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Original poster

Confronted friend for pulling out of trip

135 replies

anxiousannie2022 · 20/03/2024 12:59

My friend, let's name her Mary is friends with Ann and Jo. I have met Jo a few times & we get on. I'm not a direct friend but I would socialise with her when with Mary and Ann.

Jo has organised a weekend trip this year. Mary got on to me a few months ago and said I have to go, last year's was so much fun. A Whatsapp group of 15 people was set up and all said they were in. I don't know anyone except for Ann, Mary and Jo. Jo booked her flights, Mary said she'd book when she had a free minute and I said I'd book on payday. Payday came, I spent 300 euro on flights. Radio silence from Ann & Mary.

I PM'd Mary to ask was she booking and she said she wasn't sure now, she's going to try for another baby and will have to see closer to the time. I was miffed as there was no indication before this that were was any doubt, & while I realise having a baby is a priority, a heads up would've been good as I don't really know anyone else going & was missing a good friends hen party to attend this trip. I also am aware trying for a baby is private so no need to share those details. Just a "I mightn't be able to go for personal reasons, just in case that affects you wanting to go" kind of thing.

Weeks later, I'm having dinner with Mary. She drops in she's going on a weekend away with Ann and did I want to come on xxx date - the same date of Jo's trip! I said no as I'm going on Jo's trip? Mary said "oh is that the same weekend?" Then said she wasn't sure about going on Jo's trip as it was a different group of pals and her and Ann didn't like them. They told Jo they are not sure about their trip, as both trying for babies.

I was annoyed as felt I could have been given some indication they may not be going as I wouldn't have booked otherwise. Financially, I could have done without a trip where I know 1 acquaintance and the rest are strangers.
I voice-noted Mary this morning - a nice message with general chit chat & brought up re Jo's trip. I said nicely, a heads up would have been good & while I'm not trying to make them feel bad, I feel awkward about going and I wouldn't have booked if I'd known they may not be able to go.

I got some long texts back about being stressed due to a variety of personal goings on, that she didn't know she would be trying for a baby, this trip was far down list of her priorities, she's mixed up the dates and her and Ann's trip is not the same weekend & nothing to stop me heading on my own or cancelling and going to my friends hen (at a significant expense now as can't get refund for flights).
I replied to say I was unaware of all that going on and that's completely understandable - from my perspective I'd been told a few different things and was confused but that's all fine.

She kept going and said I was told a few different things as there's hopes and reality and reality happens quite often for most people. Again I said I understand, but I'm not a mind-reader and could only go but what I was told and what is in messages and I have more of an understanding now. Have had no response since except a thumbs up and now feel really awkward and bad. Was it correct to call her out without knowing all the details of what was happening with her? I just feel like I couldn't have known only what I was told. I feel awful now. She is a very close friend.

OP posts:
Bluegray2 · 22/03/2024 11:35

I would have doubled checked with them before booking the flights, I think you know you should have done this

MumblesParty · 22/03/2024 10:55

What about Ann? What is her excuse for bailing out?

Candleabra · 22/03/2024 08:08

She doesn’t come across well in those messages. As soon as you had her pinned down that she told you she was going to book in Jan (when she had a minute!), she comes out with a load of woe is me excuses, including vague medical ones to make you feel bad. She sounds very self important too (so busy, so stressed, unable to give headspace about a silly weekend away - unlike you….).

A simple apology would have been better.
I can’t get over the fact she’s the one who persuaded you to go!

Autienotnaughtie · 22/03/2024 07:41

Honestly after reading the updates she is still in the wrong. Even if it was a genuine mistake, she didn't see/register your message about booking the following week etc. it was still a mistake, she should have apologised and acknowledged her mistake not became defensive.

I'd struggle to continue a close friendship with someone like that. I wouldn't fall out but I'd probably pull back a bit.

SaturdayGiraffe · 22/03/2024 07:35

Some people struggle to give heartfelt apologies when they are in the wrong. Perhaps she grew up seeing that admitting fault was a despicable weakness, who knows.

If you can overlook this inability or unwillingness in her then you can move on. But the fact you have essentially asked her to apologise and instead she has come up with various excuses (not reasons), becoming more defensive each time, seems to indicate that she would prefer to withdraw rather than reflect or change.

H12345 · 22/03/2024 06:55

I really understand your frustration and think you’ve absolutely done the right thing calling your friend out. You seem like a lovely person who values friendship but be careful of Mary as she sounds like a selfish twat!

She 100 percent should have told you she has no plans to go but she didn’t care enough to stop you. She then has used absolutely every excuse under the sun to make herself the victim in all of this after youve called her out instead of just saying sorry. Absolutely hate people like that!

Her behaviour is awful, you deserve a lot better!

Have the most amazing time away

roundaboutflo · 21/03/2024 22:32

I'm not sure how old you are but I'm 24 and I've realised life is too short to deal with 'friends ' like this .

I'm the only one in my group of friends who has a child and I'm always upfront if I can't go on holiday with them whether that's due to childcare money or anything else. And the 'things going on in her life' are things the rest of us deal with without being shit friends

Awittyandclevername · 21/03/2024 20:33

anxiousannie2022 · 20/03/2024 13:28

Thanks all - update! She responded with the below:

"Nobody expecting you be a mind reader. Any time you asked I told you what was true for me at that time and I just made a mistake on London (this was the other trip!) dates. The rest of time, this has been so far from my mind"

I responded to that with the below:

"That's all seriously grand!! From the conversations in the Lisbon group, I just got the impression everything was good to proceed with booking. I booked at the end of January, and I made sure to mention a week beforehand that I was planning to book then. I sent a text on the same day I booked in Jan, and it was only on that day that I became aware there might be a possibility you couldn't make it.

I completely understand that priorities and circumstances can change in life, and people have a lot going on. Until this morning, I wasn't aware that London (this was the other trip btw) was planned for a different date - I get that was a mix-up up but until this morning, I just thought it was the same weekend as what I was initially told.

I also wasn't aware that you guys weren't keen on joining the particular group of girls heading to Lisbon and *Jo had messaged me to ask about you guys heading with us. I'd like to put this to bed now but I just wanted to give you some context from my perspective/where I was coming from, and totally understand that this trip is far from your mind x"

No response and I fear this incident has damaged our friendship - we have never had any remotely harsh words before.

It’s pretty annoying how she keeps saying it’s far from her mind and it’s so low on her priorities… it was higher on her priorities than it was on yours as she was the one who convinced you to go in the first place 😂 she seems quite self absorbed actually. If it was me I’d probably pull out but if you don’t mind going a meeting some new people then who knows you might have a really lovely time.

CaterhamReconstituted · 21/03/2024 15:43

They are flakey and out of order. Maybe they are a bit disorganised. I am astonished by people sometimes. I once arranged to go to the theatre with a friend - I gave three months notice and they cancelled on the actual day because they wanted to “do up” their house.

MumbleCushion · 21/03/2024 15:38

The only thing worse than friends being shit, is friends being shit, and if you call them out, they make you feel like you are the bad guy. Ugh. Don’t apologise.

Attryn · 21/03/2024 15:30

Shodan · 21/03/2024 15:18

I wonder if the real reason Mary isn't keen on the larger group of friends is because she's previously behaved poorly with them and they called her out on it.

Regardless, Mary has been very rude. I strongly dislike people who do this (and have known one or two in my time.)

I think this too. I think the other people have seen through her and that's why she doesn't like them so you'll probably have a great time with them!

BreakfastClub80 · 21/03/2024 15:26

Fundamentally, she’s in the wrong and should be apologising. Your responses haven’t helped you to put it to bed. If she says anything else to defend herself, I think your response should be “that’s grand, BUT you should have told me sooner” and leave it there.

Shodan · 21/03/2024 15:18

I wonder if the real reason Mary isn't keen on the larger group of friends is because she's previously behaved poorly with them and they called her out on it.

Regardless, Mary has been very rude. I strongly dislike people who do this (and have known one or two in my time.)

Noseybookworm · 21/03/2024 15:09

anxiousannie2022 · 20/03/2024 13:37

Thanks. I will go on the trip, and am sure will have a good time - it's just it's not something I would have spent time or money on etc. had I known the main people I wanted to go with it aren't going. I'll suck that part up but now just worried as feel I have upset her greatly.

Not sure why you're worried about upsetting her as she's clearly not that bothered about upsetting you! Whatever's going on in her life, it's not an excuse for roping you into the trip and then dropping out and leaving you in the lurch 🤨

ciaopizza · 21/03/2024 13:23

OP I understand how you're feeling. I don't think she's going to give you the apology you deserve however as she would have by now during the text exchange if she was going to. She's gone on the defensive as she knows she should have discussed it with you.

You've already expressed understanding towards her situation so I would leave it there now.

Original poster
anxiousannie2022 · 21/03/2024 13:17

OrigamiStar · 21/03/2024 13:13

Judging by Mners, the vast majority of whom are British, and their complete inability to communicate directly, I wouldn’t see this as a specific issue related to another culture. In my experience, Ireland is differently indirect compared to England, not more so. (Have never lived in Wales or Scotland, so no basis for comparison).

Show quote history

I'd be okay with it if some acknowledgement of my point was received - I just got a thumbs up to my last message, so I am more miffed it's been totally turned around on me. I am happy to let it slide given her personal circumstances etc., but I feel like in her head I'm the bad guy so she's going to be off with me and is expecting an apology.

OP posts:
Original poster
anxiousannie2022 · 21/03/2024 13:15

OrigamiStar · 21/03/2024 11:22

Honestly, I think that his is a predictable risk with a loose group of 15 people going on a trip originally mooted by someone you don’t know well, when your only real motivation for going is knowing one or two of the other people. The sheer size of the group means that individuals tend to drop out without feeling it’s of any particular import.

I absolutely agree - it's not the not going, just the not letting me know and if it was a gang I knew well and one friend dropping out, I wouldn't care as much as I'd still be with other friends if ye get me.

OP posts:
OrigamiStar · 21/03/2024 13:13

ciaopizza · 21/03/2024 13:06

I live in Ireland and I would say that in my experience it is fairly common for people for change plans without saying anything to others due to high aversion to confrontation/conflict. I'm sure I'm generalising but this is what I have noticed. So with this in mind I imagine that Mary will go quiet for a bit letting it blow over and then all will be back to normal - from her perspective anyway. You're not unreasonable OP, it's really up to you on how much of a thing you want to make of it now. You've said it's okay in your messages to her - do you mean that?

Judging by Mners, the vast majority of whom are British, and their complete inability to communicate directly, I wouldn’t see this as a specific issue related to another culture. In my experience, Ireland is differently indirect compared to England, not more so. (Have never lived in Wales or Scotland, so no basis for comparison).

HalebiHabibti · 21/03/2024 13:10

Mary acted badly and knows it.

ciaopizza · 21/03/2024 13:06

I live in Ireland and I would say that in my experience it is fairly common for people for change plans without saying anything to others due to high aversion to confrontation/conflict. I'm sure I'm generalising but this is what I have noticed. So with this in mind I imagine that Mary will go quiet for a bit letting it blow over and then all will be back to normal - from her perspective anyway. You're not unreasonable OP, it's really up to you on how much of a thing you want to make of it now. You've said it's okay in your messages to her - do you mean that?

OrigamiStar · 21/03/2024 11:22

Honestly, I think that his is a predictable risk with a loose group of 15 people going on a trip originally mooted by someone you don’t know well, when your only real motivation for going is knowing one or two of the other people. The sheer size of the group means that individuals tend to drop out without feeling it’s of any particular import.

PinkArt · 21/03/2024 11:12

I stand by my first impresstion, Mary is a bitch, both to you and that poor band aid baby she's planning on having. She is massively minimising anything that's going on in your life because of her own Big Important problems. She literally just had to say 'not sure if I can make Lisbon, lots going on' rather than that she'd book when she was free and you could have made an informed decision.
If this trip was so trivial to her why be a part of the conversation in the first place? If any trip is so trivial, why is she planning a seperate trip with Ann?

Original poster
anxiousannie2022 · 21/03/2024 09:36

PoppingTomorrow · 20/03/2024 18:32

I think you've started to express your disappointment and then when Mary defended herself you backed down immediately, so you're always going to feel miffed and unresolved. You said Mary was the one who was on at you to go on the Lisbon trip because it was such fun last time. And now she doesn’t like the people? Far too much back and forth on those messages because you're oscillating between expressing yourself and then taking it back.

It's perfectly possible to be miffed with a friend, let them know, and you both move on from it and remain friends

Thank you. I feel like I need to recap for complete clarity to see if I AMBU - apologies as it is a bit lengthy!

Jo organised a trip last year, smaller group of about 8. About 15 going this year of Jo's friends and me - again, I do know Jo, she is very nice but we wouldn't hang one to one, we share mutual pals. This year's trip has been on the cards since last September and there has been much chat about where to go etc. Destination of Lisbon decided at Christmas. On the group chat, all good to go.

I noted around Christmas I would book on my January payday, and Mary said she'd book once she had a free minute. A week before I booked in January, I said in group chat again I would be booking the following week. On the day I booked I said to the group and Jo replied that's great, and could she just confirm numbers from everyone again for accommodation. Nothing from Mary or Ann, so I PM'd Mary and she responded she wasn't sure now, as will be trying for a baby.

I am totally fine with this but the part that annoys me in the below communication is that she keeps saying she didn't know at the time of my booking - but she did know as the day I booked is when she responded to me saying she wasn't sure, and I had given a heads up the week before I was booking which she read on the group chat - I feel then she could have stepped in then and said to me "hey, not sure of my plans for May time, just letting you know I might not be able to make it then!" I would have zero problem with this as I would have been making an informed decision. And then the dinner etc. happened and she said about trying for babies, about going to London for a weekend, and that Jo had invited girls that weren't on last year's trip and her and Ann weren't keen on them.

Again, as I don't know said girls, I feel a heads up here would have been helpful if they are not that nice or whatever. For more background context, Mary and her husband and two kids have moved back from the UK to Ireland about 10 months ago - Mary does not work and was looking after youngest child, and hubby goes to the UK on regular work trips. Again, I have no issue with not being able to make the trip - I have an issue with not being informed and repeatedly saying she didn't know, when at the time she did - she may have gotten mixed up, which I understand but no acknowledgement of that. This was the exact conversation text yesterday:

Her: "Sorry love, we didn't know when you booked and there's no plan to go to London that wknd- did I not text you after that night and told you I had got my wknds mixed up and it was April 22nd for London? Maybe that was *Cathy (another friend) I said it to!
I am still not 100% out for Lisbon- like I've said to Jo too, it really does just depends on what happens! Go to (my friend's) hen. There was no heads up to give at the time of your booking! X"

Me: "Must have been Cathy! I had said on the group I was booking payday yes after you had said you'd book tickets when you'd get a free minute. Of course, I know obvs having a baby is priority and you can't 100% plan for those things but it would have been good to get an indication ye might not be heading x"

Her: "I said that during a very hectic UK trip when we had several A&E trips with (her DD) and have had months of sickness and a nightmare with (her sister) living here since we've been back. And very unhappy children and lots of travel and lots of absent (DH). This trip has been pretty far from my mind most of the time.
Trying for a baby only a recent development too since DH & I decided we're happy enough together to go for it again. So couldn't have given any indication to anyone else when the decision hadn't even been made in my own mind until recently.
Also haven't known where I would even be living in May and where to book from as we don't know if we're staying in Ireland or going.
So plenty going on with us and absolutely no ability to know what's going on myself, let alone tell others! If I was clear on anything myself, I could have shared it but this has been a really hard few months for us and this trip is so far down my thoughts to be honest!"

Me: "Ah Mary, of course that's totally understandable. I guess from my perspective I was told a few different things i.e. it was because this group of girls going were a bit rough so you and Ann didn't want to go, ye were heading to London that weekend and trying for babies... I was not aware all that was going on and hope things are a bit better now x"

Her: "You were told a few different things because there are hopes and then there's reality and reality often gets in the way. Happens quite often to most people, there's nothing stopping you going alone like I did last year!"

Me: "I know, I just felt like it was all go go go until I booked and yes, I wouldn't mind going alone but I don't know Jo that well one to one, let alone the others.
Anyway, its absolutely grand."

Her: "Well my shit basically went to shit at Christmas so if that's when you booked, then that's when it fell far down my list of priorities!"

Me: "I booked end of January?! And I completely understand that - just I'm not a mind reader and I can only go by what I was told and what was in messages.
So its all good, I have more of a understanding now and that's completely fine x"

Her: "Noone expecting you to be a mind reader. Any time you asked, I told you what was true for me at that time and then I just made a mistake on London dates as you can see here. The rest of the time, this has been so far from my mind."

Me: "Mary that's all seriously grand!! From the conversations in the Lisbon group, I just got the impression everything was good to proceed with booking. I booked at the end of January, and I made sure to mention a week beforehand that I was planning to book then. I sent a text on the same day I booked in Jan, and it was only on that day that I became aware there might be a possibility you couldn't make it.

I completely understand that priorities and circumstances can change in life, and people have a lot going on. Until this morning, I wasn't aware that London was planned for April 22nd - I get that was a mix-up up but until this morn, I just thought it was the same weekend as what I was initially told.

I also wasn't aware that you guys weren't keen on joining the particular group of girls heading to Lisbon and Laura had messaged me to ask about you guys heading with us. I'd like to put this to bed now but I just wanted to give you some context from my perspective/where I was coming from, and totally understand that this trip is far from your mind x"

Sorry the above is so long but I just wanted to give complete clarity so no confusion! Really appreciate all the advice.

OP posts:
Ihearyousingingdownthewire · 20/03/2024 22:24

She massively overcompensated with her screeds of emotionally manipulative texts purely because you caught her out for being 1.) a poor friend, and 2.) fucking up and planning a trip with Ann on the same weekend.

sandrapinchedmysandwich · 20/03/2024 20:53

nononocontact · 20/03/2024 15:38

Mary is a bitch - she has treated you badly and is doubling down out of embarrassment. Don’t let her off easy! Bet her weekend with Ann is the same weekend and she knew all along!

So sanctimonious with all the “this trip is so far from my mind” as if she is so busy and important! Don’t apologise for sticking up for yourself - she’s one for the bin.

This. She has used the darvo technique on you favoured by narcissistic abusers