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To say that the next generation is primarily screwed in terms of resilience

863 replies

Namechangechangeobv · 26/02/2024 13:14

And WTF do we do about it?

Obviously many young people are wonderfully resilient but the overall trend I’ve seen in my line of work (behavioural education) is that there are vast, and I mean VAST numbers of young adults who cannot leave the house, come into a classroom, look someone in the eye, make a phone call, speak infront of the class (if they make it in), cry when pronouns are wrong (daily occurrence), take responsibility to revise/get a job/learn to drive.

What is going to happen to these humans in the future?

OP posts:
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Stopmotion24 · 26/02/2024 17:32

Technology, smartphones, social media I think are behind it as well as the climate crisis, depressing politics and economy, catastrophic world events, all magnified and graphically available 24/7

greengreengrass25 · 26/02/2024 17:31

@Katypp

So true

I think sometimes the it's not all about you style parenting of the 70s was better in some ways

sarahc336 · 26/02/2024 17:29

I'm a therapist and the number of young people aged around 17-22 that just can't cope with every day life now is alarming. It's defiantly increased over the last 5-8 years. They seem to not be able to cope with any stress. It does worry me. I don't remember myself or my peers being that way at that age not sure what's causing it tbh

dimllaishebiaith · 26/02/2024 17:27

Naunet · 26/02/2024 17:08

Are you actually serious? You realise others come from abusive homes or have real trauma happen in their lives and they’re far more resilient? Kids from third world countries where just having clean water is a challenge, never mind a chance to go to school and they manage without crying every 5 minutes and moaning about their mental health. Being out of school for a year is not some big traumatic, life changing event that removes any resilience. In fact you’ll find hard situations tend to increase resilience if anything.
Get some perspective.

I mean some of those that my answer referred to were being abused

I would imagine being forced to spend 24/7 with your abusive parent instead of escaping to school 5 days a week for the better part of a year would be a massive reason to decrease someones resilience

And I have no idea why you seperated out children being abused from those at home during covid

I offered one reason for a problem which others say has got worse since covid. Why sneer at me that that cant possibly be the case because children in third world countries according to you don't have mental health issues. If it was as simple as that the problem wouldnt exist in the first place and sneering at people who try to offer reasons why certainly doesnt help the situation.

Perhaps you need to get some persepctive on responding to ideas on a forum. Certainly this kind of response shows poor resiliance and ability to cope with a conversation from your perspective.

StripyHorse · 26/02/2024 17:27

Most of the children I teach have come from overseas. Many of these have come from war zones. They show far more resilience than I ever did.

OTOH I was less aware of current affairs and the world around me than children today seem to be. We put more responsibility for their learning on children (awareness of learning targets and levels etc.) More children than ever are living in poverty. Teens and young adults are probably well aware of how difficult it will be to own their own home. Social media piles pressure to be perfect like never before, and school issues (bullying or fallings out) can continue at home due to social media so there is no let up. It's no wonder so many young people are overwhelmed.

Newbutoldfather · 26/02/2024 17:27

‘I think young people are the opposite of cossetted and are put under a lot of pressure to perform well academically. Universities all want As for courses that required Cs a few years ago. ‘

Since the A* grade was introduced, As are now what was Bs and, given grade inflation, relatively weak yet hardworking students can often achieve As at A level.

Realityisreal · 26/02/2024 17:26

@greatwesternmailman Thank you, I'm so glad things got better for you and it really does help to hear. I think the very least any of us want are more good days than bad days for the people we care about!

Outthedoor24 · 26/02/2024 17:26

Testina · 26/02/2024 15:54

Did you just wake up from a coma? 🤣
It’s not a point about grammar!

Read what I replied too. The Ops original post was going on about kids crying over not knowing what pro-nouns are.

shearwater2 · 26/02/2024 17:25

I'm glad people do drink water now, I didn't drink tap water until I was an adult. Had loads of dental treatment and was often very thirsty at school.

TheBayLady · 26/02/2024 17:24

Naunet · 26/02/2024 17:08

Are you actually serious? You realise others come from abusive homes or have real trauma happen in their lives and they’re far more resilient? Kids from third world countries where just having clean water is a challenge, never mind a chance to go to school and they manage without crying every 5 minutes and moaning about their mental health. Being out of school for a year is not some big traumatic, life changing event that removes any resilience. In fact you’ll find hard situations tend to increase resilience if anything.
Get some perspective.

This, this and this.

CormorantStrikesBack · 26/02/2024 17:24

I’m a uni lecturer, 50% of my students seem to have diagnosed anxiety and get extra time, etc because of it. It’s definitely got worse in the last ten years. It was getting worse before Covid so not even sure that’s to blame.

Goldenbear · 26/02/2024 17:24

shearwater2 · 26/02/2024 17:18

I think young people are the opposite of cossetted and are put under a lot of pressure to perform well academically. Universities all want As for courses that required Cs a few years ago.

And not many other options or alternative routes are given for those who are not academic, or are capable of getting qualifications but not at the prescribed time 16 or 18. It's either you get As or you're a failure.

It's certainly not that they aren't allowed to fail, it's that so many are made to feel like failures.

Edited

This is so true. If anything they have it harder, there is not let up!

Newbutoldfather · 26/02/2024 17:24

‘My parents were Boomers and were quite comfortable inhabiting the mindset of not wanting your children to feel like they were failures, particularly my Mum. It is anecdotal but I don't think resilience is a generational trait, I think it is a personality trait.’

No one wants or should want their child to feel like a failure. But successful people all fail sometimes. The trick to resilience, which is far more easily said than done, is to fail and regard it as a learning experience, rather than feeling like a failure.

Resilience is, like all other traits, a combination of genes and environment, so clearly some people are born more resilient than others. But it is also a generational trait, as childhood environment has changed greatly over the last few decades.

An anecdote (no anecdote isn’t data, I know that) that always amazes me is children’s (and many adults) ‘need’ for water on demand. I’ve had pupils ask to leave the class to go and get a drink and, when I ask why, thinking that maybe they have a medical condition, am told they are thirsty, as if this is a serious and debilitating condition. They are amazed when I refuse and tell them they can be thirsty for an hour until lunch.

Namechangechangeobv · 26/02/2024 17:19

SweetBirdsong · 26/02/2024 17:17

Nah, they'll be fine. Every older generation (like us) has thought this about the younger ones. We were all fine, really. And the GenZs and millennials will be fine too!

No need to stress about the young 'uns. Grin

But it’s not a generational thing - I’ve done this job for bloody years! It’s a recent thing. Started a while before lockdown and has been exacerbated by it. This is new and it’s scary. There is such a huge divide between those who can function in our weird ass society and those who can’t. And the numbers of those who can’t are growing every year.

OP posts:
taxguru · 26/02/2024 17:19

Grendell · 26/02/2024 17:10

My relatives who are mainstream teachers say the same thing - something is wrong now, starting with attendance, which is down. They also believe part of the problem is the irrelevant curriculum. Students say there is no need to know "x" and it is hard to argue with them most of the time.

In the work place, I see people claiming "work-life balance" and "anxiety" as a way to stop going into the office or agreeing to new tasks or even changing a process that needs to be changed. (I am in the states.)

The irrelevant curriculum is nothing new nor recent. Most of it has been irrelevant for a few decades. I.e. trying to teach pythagoras to kids who don't know the basics such as times tables or prime numbers is never going to end well! Likewise trying to teach Shakespeare to kids who can barely read and write!

I know these days people say they don't need to know much history, geography, etc., because it's all easily accessible via google, but the same applied decades ago when people had books or encyclopaedias or maps! Likewise with engineers/mathematicians - they didn't memorise everything, they had "props" such as log books, slide rules, etc., so just needed to know how to use them.

What I could never understand was, say, in Maths or Physics exams, you'd get some equations on the back page (or separate sheet) to help you, but not all. I remember thinking it was particularly strange for them to give you the equation for the volume of a sphere but not the volume of a cone. Just why??? In real life, today you'd google it, but back then, you'd just open your book of equations if you needed to do it for your job - school students only need to know that there IS an equation and how to extract the relevant numbers and work out the equation.

But it's a lot worse now and a huge amount of the curriculum is pretty irrelevant. We need to be concentrating on research, comprehension, understanding, rather than learning things we'll never need to know once we leave school!

shearwater2 · 26/02/2024 17:18

I think young people are the opposite of cossetted and are put under a lot of pressure to perform well academically. Universities all want As for courses that required Cs a few years ago.

And not many other options or alternative routes are given for those who are not academic, or are capable of getting qualifications but not at the prescribed time 16 or 18. It's either you get As or you're a failure.

It's certainly not that they aren't allowed to fail, it's that so many are made to feel like failures.

greatwesternmailman · 26/02/2024 17:17

Realityisreal · 26/02/2024 14:08

@greatwesternmailman my son is similar, fully capable in the structured environment of the classroom, incredibly resilient when he had a major operation with a 6 month very painful recovery time at age 16 , great exam results followed by a huge breakdown at uni and is still in recovery. He has depression and been diagnosed with ASD and ADHD.
He's stopped masking and is rebuilding himself, I'm incredibly grateful he's still with us but the rebuild is slow and painful to watch, I would do anything to 'fix him' but he doesn't feel he deserves to be fixed, resilience isn't the issue.
Maybe we could investigate a school system that rewards bullies and ignores their victims, look to your own school processes for bullying, you'll find plenty of resources and interventions for how to support the bully but what support does the victim get, my son was told that his bully had a difficult home life as if that meant that the behaviour should be excused and ignored. I fully support troubled children having help but the people who dread going to school every day because of their bullying also need support.
Add ASD to the mix and the utter unfairness of the situation which becomes internalised as I don't deserve help because my home life is good and I should always be perfect, if I'm not, I'm a failure because I'm not disadvantaged.

@Realityisreal I’m so sorry to hear that your son suffered so badly, I had a very similar experience and also had a breakdown at uni. I’m really pleased that he is getting help. If it helps, I’m almost 30 now and things do get better! I still have tough times but the burdens are lighter to carry.

SweetBirdsong · 26/02/2024 17:17

Namechangechangeobv · 26/02/2024 13:14

And WTF do we do about it?

Obviously many young people are wonderfully resilient but the overall trend I’ve seen in my line of work (behavioural education) is that there are vast, and I mean VAST numbers of young adults who cannot leave the house, come into a classroom, look someone in the eye, make a phone call, speak infront of the class (if they make it in), cry when pronouns are wrong (daily occurrence), take responsibility to revise/get a job/learn to drive.

What is going to happen to these humans in the future?

Nah, they'll be fine. Every older generation (like us) has thought this about the younger ones. We were all fine, really. And the GenZs and millennials will be fine too!

No need to stress about the young 'uns. Grin

Ofcourseshecan · 26/02/2024 17:17

Katypp · 26/02/2024 14:27

We may never know why this is, but it strikes me there are certain factors and changes that have happened while these young adults were growing up that can't have helped matters:

  1. The 'everyone is special' ethos in primary schools gives young children an inflated idea of their importance;
  2. The tendancy over the last few years for parents to protect children from anything that might make them unhappy/bored/out of their comfort zone
  3. The increasing isolation of childhood - the pandemic will not have helped - where parents shun any offers of advice/help/experience and gather their children up if a stranger dares to speak to them
  4. The increasing tendancy to normalise mental health issues - in general this is probably a good thing, but it can lead to over-thinking and obsession
  5. It used to be quite normal to be married and have children in your early-mid 20s. Nowadays this is fairly unusual, so young people have a bigger window of opportunity to think about just themselves
  6. The tendancy for people to make excuses for everything. You see it all the time on here: A woman parked in a disabled bay and she was not disabled - she might have invisable disabilities, she might be collecting someone disabled, she might be fleeing some one and needed a safe space asap etc etc etc. The liklihood is she was just being a twat really, but excuses, excuses, be kind etc.
  7. Resiliance isn't encouraged anymore. Everything is always someone else's fault and no-one is accountable for their own actions.
  8. Finally - the internet. There is no longer any requirement to get on with others or fit in as no matter how niche your opinion is, there is always someone who will agree with you.

All true.

MushMonster · 26/02/2024 17:17

They are so much more free to say how they fell, which, in a way, is good.
But afyer addressing how you fell, you should look for the reasons and the solutions, yourself!
I think the parenting and education that they had is too blame of a good %. It is like they stopped there. I feel sad, followed by tears. And then a grown up (now, replaced by manager) takes over.
Children, teens and young adults do need to learn to deal with their feelings on their own. Raise it at work when is relevant.

DarkestBeforeDawn · 26/02/2024 17:16

I work in education and completely agree with you. It is concerning to see.

shearwater2 · 26/02/2024 17:15

I guess "life skills" now involves a lot more tech than it used to and a lot of people of all ages have a struggle with it at times.

Goldenbear · 26/02/2024 17:15

Newbutoldfather · 26/02/2024 16:34

Both the school system and parents have a lot to answer for.

Resilience is all about learning how to fail, but we try to prevent our children failing and overly sympathise when young people are upset about something trivial, saying that their feelings are ‘valid’ (whatever that means).

Parents are very reluctant to allow their children to explore the world other than in a totally safe way, as fear of predatory paedophiles and muggers seems to trump the benefit of those scary experiences of getting lost, avoiding dodgy situations etc.

Grade inflation is massive. We talk growth mindset (wrongly) and tell young people that they can be whatever they want. In addition, most private schools now have drop in counsellors, where school kids can go whenever they feel a bit upset. We have validate MH as a legitimate complaint, which is fine except we don’t seem to think, unlike any other illness, it requires a medical diagnosis. People can just say their MH is suffering, and others have to accept it.

And now universities seem to be joining in, cosseting young people until they are 21. Loads on here want universities to contact them if their children are having problems, denying them the autonomy of adulthood at 18.

It just isn’t surprising that young people are conditioned into seeing the world as a scary place…

My parents were Boomers and were quite comfortable inhabiting the mindset of not wanting your children to feel like they were failures, particularly my Mum. It is anecdotal but I don't think resilience is a generational trait, I think it is a personality trait.

ShakerP3g · 26/02/2024 17:14

Maarlia · 26/02/2024 17:11

For me, resilience starts young.

Children need lots of play, try and fail type toys, try and change toys, things to return to, toys to help with problem solving, a chance to be independent, to think for themselves.
This includes jigsaw, construction toys, small world play and lots of time outside.
Teens need to realise ( and parents too) that not all children are ‘neuro-diverse’ - they just have different personalities, needs and interests. They require parental support to develop strategies to meet their own needs.

My DC’s are older - as a student, a sudden claim of MH issues was followed by lots of conversation, lots of checking in and unpicking. This uncovered a young adult who was a procrastinator, unable to manage time and failing through last minute pressures of assignments to complete. Strategies shared and adopted to improve time management, lessened the anxiety of completing work and increased DC’s success, resilience and self reliance and motivation.

In time, DC could recognise and laugh about ‘being just lazy’! ( and disorganised and tired from too many parties). He recognised procrastination as part of his personality. ( goodness me he was always last out of the changing rooms at age right, last to put his coat on to get in the car).

I'm not saying this is the case for all, I was very careful in listening and supporting and if genuine MH issues were evident the support would have been different. However, having personality traits does not mean there are MH issues.

Right. Please don’t dismiss neurodiversity as just having different interests. It’s far more than that.

BestBadger · 26/02/2024 17:13

FlissyPaps · 26/02/2024 17:03

So are you saying only academic people can be resilient as opposed to people who go down vocational routes and artsy careers?

I'm an academic. I currently have two of my managers off with stress and there's always at least one member off staff in the dept off with stress.

I'm also a bit concerned that none of the academics or educators on this thread have referenced any actual research.

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