family would be over £16,000 better off.

I had assumed that benefits were for either single-parent families or people unable to work due to disability.

The majority of our savings would have been from claiming 85% back in childcare costs. We also would have had a payout of over £200 each month in addition.

For context, we bring in just shy off £4,000 a month. I thought this was a very reasonable income and we would be entitled to nil.

I feel angry that we did not know about this. A friend of mine who I met through our children attending the same nursery told me she claims 85% back in childcare costs during a conversation in which I complained of my childcare going up £150.

I did further research and 19 billion pounds apparently goes unclaimed every year.

I’ve never claimed benefits in all my life and worked hard to get on the property ladder.

should I be angry that we didn’t claim, or take it in my stride.

I wonder how many other families who could have claimed but haven’t.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
11
Daisyblue77 · 09/04/2024 09:11

Nicetobenice67 · 07/04/2024 17:16

You cannot get help with your mortgage loan not sure this thread is real now or just a wind up

Yes you can. Its called smi, its a loan

PayBalanceInFull · 09/04/2024 09:11

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 09:07

Up to 30 hrs a week

What did you mean by building a pension with our £5633?

do the state not give everyone the same amount?

Private pensions are not even worth the money you put in. Better off paying your mortgage off sooner

Daisyblue77 · 09/04/2024 09:09

Daffodilsinfebruary · 07/04/2024 20:59

So I used the Turn2us calculator which has better explanations than Entitled To and the Universal Credit sum comes from the childcare costs it is the ‘up to 85% childcare costs back’ element coming into play. Initially I thought that was on top of the universal credit award, but now I understand it’s not. I’m not sure what’ll happen with my Tax Free Childcare account if I claim Universal Credit. Or how the transition to this would work.
I would be better off on universal credit than tax-free childcare as that is capped at £500 every 3 months (£2,000) a year.
i have attached screenshots. Appears the SMI can be applied for as well if we wanted to and they included this in the overall reward. Again, seems complicated and when we sell house we would pay it back.

I know we are fortunate to be in the position we are in, and I was shocked that we were entitled to universal credit. I then felt angry that I hadn’t known as I thought it was 85% back on nursery fees which is a huge saving. My son had been attending for 3 years so I backdated that back. But I realise that was incorrect, as someone mentioned on here it might have only been since my second child was born last year that meant I was eligible.
I appreciate the benefits system but I believe it is for people with misfortune, as any of us can lose our jobs or get bad luck in our lives/ relationships breakdown/ loss of a partner. I know of people who seem to be very well off on benefits and don’t have the stress of working/ they have no incentive to go to work and earn a living.

Dont forget the smi is repayable, you cant have tax free childcare and uc so will not be able to use tax free anymore.

PayBalanceInFull · 09/04/2024 09:08

Lougle · 09/04/2024 07:36

The difference is:

  • Your £5363 is permanent. The PP's wage + UC is temporary.
  • Your £5363 is building your future pension. The PP only has £4000 building their pension.
  • The PP has a huge childcare bill, you don't have a childcare bill.
  • You're working part time, the PP is working full time.

These high rates of UC aren't forever. They are a helping hand while raising children.

We have 3 children with SN. One of them is now an adult and will never be independent. When she transfers to UC in her own right, we will lose the child element for her, and the disability element. I will still be expected to care for her, and much of her UC will go to pay for any social care she receives. Day services charge £80-£200 per day. She will be expected to contribute. There is a formula, which allows for living expenses, then SS take 95% of the remainder.

So don't be jealous.

Show quote history

“So don't be jealous.” Laughable comment tbh

jealous is not the correct word. It’s anger that the government is giving out money, yes towards families who have young children. But for people who say they CAN afford it.

our Income was LESS than this amount when
My young children needed childcare and I was on statutory maternity leave(£136 PW). also tried to claim for UC / childcare help at the time when I was in between jobs as we were relying on my husband’s £50k salary at the time. The threshold was £50k around 8 years ago so we were declined on the first question - do you or your partner earn over £50k?

the amount you squirrel in a pension eg £200 equates to about £10 per month after retirement. As we’ve built a pension pot, we wouldn’t qualify for the low pension tax credits you’d get for those who have been on benefits all their lives.

i have undiagnosed SEN children and at the start of the 2 year waiting list to be referred to be assessed.

I’m glad the government are able to help you with somewhat with costs when your disabled children turn into adults.

The reason I don’t work the extra 5 hours a week is so that my extra 1 hour wage doesn’t go towards sending the children to an after school club. Makes zero sense as I would only receive 70% of that hourly wage after tax&NI

i knew that the early years would be expensive and we had just enough to get by. Didn’t even think the government would help, even temporarily. Yes we did use the 15 hour free funding from the age of 3-4? Can’t even remember the figures so I suppose it reduced our childcare costs by about 10%(?) for a year

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 09:07

Up to 30 hrs a week

Daisyblue77 · 09/04/2024 09:02

Who are you angry at? Information is widely available. Its constantly in the media. Its in the budget every year. Unless you never interact with the world i dont understand how you did not know

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:46

Sorry don't know why I put an x ...habit

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:45

I know they need to be working more hours but there are none available we work in a school she defo only does 15 she has asked for more hours but like I say so they must be ok with it x

Beezknees · 09/04/2024 08:42

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:40

Nope I work with a young lady with 2 school age children she does 15 hrs a week so don't know

Show quote history

UC rules for ages 3-12. If she's only working 15 hours, she will have a valid reason that exempts her.

AIBU to be angry about the benefits system
Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:40

Beezknees · 09/04/2024 08:38

You literally can't do that any more. The days of being able to work only 15 hours with school age kids stopped when UC was introduced. It's a minimum of 25, recently raised to 30.

Show quote history

Nope I work with a young lady with 2 school age children she does 15 hrs a week so don't know

Beezknees · 09/04/2024 08:38

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:33

Yes your right but they have kids at school and still do 15hrs like I say gets made up to 26grand ....think I need to have another baby ...oh know I'm 57 🤣🤣🤣 seriously though its shocking hopefully they are getting stricter

Show quote history

You literally can't do that any more. The days of being able to work only 15 hours with school age kids stopped when UC was introduced. It's a minimum of 25, recently raised to 30.

Nicetobenice67 · 09/04/2024 08:33

Babyroobs · 08/04/2024 23:47

Yes because it's the child related elements and costs that get people the UC. And they get the work allowances too.
I don't know how people are still just working 15 hours unless they are still on tax credits. On Uc , a lone parent with a child over 3 will soon be expected to look for up to 30 hours of work a week. The conditions of claiming are getting stricter.

Show quote history

Yes your right but they have kids at school and still do 15hrs like I say gets made up to 26grand ....think I need to have another baby ...oh know I'm 57 🤣🤣🤣 seriously though its shocking hopefully they are getting stricter

Mumof3girls9 · 09/04/2024 08:28

Unfortunately the benefits system is massively flawed and a lot of people are able to claim money that they perhaps don’t need. We don’t claim universal credit but from doing all the calculators we would be entitled to approx £340 a month . The reason we don’t claim is because between myself and my husband we bring in just under £5000 a month after deductions. We also receive dla for 2 of my children (which is spent on them) due to them having serious physical disabilities (this in turn is what makes us eligable for uC due to the disabled child and carers elements). Between our wages and this we are able to lead a very comfortable lifestyle and manage several holidays a year (just returned from florida) and the kids don’t go without anything. A system that allows us to claim UC on top of this has to be flawed And we don’t claim as it 100% is not right. I’m pretty sure though that there will be people in the same situation as us who do claim it because they can. Once I have to stop work to care for my children full time then we will look into claiming them at that point but not until then.

Vaccances · 09/04/2024 08:03

Youdontknowmedoyou · 07/04/2024 16:27

This is part of the reason why the benefits system is so broken. No one on that kind of income should need any benefits but, because tax credits destroyed the necessity to live on a normal wage, people expect so much more - landlords, service providers, retailers and manufacturers etc.

Edited

Tax credits have nothing to do with it, employers have been paying shite wages since money was invented & tax credits are just another name for income support which has been around for all of the post war period.

A working couple on 4k take home pay wouldn't be entitled to SFA.

Its the free childcare that is distorting this, its crazy, a postcode lottery and unaffordable for the country, if you can't afford the childcare, don't have children.

Mog65 · 09/04/2024 07:56

Shocked you're entitled to these benefits too tbh. Have you claimed now. Would be interested to hear how you get on. God luck

Yellowpingu · 09/04/2024 07:52

Applying for UC is an absolute ballache. We had to claim when Tax Credits ended. I’m disabled and get enhanced rate PIP but I still need to jump through hoops to ‘prove’ that I can only work part-time.

onedayiwillbecontent · 09/04/2024 07:50

I am on £2000 a month and do not claim benefits of any kind. I have children and I’m a single parent with a mortgage. If I had £4000 a month I’d be laughing!

Lougle · 09/04/2024 07:36

PayBalanceInFull · 08/04/2024 23:18

so do you bring home £4000 net income (after taxes etc)??

and you’re entitled to an extra £1333 from the government?

the total of £5333 is £70 short of what my husband and I both bring in - no child benefit payments and a higher tax rate on what the government deems a minimum household income to live on as you need the universal top up to a minimum living wage??!
for context, I work 30 hours so I can pick the kids up from school (start at 8!) and not have to pay wrap around care.
my husband works 9-5.30 - box standard hours but earns just above the child benefit threshold so we don’t even get that!

I’m so angry at the government benefit system . Apologies if there’s been further updates/context to the £4000 but I don’t understand why we work in (slightly!) higher than average paid jobs to get the same money as someone on benefits

The difference is:

  • Your £5363 is permanent. The PP's wage + UC is temporary.
  • Your £5363 is building your future pension. The PP only has £4000 building their pension.
  • The PP has a huge childcare bill, you don't have a childcare bill.
  • You're working part time, the PP is working full time.

These high rates of UC aren't forever. They are a helping hand while raising children.

We have 3 children with SN. One of them is now an adult and will never be independent. When she transfers to UC in her own right, we will lose the child element for her, and the disability element. I will still be expected to care for her, and much of her UC will go to pay for any social care she receives. Day services charge £80-£200 per day. She will be expected to contribute. There is a formula, which allows for living expenses, then SS take 95% of the remainder.

So don't be jealous.

Imisssleep2 · 09/04/2024 07:35

I can't see what being angry about it will achieve, it's annoying you didn't know about it before but just start claiming now and appreciate the extra income I guess.

WithACatLikeTread · 09/04/2024 07:16

Blondeshavemorefun · 09/04/2024 06:13

Tbh I don't I understand about tax credits and uc

I know all are swapping to uc

But why such a diff for you in amount

From nearly £100 a week to £60 ish a week

Show quote history

It was very generous hence why some could get second homes and significant savings.

I can't seem to find that second home post now. 🤔

KestrelMoon · 09/04/2024 07:05

smooththecat · 09/04/2024 01:31

I have to say too, as it’s relevant, the government seriously need to raise the tax threshold (personal allowance), probably to around 15k.

It would be there if they hadn’t frozen it. The extra taxes that has caused is more than the money back from the NI cuts. It’s equivalent to a CF taking £20, flipping a £2 coin back and pretending you are £2 better off.

KestrelMoon · 09/04/2024 06:52

@Queijo
”But I had to do all the research myself, there was no ‘oh your brain is fucked here’s what you need to do’ leaflet!”

I think this is why so much goes unclaimed. Not because of people not knowing they can claim, but because of people with disabilities that affect their brain/cognition not getting any help to claim. It is awful that you had to figure it out in your own, while having so many seizures.

Blondeshavemorefun · 09/04/2024 06:13

ChishiyaBat · 08/04/2024 16:06

It's a shit system and they fuck over people who need help the most. My granddaughter has cerebral palsy, a relatively mild case, but she is still far behind other children her age, she can't jump or climb, she can walk short distances, but struggles, falls over a lot and injures herself, has sleep difficulties and other problems. My daughter applied for benefits, to be told she isn't disabled enough. She is 2 was told to claim again when she is 3 later this year, so she will, but I don't hold out much hope.
I have been on tax credits for many years, £78 a week child tax credits and £20 a week working tax credits, which helped immensely, but now it no longer exists and I was forced onto UC and am now only entitled to £249 a month, I am desperately trying to find a 2nd part time job, no luck so far though, Not to mention they didn't pay me for the 1st month because they fucked up!
I swear they only got rid of tax credits so they could cut peoples money!

Tbh I don't I understand about tax credits and uc

I know all are swapping to uc

But why such a diff for you in amount

From nearly £100 a week to £60 ish a week

LeedsMum87 · 09/04/2024 06:03

I’m confused as to why you’d be entitled to £14k in benefits if you bring home £4k a month?
child benefit for more than one child?
tax free childcare?
funded hours for over 3 year olds?

NoThanksymm · 09/04/2024 03:42

This is 100% your fault. Not the systems.

that being said, depending on your country you can ‘correct’ your taxes back so many years (Canada is seven) so you could still get that 16k.