AIBU to feel disheartened by the lack of support and the presence of a crab bucket mentality among some women on here?

I'm not based in Britain, so I don't have a much authority speaking about Tories. But I remember Thatcher etc, and how vicious she was. She really seemed to hate WC people. So I'm always baffled how anyone can align themselves with that party if I'm honest. Granted, I'd be a leftie by nature, but still. But, as I say, not based in Britain, so merely an outsider looking in.

It really is.

The poster knows from real life and especially from MN, that 99% plus of the population don't need it specifying.

But they're usually the same posters that jump on to threads about Tory policies that disproportionately damage women as in single mothers, working mothers, public sector workers etc to announce they're going to vote Tory because 'they know what the definition of a woman is' and all those 'biological women' who are very literally suffering under a Tory government can just fuck off and be grateful that at least the Tories know what a woman is, when those women can't adequately house, feed or clothe their children..

Hmmm. Your post contains a lot of things that you think women should be doing. Lots of "should do" this and that.

Not everyone will agree with you about the government (I'm not a Tory, but there are plenty of people on here who are, and that's fine). Plenty of people will already believe that the government is doing its best for future generations.

The difficulty with your post OP, is that it contains a lot of expectations that people will share your opinions and views. Not everyone will.

I don't see a lot of downright nasty posts, but I do see posts that are blunt. The problem is that with the written word it can be very difficult to discern tone. As others have said, this is typically more on AIBU - the specialist boards tend to be less blunt. AIBU/Chat are designed for sharing opinions really, whereas other boards are more naturally geared towards advice and support eg/SEN board, property, relationships etc.

I take your point that life is rarely as simple as the solutions that are sometimes offered, but as readers we all only get a glimpse into each others' lives. And sometimes it takes an outsider to offer up a radical solution, or to make you think seriously about an idea you'd previously dismissed.

And of course, there are sometimes those posts which are infuriating. Sometimes we just need to vent, and that's fine. But other cases where a poster expects some kind of magic solution where very clearly their expectations are unreasonable or unrealistic - it's hard to know what to say other than pointing out the obvious.

I think for sure there are posts which feel a bit harsher than others, but I think overall there are way more supportive, kind, helpful comments. And sometimes the most helpful comments are the ones that the poster doesn't really want to read - but probably needs to.

Also, the people that you're judging for not commenting kindly enough to those who are wealthier - you have no idea what they're going through. When Jenny is worried about how she's going to put food on the table for the rest of the week, it can be really hard to drum up empathy for Julie who's posting about whether she can afford to put her second child through private school. Sometimes, with the best will in the world, it's hard to be kind and supportive when you're struggling to survive. People aren't robots and emotions can influence what's said.

I don't think MN is any better or worse than other social media platforms. I like MN because it provides a really interesting cross-section of opinions - just look at this post, perfect example. Lots of varying comments and views and people disagreeing - that's what makes it such a fascinating place.

🤣🤣🤣 it doesn't happen often

Oh well

Where crabs in a bucket claw the ones who are trying to escape, back in.

Basically, everyone's being dragged down..

Stop being so bloody reasonable fgs 😂

The thing I like about mumsnet is its a vast range of different people with different backgrounds who can really see things from all angles and have no issue calling me out on my shit. If I want to talk to people who think the same as me or who wont be honest because they don't want to hurt my feelings I'd talk to the people in my real life but that's not always helpful.

It's really really tedious to bring this into every single discussion.

Hilarious and proving the OPS point.

No it isn't the case at all that 'most people with problems are doing something wrong that a lifestyle change could fix'.

Disability? Poverty? Cancer? Educational disadvantages? National housing crisis? In those situations where is someone is doing something wrong and could just make better choices?

Oh, and people in serious debt aren't in that state because of buying Heinz beans and buying Morrisons beans won't get them out of it.

That doesnt accord with your examples though?

If that is the mentality you are referring, I see that mostly applied when someone posts about buying a house, or having a holiday or deciding on a job or whatever and someone else comes along and says 'dont know you that people are living in ditches and eating their shoes, what a tone deaf post'

Wanting to drag down anyone that is not on the bones of their arse and suffering poverty.

Because the OP mentioned women, this being predominantly a female user base and implied that women dont support other women and we should.

So Im specifying (as one needs to these days) that Im referring to women. Biological women

What is a crab 🦀 bucket mentality?
And YABU OP, soz.

What difference does it make whether they are biological women or not if you're not going to support them anyway?

Agreed, any attitudes and traits that were forged through suffering from lack of empathy are unlikely to be valuable in the greater scheme of becoming a decent human. However, that was a hugely revealing post though as, while I don’t believe at all that slapping and being slapped creates a “ winner”, I am often left with the impression that the hardest hitters on these posts have that kind of ambition: having suffered from what they perceive as male aggression, they want to adopt it.

Imagine someone wasting so much time and effort trying to do this on an internet forum when the people they hate so much are most likely living a life of luxury, relishing their wealth and laughing at them.

There's nastiness but there's loads of support too. As I said, it just a microcosm of society in general. One can choose to ignore, to read but not participate, or read and participate. Simple as that really.

This forum was something I started browsing two or three months back because I was on bed rest and it got hard to hold a book ( or I have slack arm muscles!) I was taken aback by the acrimony and nastiness so, no, it’s not society as I know it.

The cost of living crisis has hit every country. So easy to blame "the government" for every single thing and expect there to be an easy fix.

Do you think men got ahead by having a “brotherhood” and in which they were only ever nice and lovely and kind and uncritical and uncompetitive and unconditional in their praise for each other?

Maybe they would cause the world and women far less problems if they had been. I don’t think ‘men’ is a bar to aim for.

I really dislike the “sisterhood” mentality, meaning that we can’t possibly say anything negative about a woman’s behaviour, or only offer unconditionally positive encouragement. I don’t even raise a toddler that way, I certainly don’t want to treat a fellow human being that way.

Do you think men got ahead by having a “brotherhood” and in which they were only ever nice and lovely and kind and uncritical and uncompetitive and unconditional in their praise for each other?

Also the irony of you criticising a huge section of women with a blanket statement is quite funny! 😁

This.

TBH does it need pointing out that others have it worse? I’m pretty sure we’re all aware of that, and it doesn’t need to be centred in every thread. It’s rarely bought up to provide a sense of perspective either, rather as a shorthand for ‘shut up’. Not every thread has to be about those at the bottom (and trying to demand that they be is more likely to achieve the opposite - making people hostile to your ‘cause’).

Personally I'd prefer a place that's robust rather than toothless. As I said earlier, if I'm not feeling up to it, I just don't post.

Women aren't a social class, and the working-class consistently act against their own interests anyway, so to expect women to act collectively is probably unreasonable.

If they did, we'd have a very different political landscape. Our parties, Unions & institutions would probably look very different.

How that would shape things in a Capitalist economy is an interesting thought though.

Or is that just society now? Idk.