To be angry that Scarlet Blake is being called a woman.

I think most of them probably wouldn't have been in any doubt, but what a confusing position to be in. They were being asked to consider two opposing explanations of what happened that night. The prosecution case was that Blake, constantly referred to as she/her, had overpowered this tall young man in a violent struggle. The defence case was simply, no I didn't. Now, there was plenty of evidence in this case to make it a fairly straightforward decision for the jury. But what if it had been absolutely crucial to understand how physically strong the defendant was? We know that lots of people don't understand what sex a transwoman is, what transgender means, that most transwomen haven't had surgery in the genital area, that most went through male puberty, and so on.

Not in the case of those who are assigned male at birth, (who do, for some reason we don't fully understand, seem to make up the majority of trans people. It's possible that autism may play a role).

But regardless of when we consider a baby to be born/human etc., sex is primarily assigned based on what's between our legs (or will be). And that works out for 99% of people.

But our sense of self comes from what's between our ears, not our legs. And human genetics aren't perfect - things go wrong all the time. The brain and body makes mistakes. But since most cis people don't grasp what's going on in the heads of trans people, you judge us by the standards that work for you.

This isn’t the proof you think it is.

The article says that:

“The brains of transgender women ranged between cisgender men and cisgender women (albeit still closer to cisgender men)”

and

”The follow-up post hoc tests revealed that transgender women were […] significantly less female than cisgender women”

(albeit a broken one)

Excuse me?!

@Erin394 I'm pretty sure that study shows that the brains of men who identify as women are far closer to the average male brain than the average female brain, so its not a great argument in your favour. Also as pointed out previously it doesn't control for sexuality.

1. The post is claiming that the criminal is a man, and 94% agree that this is reasonable. It shows how much of a fine line we tread because the focus isn't on what this horrible person has done, but their trans status. The moment they do something perceived as masculine, their "womanness" gets socially revoked.

Interesting how when it suits, particularly to garner sympathy and push the most vulnerable and oppressed line the trans status of an individual is front, centre and all important and yet when it comes to cases like this one secrecy and obfuscation are the order of the day.

Why is that @Erin394 ?

That study wasnt even controlled for sexual orientation. It proves absolutely nothing.

"the focus isn't on what this horrible person has done, but their trans status."

The focus is absolutely on what this person has done - and that's why most women want no part of being associated with them. This person was not born a woman, is not a woman now and will not be a woman at any point in the future so why are we being told that a woman committed this crime?

I support the right of everyone, including trans women and trans men to live in peace and present how they like. But if you are male and you go around torturing animals and murdering people don't expect to be "respected as a woman". This person can choose to present as a woman but they are no more a woman than they are a cat (which they also identify as by the way). I expect cats would also be offended at the association if they could be.

Gametes are not produced at birth, and that is not how gender is assigned at birth. Some trans people never produce any if they transition, and some people don't even produce any gametes whatsoever, yet they aren't viewed as being sexless.

You've completely misunderstood the relevance of gametes in defining sex. An embryo in its mother's womb develops as either a male or a female. What that means is that the body is organised around the production of either small gametes or large gametes. A body organised around producing small gametes (sperm) will have a penis and testicles and the other male organs. A body organised around producing large gametes (eggs) and being capable of gestation (having a baby) will have ovaries, oviduct, Fallopian tubes, womb, cervix, vagina and after puberty will have quite different breast tissue from a male human.

It's not relevant whether you actually do produce these gametes or not, or whether you ever go on to reproduce. What matters is that having the genes that make you male or female affects the rest of your body too, and determines what happens in your body at puberty.

Growing up male or female also affects how you are treated in all sorts of ways and what expectations other people have of you, and you have of yourself.

It's a moot point whether male violence is the result of having a male body or growing up male, or a mixture. For the safety of the rest of us, though, it doesn't matter why most of the violence and almost all sexual crimes come from males, not females - it just matters that we know it and we organise ourselves to try to keep the more vulnerable members of society safe from it.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8955456/

Note that the trans people studied were all pre-HRT, so their brains have also been affected by a lifetime of masculinisation or feminisation. We still don't know the full impact of that or where their brains would be on the spectrum without that influence.

Me too.

1. Gametes are not produced at birth, and that is not how gender is assigned at birth. Some trans people never produce any if they transition, and some people don't even produce any gametes whatsoever, yet they aren't viewed as being sexless.

Nonsense.

Human females are born with their entire lifetime supply of gametes. At birth, the normal female ovary contains about 1-2 million/oocytes (eggs).

Also, sex is not assigned at birth, it is determined at conception and observed, often in the womb and always at birth (with very rare exceptions where further tests are needed to discover which of the two sexes the baby is).

Those very rare individuals born without ovaries or testes are still either female or male.

Sex in humans is binary and immutable. Humans cannot change sex, any more than any ither mammalian species.

@Erin394 I'm not sure I have grasped your post.

As you understand it, what is one difference between a man and a woman if it's not physical sex? Or are you saying there is no distinction between the two?

The large gamete that made me was present in my grandmother. It formed in her womb inside my mother. My mother was born with the eggs that made me and my siblings.

I love thinking about this.

Theres Been no revoking of this person's ‘womanness’. They never had any they were always and always will be male along with all other men regardless of how they feel.

You do not feel like a woman, you feel like you. You cannot know what a woman feels like for obvious reasons.

The large gamete that made me was present in my grandmother. It formed in her womb inside my mother. My mother was born with the eggs that made me and my siblings. My Dad made many small gametes as and when they were needed 🤣 best not think about that

Lol, at a transwoman being a "woman with masculine features".

Get a grip.

And statistically, creepy criminality increasingly looks like feature not a bug so I'm sorry if you just happen to be a "good egg" who only likes to trample on women's boundaries and enter spaces and sporting categories that aren't meant for you just a little teensy bit or whatever but maybe have a word with you trans "mates" about reining in the bad behaviour rather than popping up to scold women for pointing it out, eh?

The moment they do something perceived as masculine, their "womanness" gets socially revoked.

No "womanliness" was ever granted to this person so there is nothing to "revoke".

1. Why don't you tell me? Why should trans people have to be subject to such probing? If you had testosterone in your veins and male features, you would still feel like a woman,(albeit a broken one). That's how we feel.

1. Gametes are not produced at birth, and that is not how gender is assigned at birth. Some trans people never produce any if they transition, and some people don't even produce any gametes whatsoever, yet they aren't viewed as being sexless.

1. The post is claiming that the criminal is a man, and 94% agree that this is reasonable. It shows how much of a fine line we tread because the focus isn't on what this horrible person has done, but their trans status. The moment they do something perceived as masculine, their "womanness" gets socially revoked.

Finally a sensible reply has appeared on Reddit thread.

A previous Redditor has said that trans criminals are so rare that they would have a negligible impact on crime statistics for women.

The response is:

”I'm sorry but I think this is actually wrong.
125/3812 women in prison are sex offenders (3.3%) 76/129 transwomen in prison are sex offenders
If the transwomen are counted in the women category the percentage goes from 3.3% to 5.1%. I don't think numbers like that can be negligible”

A lone voice of reason on that thread and will probably be downvoted / attacked for daring to use facts over feelings.

I want to know who these crimes are recorded. They should be recorded by biological sex, so that data is not distorted by politics.

The discussion here is that a man is being presented in the press as a woman, and it's straight forward gaslighting. Particularly as his abhorrent crimes are being painted as something a woman did.

It is not rational to extrapolate from this that women objecting and discussing this are doing anything to 'make' someone 'feel like an abomination' - how a random reader of the thread chooses to draw this rather stretched and irrational conclusion and take it personally is a 'them' problem that they might want to unpick, and seek advice on. It is also not rational to require women not to protest and discuss this important issue to women in case someone has distantly linked thoughts and feelings that upset them.

Yet when a transwoman has masculine features and hormone levels, a lot of people see that person as a man, not a woman with a medical issue (perhaps due to a genetic mutation), and so we get no help and are hated for it.

I don't see any males as women of any kind, I see them all as men. It's not personal.

This is a man who has committed a male typical crime, not a woman with a medical issue.

The reports seem to be that Scarlett/ Alice / previous name coming out as Trans was integral to the alienation that led to matey torturing and murdering that cat and that lad to keep the also trans lover. That seems to actually have been cited as a defence. I also assumed they were female as from the photo they just looked odd. I was half expecting Janey Godley to mention this like she did with Lucy Letby as proof woman could murder

If we allow our reality to get this fucked up, then where does it stop?

I was sexually assaulted by a man within the confines of our heterosexual relationship. If I was to change my preferred gender before the court date... does that make my assailant the rapist of a young man? Did James attack "her" or "him"? Would James be compelled to address me as he/him in the court and would press write about a dad of one Bruno (my new name) raped by his own boyfriend?

I mean... Waves finger at the temple... I think I need some time with the nature, the birds and the bees, just to confirm that the world is rolling on just fine, as it always did and always will do...

Please provide this evidence you speak of about brains.