'Clean your own house'

Not sure why you’re so offended by that. PP has just offering the other side of the coin.

In 2024, many mortgages/rental prices require two full-time salaries, as opposed to the one salary required 50 years ago. This means lots of the unpaid work is now outsourced—childcare, cleaning, pet care, cooking (Deliveroo, etc), laundry, gardening, food shopping. Most of us who have two full-time workers in our households don’t partake in all of the outsourcing options, but many of us utilise some. For me, it’s a cleaner once a fortnight and a shopping delivery mid-week.

I don’t want to hire a cleaner precisely because it will most likely be a woman and I wonder whether it is progressive to have another woman tidy up for us, especially if you have teenagers. Where do they learn responsibility for the mess they made.

The deal in my house is the kids need to tidy up their rooms and their playroom so it is clear for the cleaner to hoover and dust, if the room is messy, she doesn’t do the cleaning part and they do it themselves after school. My cleaner doesn’t tidy up, the house is tidy so she can clean properly. She’s an absolute god send.

Ditto my brother. There's a job for the cleaner so what's the problem?

@EmilyPlay

It does doesn't it. Is there a problem with that? The OP said 'everyone she knows has a cleaner' I said 'I don't know anyone who has a cleaner' Was I not allowed to make that comment without several posters jumping down my throat and reading more into the comment than what I said?
So the OP made a statement. You made a statement then I made a statement. And you took offence at my statement. Why? I didn't say anything disparaging to you.

You probably do. Most people don't walk around telling everyone they have a cleaner.

I can cook. I can cook pretty well if o say so myself. So an alternative to eating out is cooking for myself.

If a restaurant serves substandard food, I will complain.

Ditto:
doing my nails
Gardening
Washing my windows

And a host of other services I pay for that I could^^ do for myself but choose to employ someone else to do.

There is nothing wrong with having a cleaner.

There is something wrong with having a cleaner and then complaining that they are a nuisance / don't clean in precisely the way you expected / are too loud / are too quiet / are occasionally off sick etc. A lot of the posts about cleaners on Mumsnet are from people who have a cleaner and don't actually like what the cleaner does. And if you aren't happy with your cleaner, simply not having one is certainly a potential solution to that problem.

It's also not at all comparable to hiring a plumber or a plasterer, because a plumber or plasterer does work that most people are not actually capable of doing because they haven't been trained to do it. Those are skilled jobs. But most families absolutely are capable of doing their own Hoovering and wiping down their own surfaces, so cleaning your own house IS a perfectly reasonable alternative to suggest to someone who is having problems with their cleaner.

I am the only one who dusts, I am always telling the whole family this as I do it. Equally, everyone appears to be sitting down, the teenagers, DH and muggings here is still cleaning and cleaning especially if we have friends coming over at the weekend for drinks or food, I am sure that is the only time the house is spotless. I work full time so it isn’t like I have all the time in the world but the to DH he works away loads and commutes so he is in late. My 17 year old is constantly telling me he doesn’t see the mess and he likes the character it brings to his room. Piled high dirty cereal bowls and old new clothes over the floor, college books and folders and the worse, wet towels!!

I actually don’t think my DH notices dust except cobwebs, he just wants it to be everything away and tidy, he’s massively into his cooking at the weekends and I think he just wants to be ready to go and in his mind tidy equates to clean, in my world the detail is important😂

Likewise.

But then I don't live in London.

My DH has suggested a few times that we get a cleaner and one time gave an example he had noticed his bedside table was dusty. I told him he was welcome to dust at any time!
I'm sure he suggests it to make himself feel less bad that he does barely any cleaning.

Yeah agree - just hire one of you want or don’t

DH wants to hire a cleaner so he can come back to a spotless home, we both work full time but I still think it’s not very nice.

I don’t want to hire a cleaner precisely because it will most likely be a woman and I wonder whether it is progressive to have another woman tidy up for us, especially if you have teenagers. Where do they learn responsibility for the mess they made.

I have a cleaner. Our house is a passable pig stye and would be unliveable without her. She is brilliant.

🙄 sounds like you’re the one with a chip on her shoulder OP

@SabreIsMyFave exactly! Total
unabashed sexism!!

Yes they do! On every single post about men not pulling their weight in the house.

Can you imagine men having this conversation EVER?!

Honestly l! It's such internalised sexism to think I MUST clean my own house, even if I can pay someone else to do so whilst I go out and earn money.

Then to talk about feeling ashamed to mention it.

I don't spend £45 a week on cigarettes or cars I can't afford to buy.... But plenty of other people do & don't feel bad about mentioning it!

Definitely not normal in my world either 😆

I don't care who has a cleaner, but I would say it's only been the last 10 years or so when it has become an acceptable norm without being said with almost a shame for having one.

I'd love one, but I cannot stand anyone touching my mess. Or my things (mostly mess). I am ASD so this makes a difference - half the time I don't even want people in my house! Okay, all the time.

Me and one friend are the only people in my town I know without a cleaner
And I'm pretty sure I live in Peak MNshire.

I've literally never seen anyone say "clean your own house" in fact the opposite I'm always seeing people say "outsource as much as you can"

(Although I wouldn't compare it to plumbing as that is a skill you need qualifications for some aspects of it )

@Clangered · Today 10:04

I’m working class, childless, permanently wfh and have a cleaner. My mum is horrified.

I remember my mum getting all sniffy when I got a dishwasher some 2 decades ago. I was working 3.5 days a week in quite a busy/demanding job with a heavy workload, and had 2 infant aged children, and she said 'why on earth have you got a dishwasher, normal women wash the dishes in the sink.'

I said, 'because I work, I have NO help from anyone, I have 2 small children, and I am the only fucker who ever washes a cup! If you want to come to my house and do my washing up for me 3-4 times a day, then feel free. Otherwise I am keeping the bloody dishwasher.' She was like and said 'neither me, or your grandma and great grandma, or any of your aunts - have ever had a dishwasher, how ridiculous. It's laziness that's what it is. You should be washing up yourself like a normal housewife!'

She never said anything to my brother like this... Oh WAIT, he could not do a fukking thing wrong!

I also remember DH - many years ago when we first lived together - saying to me (when I said I hate housework) 'you should take pride in cleaning your home. You're a woman and should enjoy tootling about cleaning.'

He is not as bad now, but he has this habit of complimenting me for 'doing a good job of the hoovering,' or 'doing a good job of cleaning the bedrooms.' and occasionally says 'aren't you a good wife, making the house so clean?' ..

But he rarely makes any positive comments if I do the garden, clean the car, sort out the shed or garage, or do anything generally 'unfeminine.' 🙄Leave da menz to do da menz jobs. Keep to your wifework wumman!!!

My dh is one of those men, just because ypu havent cone acrss any doesnt mean they dont exist. For me cleaning is boring (appreciate its not the same for everyone) , I do it because it needs to be done but I wouldn't say I take pride in it, mainly because I don't enjoy it. He does. I didn't say cleaning itself was frivolous but the act of having a cleaner often is considered to be. You seem to have taken my post as some kind of judgement on people that have cleaners, it isn't. The op asked why people thought that way and I offered up some suggestions. For my own part I couldn't give a toss, whether someone has a cleaner or not. They can choose to spend their money however they want to.