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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think she shouldn't put him in tights?

635 replies

TotoroElla · 23/02/2024 23:01

Just trying to understand and find a way forward.

A family member's little boy is in foster care currently. He is 4 yo. The FC keeps putting him in tights. His mum is getting upset with it and doesn't understand why she keeps doing it. She has asked for her to stop and the SW has asked her to stop too. Mum doesn't feel it is very dignified for him to be at nursery wearing what is culturally a girls' clothes item. He was getting so hot in them the other day as of course he has trousers over them.

Can anyone shed any light as to why she is doing this or what his mum can do about it?

OP posts:
TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 11:20

Iwasafool · 24/02/2024 09:18

It isn't freezing at the moment but it isn't so hot that he's going to be too warm outside. Maybe the FM thinks layers are better, two layers outside and then one layer can come off once he is inside. After all we don't insist kids just wear one layer on top, he's probably got a vest, jumper and jacket on when he's outside but on his legs just trousers?

I used to work in a police station, lots of officers would wear tights under their trousers, it was something openly discussed and no more of an issue for the men than it was for the women.

I'd definitely be too hot outside in tights and trousers in the daytime. He would have a blanket over his legs if in the buggy or if walking would be really warm anyway and the jacket would probably be off!

Also he's just going from house to car to house so not outside, anyway.

OP posts:
TathingScinsel · 24/02/2024 11:19

Stravaig · 24/02/2024 11:06

@TathingScinsel 😍That website! 'compression and hug sensation'
There's official terminology for something I've always searched out but struggled to describe aloud to others without sounding batshit.

Yes! Some ND people love a tight hugging sensation and others cannot cope with it at all! Some people like it on a top half (eg sports bra) and hate it on a lower half (tights) and vice versa and some people are ok with it on Monday and feel like it’s gonna suffocate them on Tuesday.

There are lots of resources online re: clothing and sensory processing sensitivities but unfortunately the historical bias of only boys being diagnosed early and tights being an item of clothing usually worn by girls means that official literature relating directly to tights is a bit lacking. Lots of discussion on forums though (both mums of daughter and adult autistic women) and lots of official generalised info re: things like tight waist bands and toe seams.

Hopefully the FC will see sense if someone can explain that tights on a sensory sensitive person can feel like torture.
Occupational Therapists who specifically work with autistic people are absolutely brilliant on this stuff and while wait lists are long, the little chap in the OP will almost definitely benefit from OT involvement, if he doesn’t already have it.

if he does have an OT, get them to write a letter to social services re: clothing and sensory overload (which can seem like overheating, whilst being a slightly different physiologically mechanism).

HMW1906 · 24/02/2024 11:18

Is he prone to taking his socks off? I’ve put my baby/younger toddler boy in tights under his trousers when it’s cold as he doesn’t keep his socks on, it’s either that or his has very cold feet. I’ve also put my boys tights on under trousers when it’s freezing outside, joggers aren’t all that warm so a. Extra layer helps.

The FC putting the child in tights wouldn’t be my hill to die on though, let it go, it’s nearly summer anyway so it won’t be an issue anymore.

Northernnight · 24/02/2024 11:15

Illbefinejustbloodyfine · 24/02/2024 11:14

It's a complete non issue for me. Why is it upsetting?

Perhaps read the full thread or even just the OP posts and you will see the issue.

TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 11:15

WimbyAce · 24/02/2024 09:16

Regardless of boy or girl there is no need for tights under trousers in the current weather, perhaps if it was freezing then a good idea as an extra layer. Has foster carer said why they are doing it?

No, they haven't. I think she needs to be asked directly why she is doing it to get to the bottom of it.

OP posts:
rainbowunicorn · 24/02/2024 11:14

Stravaig · 24/02/2024 09:03

It doesn't matter why he's in foster care, what matters is that he is, that's he's away from his family. Maybe he likes wearing tights, maybe they help him feel snug and secure and protected, like swaddling for a baby, or a blankie. Maybe that's what the carer has picked up on.

My point is focus on the important stuff, not stereotypical boys and girls clothing.

Read the OPs posts. He dosen't like them. He is too hot with them on to the point he is crying and his skin is red and blotchy with the heat,

Illbefinejustbloodyfine · 24/02/2024 11:14

It's a complete non issue for me. Why is it upsetting?

Theresstilltonighttocome · 24/02/2024 11:12

SanctusInDistress · 24/02/2024 10:51

I put tights on my son when he was little and cold outside, and he was warm and cosy. I don’t think anybody else even noticed. He’s 15 now and has not been scarred by it.

Right, but was he hot, blotchy itchy and distressed?

Were you his foster carer who continued to make him uncomfortable like this when his mother, nursery and SW had told you to stop?

No? Then it’s not relevant is it.

TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 11:12

N27 · 24/02/2024 09:11

I think you’re confusing matters.

unecessary items because it’s hot - fine. You may have a point.

going on about being dignified, being picked on, mum doesn’t like it etc is all ridiculous. They are all issues you are creating/imagining. It’s not undignified it’s a piece of clothing for gods sake. And there has been absolutely no mention of any other 4 year olds noticing let alone commenting, so the argument of him being picked on is entirely in your head.

it’s a difference in opinion, but ultimately he’s not being harmed and the foster carer os being paid to look after the child in the way she thinks best.

Only may have a point about him being uncomfortable? In what scenario is it fine for him to be uncomfortable?

Being undignified - came from the specialist SW - not something I have created or imagined
Mum doesn't like it - also not something I have created or imagined and as she has parental responsibility it is her choice to say she doesn't want him to wear tights. It is really that simple.
Being picked on - I have said I told mum that wouldn't happen so again not creating or imagining that.

The FC is being paid to care for the DC but his mum retains parental responsibility. And I do believe him being uncomfortable and miserable is harmful.

OP posts:
ilovesushi · 24/02/2024 11:07

Op, so sorry to hear about your situation. Sending good wishes to you and your family. xxx

rainbowunicorn · 24/02/2024 11:06

SKG231 · 24/02/2024 08:49

You say your sister is unwell and receiving treatment and that’s the reason why your nephew is in foster care. If you’re that bothered about the level of care he’s receiving why aren’t you or another family member stepping up and looking after him?

don’t go after a selfless person who fosters other peoples children because of an item of clothing she puts them in.

The OP has explained this already. Don't judge if you can't be arsed reading the OP comments.

Rosestulips · 24/02/2024 11:06

Stillanothernamechange · 24/02/2024 10:52

I clicked on the thread title all prepared to be outraged at gender-restrictive norms (as someone who regularly puts boys that age in tights if they’re cold), then read that the boy is in foster care AND HIS SOCIAL WORKER HAS ASKED THE FOSTER CARER TO STOP.

Because I’m not a massive bellend, I reassessed my pre-judgment of the situation at that point. Didn’t even need to find out that the reason he’s in foster care is that his mother has cancer.

Sorry about all the bellends on your post OP 💐

I avoided thread initially because I thought the same but I’m absolutely shocked at some of the vile responses on here.

It’s completely derailed the thread, the OP has been so calm and patient, glad she is advocating for this child and supporting his mother.

Stravaig · 24/02/2024 11:06

@TathingScinsel 😍That website! 'compression and hug sensation'
There's official terminology for something I've always searched out but struggled to describe aloud to others without sounding batshit.

ilovesushi · 24/02/2024 11:03

That is really really weird and really off. After covid when all the windows in my DC's schools were open, DS was very cold and wore thermals under his school uniform. But they were specifically thermals, the sort used by hikers etc, not girl's tights.

It sounds a weird controlling behaviour from the foster career not taking into account his needs. Does she have some agenda? Was she wanting to look after a girl? Has she swallowed some gender guff about cross dressing children?

I would be angry and concerned.

GleeFull · 24/02/2024 11:03

TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 10:51

Yes, I find it strange people think a SW wouldn't be talking about dignity. That's the first person I would think would be talking about it.

And I would agree with the other poster, contact the SW and ask them to speak with the SSW. This is about views and wishes. The child’s views are apparent if he’s uncomfortable and mum has made hers clear with the SW’s backing. It needs raising at the next LAC review but if it’s ongoing I would email and have a written record if it needs escalating before that date. He’s likely to be eligible for a non instructed advocate if you’re really getting nowhere but with the SW backing, I can’t imagine this won’t be resolved. (I’m an advocate btw)

TathingScinsel · 24/02/2024 11:02

Here’s a 6 year old thread of autistic adult women discussing the sensory issues that tights can create.

it’s entirely probable that this poor little non-verbal boy is experiencing lots of the same uncomfortable sensations.

I’d use this sort of info as a basis to tackle the FC (via the SW):

https://www.autismforums.com/threads/sensory-issues-freaking-tights.22354/

Sensory issues - freaking tights.

i don't know if this is the right place to post this, i hope it is. ever since i was little, i've had some pretty bad sensory issues. i couldn't wear jeans, long sleeves, baggy pants, those weird leggings with the multicolored fabric, see-through or la...

https://www.autismforums.com/threads/sensory-issues-freaking-tights.22354/

zingally · 24/02/2024 11:02

I work in infants schools.

It's getting increasingly common to find the boys wearing leggings or tights under their trousers.
In my area it's more common amongst black and eastern european communities. Does the foster family fall into either of those categories?

rainbowunicorn · 24/02/2024 11:01

Lumiodes · 24/02/2024 08:31

If the child has been taken into foster care then tights are the least of his problems. If Mum wants to decide what he wears then maybe don’t get him taken off you?

Don't be an arsehole if you can't even be bothered to read the OP posts. She said early on teh rea.son for the foster care

Bushmillsbabe · 24/02/2024 11:01

Just out of interest, where is the Foster carer from? I work in a SEN school and the child who have parents if eastern European descent almost always come in with tights/leggings on under their trousers, even on quite warm spring/autumn days.
Depending on what type if SEN he has (neurodiverse/ physical disability) parents perceive that their child with a physical disability will cold as be moving less, could that be a factor?
You say he is unable to express himself, so maybe FC worries about him not being able to say he us cold so goes for extra layers. Although same goes for being too hot. If the nursery think he is too warm, surely they can just take them off him, and put on for hometime.
FC do not have to follow parents requests if they do not feel in child's best interests, but they are supossed to follow SW guidance.
Is he still in nappies, are they being used to hold this on? Maybe some cycling shorts might be a better option for this

If family have concerns about the FC, could they look after the child instead, as a familiar person?

Miyagi99 · 24/02/2024 11:00

TotoroElla · 23/02/2024 23:22

But it's not chilly! You'd be freezing travelling from one house to another when the temperature is 10c - way above freezing! Then being in a warm house, you'd need long Johns?! I understand sportsmen being outside wearing them in cold weather. But this is a toddler inside!

I wear tights or long johns under my clothes nearly all winter. I find it odd kids (at 4 too) would know how he was wearing them at all or even knowing that they’re ‘for girls’ - which they’re not exclusively btw.

rainbowunicorn · 24/02/2024 11:00

JMSA · 24/02/2024 08:28

It seems a funny thing for mum to focus on, given the situation. I hope she feels better and able to have her son back soon Flowers

Couldn't anyone else in the family have had him, to save him going to a stranger?

It really isn't a funny thing for the focus on. She will be feeling that she has no control over her life just now. She is having treatment that is very much dictatedm when, where and how long. Her child is living with someone else and her whole life is upside down. If she can get some comfort if she knows that the FC is taking her wishes into account. The FC should be listening to what the mum is saying and not rying to override her.

TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 10:58

CecilyP · 24/02/2024 09:08

10 degrees is cold, especially if he's playing outside at nursery.

It really isn’t! Minus temperatures are cold! If 4 year olds are outside, they’re generally running around being active, not standing about. That’s what adults do and they don’t normally wear tights under trousers! Tights are normally associated with girls because girls wear skirts and dresses. However, when it’s this mild there are plenty of girls just wearing socks with their dresses.

Exactly! And yes, plenty of girl's at DD's school wearing ankle socks.

OP posts:
TathingScinsel · 24/02/2024 10:56

TotoroElla · 24/02/2024 10:49

I've already said multiple times - he does not like wearing them. They make him too hot. The majority of DC would be too hot in tights and joggers in this mild weather. This little boy runs hot so he is even more uncomfortable. Mum (who has looked after him for over 4 years) has 'picked up' on that.

Lots of SEN girls hate tights too. I think they are a very love or hate item for people (especially children) with sensory sensitivity, not much middle ground.

It’s such an oft-observed phenomenon that specialist products exist eg: https://sensorysmart.co.uk/collections/seamless-tights-cotton?grid_list=grid-view

Joggers are often a very acceptable clothing choice for ASD children, plus they are cheap to buy and easy to wash - seems to me they are an obvious start point for the sensory sensitive, whereas tights are an obvious avoid-unless-compulsory for school uniform item!

Seems like the FC is making everyone miserable for no good practical reason at all.

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Sensory Clothing (IE) Seamless Toe School Tights are soft, warm, comfortable, and durable. Made with high quality organic cotton. Sensory Clothing tights are made using a seamless toe technology and have a flat seam gusset to reduce as much irritation...

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RosaBaby2 · 24/02/2024 10:55

Haven't read the full thread.

Tights are not 'undifnified' at any age for either sex.

Does he wear vests, as if still in nappies maybe the FC is using the tights to hold his nappy up?

If the child is too hot nursery should be saying something to the carer.

Hope mum gets better soon, must be so hard for her.

rainbowunicorn · 24/02/2024 10:55

YetAnotherSpartacus · 24/02/2024 07:55

If her parenting is so poor that her child is in foster care, then I think that him wearing tights is the least of her worries.
Maybe she should start examining her own actions rather thsn those of the person eho is keeping him safe.

This is one of the most vile posts I have ever read on MN.

Disgusting.

I Agree, that particular poster has form for ill thought out responses but this is a new low even for them.