To ask why you send your children to private school?

I'm also fine with it. I worked out it would be an extra £200p/m on DDs fees. It won't mean huge sacrifices - just a cheaper than normal holiday and I'd probably think about downgrading the car.

I sit in the school pick up queue in my little A Class Mercedes which I know is a massive and unnecessary expensive luxury. Am parked behind giant SUV style Lamborghinis , Porsches. Mercedes and BMWs and also see plenty of high status sports cars too. I dread to think how much these things cost even to lease.

I've been in these peoples houses. They make my lovely 4 bed semi look like a hovel.

The kids talk about their amazing holidays. We go to 2 star hotels in Greece with Jet2 ( love this type of low key holiday ) or until last year camped in our tent every summer while DD's mates are flying first class to Dubai and The Maldives , or to their "little place in Spain"

These people can afford to pay more and I get irritated at all the moaning quite frankly!

@Labraradabrador yes of course, but you know there are lots of different private schools and lots of ‘tribes’ within those schools. You and your children are very likely to hang out with people with similar backgrounds/reasons that you are there

I also got an unsolicited PM asking me to sign a petition. And I agree it’s rude, and it puts me off the poster.

As it happens, I’m happy to pay more in tax to support state schools. I’m not convinced that VAT on fees is the most effective way to do so, but I agree with the principle of progressive taxation.

No reason other than it’s illegal in the EU and not done anywhere else in the world.

Are they all wrong and Labour are the only organisation globally to make the right call?

Maybe if you are so in favour of it and believe it should be levied then you could offer to pay a voluntary tax equivalent to the amount it would have cost you over the 14 years. Are you up for that or are you just in favour of tax rises provide someone else pays?

We paid private school fees for DT’s from ages 4-18 but I do think VAT should be charged. There is no reason for them to be exempt.

@AngelsWithSilverWings I got an unsolicited PM too.

@WhatWorks this is a rude and inappropriate use of the PM function. There is a section of mumsnet for posting threads about petitions, which each user can choose for themselves whether to go to.

A petition on this topic is a silly idea anyway. It's not like Labour are under any illusions that there won't be a lot of people affected by the tax who are sad about it. A petition isn't going to add any information. If Labour are democratically elected with this being one of their headline policies then it would be wrong of them to change said policy on the basis of a few thousand signatures on a petition. The policy may be challenged in the law courts if its legal implications aren't fully thought through. I don't love the policy, but democracy and the rule of law are more important to me, so I wouldn't dream of signing it.

Thanks for the direct message OP but I won't be signing the petition you sent me to stop the 20% increase if Labour get in. Did anyone else get one?

I wonder if this is the reason OP started the thread. Is sending unsolicited petitions in this way allowed on here?

I’m not sure on 3 and 4!
In the main the people I know are either just well off and that’s what they do send their kids to private school.

Or people in my boat who tried state schools first, we live in a outstanding state school catchment for both primary and secondary (and we also have a single Grammar), we do have a smaller house as house prices are high (because of the good schools) but we want to live in this area as it’s lovely!

The state schools as brilliant as they are didn’t suit my DC. The private prep and now seniors have been transformational.

My kids know they’re lucky and love their schools. We are not that rich that they don’t know the reality of the world.

Hmm. I’ve never met the people described in 3 and 4 (admittedly my children go to school in central London).

How do the social climbers piggy back onto others’ lifestyles? Do they make them take them on holiday?

This sort of thing reminds me of when people claim that going to independent school gives you “contacts”. Also news to me. The days of being able to quietly get your friend’s child an interesting internship are long gone.

But people are talking about their specific experiences of why they chose private school and unfortunately much of it is because of a crap experience after attending state first.

Sorry @wallywotwot , agree with @Charlie2121 that I don’t see any of this in my dc current cohort. Instead we have:

• There is one teacher who moved to the school specifically so they could get a discount that would enable their dc to attend - it was their children’s educational needs driving their career choice, not the other way around
• we are there because of SEN
• another teacher who works in a local state primary and thinks the offering is so poor she chose to use a windfall to fund her dc in private
• two other families have joined recently because they were disappointed in state after a couple of years
• two other families have older siblings in the school so younger ones started in reception by default. Both seem to place high value on sports opportunities, and are maybe slightly more of the private school by default mindset
• two families with expat parents who felt the private school was better aligned with cultural expectations of education. I am also in this camp as a secondary factor

we are all there for different reasons, but the vast majority of us did not start private by default or for any sort of social reasons. Most of us have first hand experience with local schools and weren’t happy with the offering, several of us having tried state first before switching to private.

Has anyone mentioned politics? For some people, using private schools is a matter of putting their money where their mouth is in relation to their political views.

Yep borderline for me with 2 kids doing secondary only private but I costed the move to great catchment in city and it would be around £200-250k more for a nearly equivalent house (4 bed detached). If you add interest to the higher mortgage over 10 years then it would definitely cost more than private school fees for us. Plus we don't really want to move. Around us that's quite common. People living in cheaper suburbia and sending kids into the private city schools.

When I went to work in schools, it wasn't the schools or their staff that were the issue. It was the behaviour of the pupils (not all obviously) and I hold parents responsible for that.

I don’t fit into any of those groups nor indeed do any other parents I know who use private schools.

My reason was DD's adhd. She's still not recovered fully 5 years on from the assault on her confidence by her 'outstanding' state primary. I was concerned the local secondary would be the same because it's the same catchment, also 'outstanding' and the visit gave me the vibe that there was the same kind of lazy leadership because they can trust that the majority of the middle class parents will also be able to pick up the slack by tutoring etc.
And just on the diversity point, a state school in a leafy borough where the wealthier middle classes can afford to buy an in-catchment house, can be way less diverse than a private school like DD's which is in a more mixed area.

I’m almost every case that’s true for single children.

It would cost around £200k extra to move between the worst and best catchment areas near me. At current interest rates that’s about an additional 10k per annum just in mortgage interest payments.

Add on stamp duty and other moving costs and you soon end up spending as much as a mid range private school costs.

Yes private schools are very often ethnically more diverse than the local state schools. I'm mixed race so that would be something I'm interested in.

But this 'diversity' is only one type....and private school is often very lacking in any other sort of diversity.

The people I know who send their children private are:

1. the type who went private and wouldn't occur to them not to with their own, they want to stay in their tribe
2. teachers who get a good discount and it means they have wrap around care & the same holidays
3. social climbers who want to break into the local cliche and enjoy piggy-backing the lifestyles of their much richer neighbours
4. more hippy types who like the green spaces and freedoms that the local private schools have (ironically this group are definitely the most snobbish)

@Tardyjo - also remember house prices in the UK are insane, it’s often more affordable to send your kids to private school than to buy a house in catchment for a good state school.

I don’t live in the UK but the responses to this are really making me wonder why everyone isn’t up in arms about the shocking state of schools.

If you have enough money for fees, then you probably live in a reasonably nice area. The idea that all these catchment schools are full of knife crime, disruption etc is just so shocking to me. Why are the schools so bad?

To avoid the massive, 12 form entry high school where she would get totally lost and overwhelmed.

To avoid the other, admittedly smaller high school where knife crime is a serious issue, amongst others.

Because she is bored and not stretched where she is, yet gets horrible comments from other kids because she actually wants to learn.

Because so much time in lessons is taken up with managing other kids behaviour.

Because I would prefer her to be out of a school where kids take weapons to school and break into the school and trash it.

Because, as a PP has said, I would prefer her to enjoy school, not endure it.

And no, I do not think the state system is good enough for everyone else's kids. It needs massive reform, investment and change. But that is a) not my fault, and b) won't be changed by labour's plan.

Better teaching - disruptive behaviour is simply not tolerated.

Smaller class sizes

Better facilities

Sciences taught as 3 separate topics

Single sex

DD wanted to do an "extra" GCSE which couldn't be timetabled so the classics teacher agreed to give her tuition in their free time. DD and one other child stayed for an extra hour after school once a week.

Less academic benefits. More self confidence and social networking that will pay off in future careers. Unfortunately, it does often boil down to "who you know" in certain careers.

My ds goes and has friends from China, Hong Kong, Dubai and Romania in his close friendship group.

He goes because we move so often through dh's job and wanted to give him some stability. He didn't go until secondary age as the educational benefits of travelling with family plus some homeschooling to fill gaps outweighed any advantage of private.

However, getting towards GCSE and moving so often becomes a real, future impacting hindrance.

But you are not, are you? Nobody has to learn or work and mix with people who refuse to follow reasonable instructions, swear, shout, ignore teachers, disrupt others from learning, destroy property and are violent or bully others. Anyone behaving like that at work would be sacked. If you went to a pub/restaurant/cinema etc and people behaved like that, they'd be removed or at least you could choose not to return. It is only our children (& teachers!) who we ask to tolerate ‘mixing’ like that.