To be surprised that 65+ is deemed ‘elderly’

In the UK, healthy life expectancy is about 63 years, so falls short of retirement age. In deprived communities it can be significantly lower- Blackpool's is 55.3 years.

It's great when people maintain a "middle aged" and active lifestyle into their 70s or beyond, but it's not a universal truth and many people hit health problems associated with age quite young and have to live with them for many years. Nationally the range is 19.8 years for women and 17.8 years for men between the best and worst performing local authorities.

That's going to affect peoples' perceptions of when "old" happens, depending on what they see around them.

There's bound to be a societal volte face coming soon with regards to ageism.

We're going to be the majority demographic within a decade or two. Gone are the days of a youth heavy society unless there is mass immigration.

Old really will become Gold 😅

My mum had her purse nicked out of her (open) handbag at the supermarket. She was one of those women who knew better than anyone else, so had a postit with her PIN number on the back of her card. Even though she walked directly to the bank, the maximum daily allowance had been withdrawn and given that she was loaded, it was $35,000aud. Because this had been happening on this area with increasing frequency, she was interviewed by the local tv news and smugly made us watch it. Instead of the “poor me” story she had assumed, it was very much an article about how vulnerable elderly people are to this kind of theft and was basically a “How not to” story based on her experience. (We thought it was great, tbh…) Meanwhile, she was LIVID that they had referred to her as elderly, and was telling us that she wanted to sue them for this. (Of course we helped the situation by falling about laughing…) *Tbf, she was nearly 60, but due to her lifestyle of long-term anorexia and several bottles of wine and 100+ cigarettes a day, she looked about a million.

But 50+ isn’t old, so you aren’t being accurate with your description. I know if you told me to look for an old woman with a grey bob, I’d be looking for someone much older than 50.

As I said, an age descriptor (whether it relates to younger, older or middle-aged) be considered acceptable in my workplace - and thank goodness for that!

Maybe you need a reality check. You’ve been middle aged for some time, the age of your kids is irrelevant.

Well, that's good. I wasn't suggesting anyone adopt those attitudes.

Let's be fair. The average woman in the UK lives to 82 so middle aged is probably 38-46.
65 as middle aged is absolutely delusional.

So you have experience of being 65? Or 55 or 75? No.

55 "old" NO

@silvergarden Nice ageism there 😉

Goodnight.

Respectfully;

Those women are labouring under the misapprehension that their relative youth is one of their most notable and valuable attributes.

I'm not about to start labouring under that very same misapprehension any time soon so I'm not at all arsed about agreeing that I am in fact ageing....

I have an adult child. I am no longer young. I am still valuable, beautiful, kind , industrious and tenacious.

Also however old I am; I'm not dead yet.

@CurlsnSunshinetime4tea people think they are in great health but haven’t got a clue what’s going on under the surface.

Anyway, before you make any more baseless assumptions about me, I’m off to bed now 👋

That's nice. I don't think I made any baseless assumptions about you - I deduced you were young and not affected by or informed about the terminology you were confidently proclaiming about.

@BogRollBOGOF i really enjoyed my recent discovery of the "healthy life expectancy index" available by country.
and like many was disappointed to see that 65 is the starting point in canada for "senior" when so many remain in great health.

Because we hot desk, and I am usually at home so wouldn't know where they're sat or what they're wearing on any given day (even in the office, I may not have been in their room so wouldn't necessarily know where they were sat or what they were wearing).
Age is an easy identifier, there are two women with grey bobs, one is 50+ and the other is 20ish (dyed grey).
There are several men with beards, two old men with beards, only one of those men wears a full suit to work every day.

@MumblesParty still late middle aged whether you ferry your son to football or not. It’s a descriptive term of your chronological age, again like it or not.
Same with the poster banging on about being fitter than ‘most 40 year olds’ or the one whose mother dyed her hair blond 🙄 People are getting tetchy because of the negative associations about being old, probably grey and mentally slow.

When I was young I thought 65 was old, Now I am getting very close to 65 it no longer seems old. That does not mean I am right though.

@silvergarden I am not denying that ageism exists. Or that “old” could be used in a derogatory way or tacked onto other insults. But then so could lots of other age ranges. The same is true for many factual descriptors unrelated to age too - think sex/hair colour/disability terms. They are still factual and can be used appropriately as well.

And yes I am aware of the pension issue. My own mother has been very much affected by this and is still working at 63 with no end in sight because of it.

If most people are offended by the terms “old” and “elderly”, maybe we need a new term. I’d like to know what e.g. a 75 year old who takes issue with old/elderly would describe themselves as. The trouble with this approach is the new term is likely to follow the same cycle and become just as offensive. Doing away with terms about age altogether doesn’t work either as it would be censoring language in an unnatural way and would put older people at odds with other roughly defined age groups that have a collective name.

Anyway, before you make any more baseless assumptions about me, I’m off to bed now 👋

It's an accurate description, I don't use old as an insult.

Ooh, why would anyone object to being called "old"...

Style and Beauty is full of women lamenting their "ageing" faces at 39, of women in their early forties seeking tips for injectables and other invasive and sometimes irreversible procedures - all so that they do not (gasp) appear "old".

To me elderly is a state of frailty.
Some people hit elderly / frailty much younger than others.
I know 3 women who are all late 70s two I'd consider elderly (one barely goes out, needs a stick complicated health issues, one in a nursing home, one as active as ever).

I do think by late 60s many have health issues and I think people working full-time in late 60s is a piece of nonsense, far too many just won't have the fitness levels to do it.

Average life expectancy is about 79-81.
Average healthy life expectancy is about 63-64.

Some people live longer and healthier lives than average. Some people reach chronic ill health or die sooner than those averages.

It's easier to notice active people on good form for their age because they're out and about doing more. The people struggling will spend less time out and socialising and in public. People can misjudge age easily too.

The distribution of good health and long life isn't even. MNers are more likely to know people fareing on the better side of average. Cities can have discrepancies of 10 years between their healthiest, wealthiest areas and the most deprived where health issues and premature mortality (u75) are more likely to occur.

At a population level, 65 is a fair waypoint for old age. Statistically chronic conditions become more likely to affect quality of life. Good genes, lifestyle and luck can help people still live in a relatively young way well beyond that point, but age does have biological reality attached to it. At some point the efficiency of the body's system declines and people become more suceptible to health complications and poorer healing. I've had relatives on good form through their 60s and 70s and haven't really been "old" until into their 80s where that natural resiliance has faded for them. I've also lost relatives well before retirement age.

I don't feel middle-aged, but statistically I am roughly halfway through typical life expectancy. While I might do my best to delude myself that I'm still in my 20s, I can't dodge all biological reality. All I can do is keep working on the variables that give better odds of a longer and healthier life because that's good for quality of life.

Old is older than elderly. Elderly comes first before old.

Is there really a difference between old and elderly? I have always perceived elderly as almost a euphemism. The way people say "myself" wrongly when they mean me.

But why do you need to refer to age at all? Completely irrelevant in a workplace, or should be.

We’d just say something like “woman in the corner with the blonde hair and purple top” or “man by the printer with glasses and a blue jumper”. I’m genuinely surprised that anyone would comment on age.

Hmm, I'd probs use 'old' and 'elderly' interchangeably tbh. But perception of age changes as you get older, no doubt. Young people make a big deal about turning 30 but that's still pretty young by all accounts. I, used to think 40 was middle aged (I know it is technically) but now I see 50s as middle aged.