Page 7 | Should I tell this mum the truth or a kind lie?

Exegete · 2024-03-22T23:39:44+00:00

DD7 goes to school with a little boy with a disability (he has difficulties walking and doesn’t talk). They’ve been in the same class since reception and DD has always been occasionally complaining about him hitting her. Never anything serious, but she would often mention (usually without looking distressed) that he had grabbed her glasses off her face, pushed her in the line or slapped her. They were good friends and would often play together but he would sometimes suddenly get angry without any warnings. He does also hit other children, but DD is definitely one of his favourite. I saw him recently on a school outing, one minute he’s all smiles and giggles, the next minute out of the blue he grabs a child and pushes him to the floor. I explained to DD that he doesn’t mean to hurt her and that he gets overwhelmed when frustrated and she can tell him to stop or walk away when he’s aggressive. I thought it would get better as he grew up. Well the boy is now turning 8, he’s bigger and stronger and it got worse. Today the boy’s mum tells me she’s organising a little birthday party for him (a play date and cake with a few friends at their home). She asked if DD was free, I (stupidly) said she was, thanked her for the invitation and I would get back to her. So I didn’t really say yes she’ll come, but I also said we had nothing planned that day. I thought DD would be happy to go (she did go to his birthday last year and had a good time). Well she firmly refuses to go. She said he shoved her in the railings while lining in the playground today again, he does that all the time now, she just doesn’t bother telling me or the teacher because there’s nothing we can do. So now what do I tell the boy’s mum? I don’t know her well at all, I feel for her, I’m sad my DD and her son are not friends anymore, but I also won’t force DD to go if she’s scared of him. So my idea is that I need to put on my big girl’s pants and tell the mum the truth. As gently as possible. That I’m sorry but DD doesn’t want to go because her son hits her when he’s upset and she’s a bit scared (how do I word it?!). Then my husband tells me being honest is cruel and selfish, that a little lie (“sorry we have other plans”) would spare their feelings. But I’m shit at lying, and also I already said we were free that day so she’ll know and I’ll hurt her feelings even more… Yanbu: tell the truth (how?) Yabu: tell a white lie

Jennalong · 23/03/2024 09:09

" I told ( dd name ) it's ( the boy ) birthday , she says she won't be going because she has been hitting her more than usual lately , and sorry to say it's hurt her feelings enough to refuse to go "
I hope he has a lovely day .

Snugglemonkey · 23/03/2024 09:09

LAMPS1 · 23/03/2024 04:48

OP, please don’t make up an excuse. The mum needs to know that the school aren’t managing her child’s needs properly and that her son is becoming isolated from his peers because of that.

Tell the mum the truth. Yes it will be hard for her to hear but shouldn’t be glossed over, now you know about it, as that helps neither child.

You can do it in a kind and gentle way. it is a shared problem that you both need help from the school to solve.

Tell her that you were very surprised by your DD’s reaction when you mentioned the party in that she was adamant that she was fed up of being hurt and pushed about by him and didn’t want to expose herself to any more of it than necessary at school, so wouldn’t be going to his party. Tell her how upset you were to hear her say that, not only for your own DD, but also for her son, because it seems she has become a target for him to take out his frustrations on and obviously that isn’t being monitored, which neither of you can allow to continue.
Ask her to have a word with the teacher, about her son’s growing isolation from his friends because of this issue and tell her you will be doing the same so that you can both find out how it will be managed properly going forward. Tell her you feel for her in this situation but you are sure she understands that you too, must advocate for your own child.
Finally, tell her that as your DD is upset about it all, you have made other fun day trip arrangements for her in lieu of the party.

Then talk to the class teacher urgently about this and tell her what has happened. Insist that a new and much more effective strategy is put in place to safeguard your DD from this little boy as it has become a growing daily occurrence which is now seriously impacting her health and well-being. Tell the teacher that you have asked your DD to alert the teacher or TA to every incident where this little boy slaps, pushes or is otherwise bullying her and that you insist that all such incidents are recorded properly as you will be doing the same at home to help monitor the situation. Arrange a follow up meeting date to show how serious you are about this being managed properly. When you get home, make a record of what was said and date it.

This. I do not think that lying is helpful for anyone in this instance.

TheFancyPoet · 23/03/2024 09:07

Schools are very cowardly these days. They are keeping kids in who are a genuine danger to others. Disability is not excuse to physically assault other children

Westsussex · 23/03/2024 09:06

You definitely need to tell the mother, and the way you've worded it is perfect.

The school should probably also be advised, as they'll need to monitor the situation in class.

Hitting is dangerous, and ultimately, no matter how hurtful it could be, we can't all just burry our heads in the sand to protect peoples feelings. Children come first.

You've done well to think about telling her, your husband is wrong. Xx

fleurneige · 23/03/2024 09:05

If I was his mum, I would like people to be honest and tell me. Nicely, calmly, with empathy- but I'd want, I'd need, to know. So you need to find the courage to ask her for coffee, and tell her. In the nicest possible of ways.

ZebraD · 23/03/2024 09:03

I don’t think you need to lie. I think you could say that you are really sorry but there was an incident at school that has left your daughter feeling really sad and doesn’t want to be friends with him for the moment. You can add that it’s really sad and hopefully they will sort it out. See if she questions the incident, at which point you can explain.
however, I don’t think you should be telling your daughter that he can’t help it and the school should be implementing some coping mechanisms for the boy. What happens when he is a teenager and gets mad?! Crazy!

Pinkdelight3 · 23/03/2024 09:03

I explained to DD that he doesn’t mean to hurt her and that he gets overwhelmed when frustrated and she can tell him to stop or walk away when he’s aggressive. I thought it would get better as he grew up. Well the boy is now turning 8, he’s bigger and stronger and it got worse.

This is awful. I understand how you've tied yourself in this knot, but you must see - you're teaching your DD, at a really fundamental impressionable age - that men can be violent to her and they don't mean it, to feel sorry for them, and the onus is on her to make him stop. This really needs addressing properly. Whatever the boy's problems, they are not hers to suffer and endure. Thank god she had the strength (albeit fear) to say no to going to the party. It sounds like you'd have merrily taken her along while knowing about all his aggression and that nothing was being done about it. Of course you can be kind as well as honest and stop pretending everything's okay with this situation.

FrenchandSaunders · 23/03/2024 09:02

Def don’t make her go and I would tell the mum why as gently as possible. Difficult for her but she needs to know.

My DD had a lot of problems at primary school with a friend who had learning difficulties and could get aggressive. I look back now and feel that I didn’t advocate for Dd enough at the time as it was always about the other child due to her needs.

YouMustBeHappyNow · 23/03/2024 08:59

WhateverMate · 22/03/2024 23:56

I’m sorry but DD doesn’t want to go because her son hits her when he’s upset and she’s a bit scared (how do I word it?!).

Word it exactly like that.

If he's pushing and shoving other kids too, I'd be astounded if his parents don't already know.

This.

NeedToChangeName · 23/03/2024 08:58

Mumtobabyhavoc · 23/03/2024 06:10

I think I'd gently tell the truth:
Mary, I mentioned the party to dd and she immediately got upset. She says xxx is always hitting and pushing her at school and she feels nothing can be done about it. I think we better take a rain check. I'm so sorry, but I have to respect dd and help her sort this out.

This is kind and empathetic

You could add that you hope they'll be friends again in future, if it's true

DarkDarkNight · 23/03/2024 08:58

I would get back to her and say you’re sorry but you’ve asked your daughter and she doesn’t want to go and leave it at that. That leaves the space for the mum to ask why, but leave it if she doesn’t want to have the conversation. She’s probably aware of her son’s behaviour at school and capable of adding 2 and 2 together.

DriftingDora · 23/03/2024 08:58

WhateverMate · 22/03/2024 23:56

I’m sorry but DD doesn’t want to go because her son hits her when he’s upset and she’s a bit scared (how do I word it?!).

Word it exactly like that.

If he's pushing and shoving other kids too, I'd be astounded if his parents don't already know.

I agree. I would certainly tell the mother this - no, it's not pleasant but as said above I would be amazed if the child's parents don't already know. And if this has been going on for some time I'm astounded that the school apparently aren't doing much about it - totally unacceptable for another child to be hit, pushed into railings or pushed to the ground, this is an accident waiting to happen and sooner or later a child will be injured.

I think you have to take this up very firmly with the school as well - and ask what they intend to do about it. I would document in writing any conversations you have with them, too.

anyolddinosaur · 23/03/2024 08:58

I'd have told the truth.

Dont teach your daughter to accept abuse. Dont let the school continue to do nothing about the other child. If his behaviour cant be modified then he needs to be in a different school with higher levels of supervision.

Viviennemary · 23/03/2024 08:57

BreakingAndBroke · 22/03/2024 23:46

By all means talk to the other mum about the hitting, but don't do it in the context of his birthday party. Make your excuses and don't go, but if things continue with the hitting, speak to her about it separately once the party is done and dusted.

I agree with this. Tell the Mum about the hitting so she is aware. Can you go along to the party to keep an eye on things. That's what I would try to do

timenowplease · 23/03/2024 08:55

'Being kind' means allowing your daughter to be physically abused over and over and teaching her that it's ok because ''reasons'.

Poor girl.

Gingerbread981 · 23/03/2024 08:55

What’s wrong with being honest? How’s this mum ever going to know if no one speaks up?
i certainly don’t think letting them down at the last minute with a made up excuse is going to help the situation!

thesunday · 23/03/2024 08:54

LAMPS1 · 23/03/2024 04:48

OP, please don’t make up an excuse. The mum needs to know that the school aren’t managing her child’s needs properly and that her son is becoming isolated from his peers because of that.

Tell the mum the truth. Yes it will be hard for her to hear but shouldn’t be glossed over, now you know about it, as that helps neither child.

You can do it in a kind and gentle way. it is a shared problem that you both need help from the school to solve.

Tell her that you were very surprised by your DD’s reaction when you mentioned the party in that she was adamant that she was fed up of being hurt and pushed about by him and didn’t want to expose herself to any more of it than necessary at school, so wouldn’t be going to his party. Tell her how upset you were to hear her say that, not only for your own DD, but also for her son, because it seems she has become a target for him to take out his frustrations on and obviously that isn’t being monitored, which neither of you can allow to continue.
Ask her to have a word with the teacher, about her son’s growing isolation from his friends because of this issue and tell her you will be doing the same so that you can both find out how it will be managed properly going forward. Tell her you feel for her in this situation but you are sure she understands that you too, must advocate for your own child.
Finally, tell her that as your DD is upset about it all, you have made other fun day trip arrangements for her in lieu of the party.

Then talk to the class teacher urgently about this and tell her what has happened. Insist that a new and much more effective strategy is put in place to safeguard your DD from this little boy as it has become a growing daily occurrence which is now seriously impacting her health and well-being. Tell the teacher that you have asked your DD to alert the teacher or TA to every incident where this little boy slaps, pushes or is otherwise bullying her and that you insist that all such incidents are recorded properly as you will be doing the same at home to help monitor the situation. Arrange a follow up meeting date to show how serious you are about this being managed properly. When you get home, make a record of what was said and date it.

This is a well thought out plan and it also is kind to the other mum and in the end gets the boy the support he needs. I’d follow it to a T.

And just to chime in with everyone else.

If you keep your daughter in this situation it will very likely have a damaging lifelong effect on her self esteem. You’re teaching her that no one is helping her when she gets physically abused and that she has to suck it up. And mostly she’ll feel lifelong pains that the people who were meant to protect her have let her down.

so it’s not that ‘you probably should go and speak to the school…’. You GOT to kick up a roar about this! I’d be on the phone to the school on Monday

5128gap · 23/03/2024 08:53

I disagree with making up an excuse. People aren't daft. You've already said DD was free and children talk too. There's every chance DD will tell the child at some point she didn't want to go/doesn't like him anymore as children tend to be more straightforward than we are. Personally I'd tell the truth, but keep it light touch 'Sorry other mum, but it seems there's been a bit of a spat between DC, and DD is saying she'd rather not come this time. Hopefully it will blow over..' This also gently introduces the conversations that will need to be had at some point so it wont come out of nowhere.
If her child is behaving in a way that is leading to other DC not wanting to be around him, it's no kindness to child or mum to hide this, she needs to know so she can support him to address his behaviour.

olympicsrock · 23/03/2024 08:51

I think it’s kinder and more respectful t the mum to let her know why DD doesn’t want to come .
Then she won’t feel blindsided when you address it with the school.

Createausername1970 · 23/03/2024 08:46

As a mother of a child who's behaviour wasn't great and who struggled with friendships, I think I would have wanted to have known the truth. Yes, I would have been upset and sad for my lovely boy, who just didn't fit in, but it would have prepared me for more refusals and excuses from other parents, which might happen.

One person giving an honest reason for refusal is better than six "suddenly" being busy or cancelling on the day, which would be awful for the boy.

Funfuninthesunsun · 23/03/2024 08:45

I don't understand why you're fine with your daughter being repeatedly hurt? Are you that much of a people pleaser? What lessons are you teaching her?

You need to be speaking to the school properly about this behavior and say no to the party.

Stressedafff · 23/03/2024 08:45

You need to go into the school and persue the assaults. Shes going in school every day and being physically hit or pushed.
Shes already keeping quiet about it because she thinks no one will do anything, this is teaching her that with a valid reason it’s okay for someone to assault you. It isn’t.

LAMPS1 · 23/03/2024 08:41

Alphavilla · 23/03/2024 07:30

I would be honest with the mother about her child’s violence at school and how it’s left her daughter feeling.

i am also bemused by all the pps saying the school should ensure this behaviour cannot occur and to safeguard all the children all the time. On a practical level, how on earth are they supposed to do that? My daughter is a newly qualified teacher in a small village school. She has around 5 out of 20 children in her class who have SEN and behavioural issues including lashing out. That’s a quarter of her class. She does not even have a full time TA and so for much of the school day she is on her own. One to one supervision for the difficult children would be a dream but simply not going to happen. She cannot single handedly manage the disruptive children and teach the whole class the curriculum at the same time. One boy triggers over nothing and is completely unpredictable. The school has sanctions but none that the difficult children care about, such as going down on the chart, or losing time off break. In fact losing break time means they don’t get to run off their frustrations and makes them worse. I appreciate the OPs problem and all those whose children are attacked by SENs or disabled children but I honestly don’t know how schools and teachers are supposed to ‘ensure it never happens’. It’s absolutely an impossible situation for my daughter who loves the teaching aspect of her chosen career but already the behaviour management of the class is wearing her out and she’s thinking of quitting.

The only way to deal with this dilemma is to keep reporting it upwards until the government finally gets the message and makes the decision to dedicate sufficient funds and training to SEN.
Keeping quiet solves nothing at all and only enables this massive problem to grow.
The government will only take notice when sufficient numbers of skilled and dedicated teachers (like your own DD) resign. It needs to become a crisis. It needs to become a scandal.

OP’s child is already weary and worn down by this on-going problem and has become accepting. She has normalised the situation as she knows reporting doesn’t change things for her.

We should not just leave the problem with that little girl and hundreds like her. We must raise our expectations and be outraged for both children in this scenario. And for their teacher and HT and County Council, until notice is taken at the right level.

Parents and teachers on the front line of this impossible situation must speak up every single time. It’s the only way forward.

Riverlee · 23/03/2024 08:40

“It was clear the boy had greater rights than my daughter had to be safe, “

This sentence jumped out at me from @ForestBather post above. Do you feel this is the case because of their disability? Are you scared of being ‘the mum’ who complains about ‘the disabled kid’? Is the other mum a bit of a Queen Bee and appears untouchable? Don’t be scared. Put your child first.

Randomworkmoan · 23/03/2024 08:40

Some of the replies here are genuinely pathetic. Flat tyre, blame the husband double booking like a typical man. Ffs.

Your daughter is refusing to go, which is great she has a back bone, that she clearly didn't get from you! But now it's time to follow her lead and advocate for her

"Hi Pauline, I spoke too soon yesterday when you asked about the party. I spoke to dd and she doesn't want to go. Lately the hitting has gotten much worse and of course dd doesn't want to be subjected to that.

I am going to arrange a meeting with the school to discuss how we can try resolve this going forward.

Enjoy the party, I hope x has a lovely birthday. I do appreciate x has additional needs so this message is meant kindly to you, lying about why dd couldn't go and then springing a meeting on you next week would be unfair, but I equally need to protect dd from being hurt at school. Hopefully we can sort something that helps both kids."

Something like that seems kinder all round to me. I would appreciate a straight but fair message if I was that mother, since that's what you seem most concerned about