For DH to insist on vaginal birth not ceasarean

@Vod I don't want to get up at 6am to care for my toddler. But I have to.

My epidural made my horrendous instrumental delivery far more likely.

We're all going to be influenced by our own stories and experiences. The key thing, though, is that it's the woman's right to make her own informed choices from the medically feasible options available and unless this woman's husband happens to be her obstetrician he has no right to insist on anything.

Then no woman should be getting pregnant at all because it’s always going to be a risk.

Homebirth is a risk
vaginal birth is a risk
c-section is a risk
epidurals are a risk

Giving birth at all is a risk.

Hell, going out of your front door is a risk.

Because you don't want to.

Additionally, you're failing here to factor in the risks to a woman who feels the need for pain relief not getting it. We don't have good data on women who are denied epidurals, for obvious reasons, and they rather than all women giving birth vaginally are the appropriate control group.

While we're anecdoting, I've always wondered whether I'd have been able to avoid an instrumental delivery if I'd been given the epidural I was so desperate for. Unfortunately, I had nothing left in the tank to push because the pain was so exhausting.

I've had both vaginal deliveries and an emergency c section and I can say from personal experience the section recovery was far more painful. I laboured for ages first too so that didn't help matters at all as I didn't escape labor pain either. In one vaginal delivery I had an episiotomy with no numbing and grazes to my labia in another and even then the recover wasn't as painful as my section so in my opinion a section is far from less painful and I never understood the notion that it's the 'easier' way out.

I 100% support a womans autonomy over her own body and no man should ever get to 'insist' on anything.

However! If the tables were turned and it were men who give birth..... I know I would have an opinion! I would prefer that DH tried to birth vaginally because it's safer for both - babies who don't experience labour are at greater risk of admission to NICU with TTN, they also are at risk of a whole host of longterm issues due to lack of exposure to the vaginal microbiome. It also can lead to issues with breastmilk supply.

I would also be concerned at the risk for future pregnancies - higher chance of abnormal placenta location which can lead to massive haemorrhage and hysterectomy. Greater risk of uterine rupture should they go into labour in the future.

So I personally would wish they would consider attempting vaginal birth but I certainly wouldn't insist on anything and probably would keep my opinion to myself.

However op asked why the DH might feel this way.

It's certainly preferable to him wanting her to have an elcs so that her vagina remains intact - some gross men actually do think that way.......

@SouthLondonMum22 A risk is still a risk. If you don't need to medically take that risk, why take it? The side effects of having an epidural for me nearly resulted in my baby passing though so for me, I'd have rather been in dire agony than take thar risk that again.

But is safe and is used many, many times every single day as babies are born. Because the risks are small.

I wanted to feel as little pain as possible so had an epidural.

This time I’ll be having an elective c-section because I’m having twins and don’t want to attempt a vaginal birth.

I simply wouldn’t have had children if I had no say over my body giving birth.

Yes, there really can't be two opinions on this.

@Newsenmum Yes but every intervention carries risk. Birth is painful, of course it is. And I don't think all women are informed re epidural risk; I certainly wasn't with ny firstborn and in retrospect I would have refused.
I'm a hands-off homebirther since though so you can probably guess where I sit re interventions.

So does the entire birth. I don’t get your point. As long as a woman is educated on pros and cons of each treatment she should have the choice.

@Newsenmum No, not "just because." Because an epidural carries risks to both mother and baby.

But it might be the kind of trauma they prefer. Personally I wanted a c section over vaginal trauma.

Obstetricians frequently have c sections for their own births.

And some people like the practicality element. This isn’t really the reason it happens though is it.

And everyone feels pain differently. If the pain makes them want an epidural, they need an epidural. People take a paracetamol for a headache and yet women are told they must go through several hours of contractions just because.

Why cant she opt for surgery as opposed to quite likely vaginal tearing and trauma?

You make it sound like surgery is free of "tearing and trauma". It really isn't.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6817762/
some of the factors
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2008/jul/11/nhs.health1
15 years ago but it has some stats on how many deliveries are actually straightforward. Less than 50%. And it references older NICE guidelines which don't allow elective C-sections.
I've had a quick google for more recent figures but can't find any

@Newsenmum I'm not sure an obstetrician would advise a c-section so that the mother could attend Little Johnny's parent's evening a week Tuesday?
Or an epidural because mother doesn't want to feel the discomfort of contractions?
Surely they would only advise if medically advantageous?

My DH was the opposite, tried to talk me into a C Section. It was worry of the unknown of labour on his part. My mum also tried the same! Luckily I was pretty sure of what I wanted so I could just ignore.

Ultimately your friend needs to listen to and trust her inner voice and tune other voices out.

Why cant she opt for surgery as opposed to quite likely vaginal tearing and trauma? We women do have rights now you know. It’s like how we don’t need to have sex the second we start our periods. It’s a woman’s own body and she can look at the risks and decide what she wants to go through. Maybe you’ve had a great experience. Many women have not. Obstetricians quite frequently choose to have a section for themselves.
I look back and am annoyed I got so caught up in the vaginal birth brigade. Twice. 😳
And no woman has an epidural to avoid all pain. You have to have started labour to get an epidural and therefore will not have been pain free. Also, shit, why shouldn’t women not want pain? Imagine if it was men doing this.

I don’t think it’s bonkers at all. 🤔 Clearly you have a very different view or experience of birth.

I agree with @thebestinterest. Ateotd, in cases of "normal" pregnancy and labour, I don't think it's reasonable to increase the risks for both mother and baby unless medically necessary.
I was incredibly surprised when I read on here the other day that a woman can opt for an elective c-section purely for the reason she doesn't want a baby passing through her vagina or she has a parents evening to attend near to her due date. Or she can opt for an epidural purely because she doesn't fancy the idea of any pain.

From NHS:

”If after discussing all the risks and hearing about all the support on offer you still feel that a vaginal birth is not an acceptable option, you should be offered a planned caesarean. If your doctor is unwilling to perform the operation, they should refer you to a doctor who will.”

Why would a doctor be unwilling?

Yes and yes. See NICE guidance discussed at various points in the thread.

Showing my ignorance here but can you elect for a CS without medical reason? Is this a fairly new thing?

Yes, there've been a loooot of posts on this thread from posters who evidently haven't realised that their inability to understand doesn't reflect badly on anyone other than them.