Are my kids naughty or normal

Did I?

I took my own set, reversed and put a long sleeve bib over 😎

Wish I'd had that advice then - what a great idea!!

You said you were not replying a couple posts ago.

No! Of course I wasn’t implying THEY are traumatised and you must know that but obviously take a strange pleasure in misconstruing people’s ideas. Granted, I could have been clearer and less subtle, but it was just an example of why op shouldn’t compare herself/her children with others. If I meant what you imply I would have said so.

Me and my siblings were those very well behaved kids so I speak from experience.

just to let anyone else who is going to have a pop know that I won’t be responding to any more silly pile ons.

I know you say you reprimand and explain why they cant do stuff bit what is the consequence if they do it again? Leave restaurant? Return a toy? Confiscate something? Equally what child friendly thing do they have to do at the table and have they had an opportunity to do before the restaurant? It's a mix of discipline and reasonable expectations.

For example, I'd go to the park before a restaurant and not give snacks so hey are keen to sit at a table with books and colouring and some bread coupled with a threat of no ice cream work better than a morning of shopping in which the child has probably either been walking or sat in a pushchair and been told No all morning only to get to anoher place to sit still and be quiet feeling bored, full of energy and depleted willpower to behave.

A bit of give and take on activity planning, setting expectations and discipline I think.

I just reversed the straps so they did up behind their backs.
They are not Houdini 😂

You're implying her friend's children's good behaviour may be due to the result of some sort of trauma or possibly abuse.

Rather then them simply being well behaved due to good parenting.

That was low and unnecessary when you know it's far more likely to be down to good parenting.

My DS could get out of straps by a year old - it was awful.

You have already said that you give in to tantrums or give them screens to keep them quiet so I fear that you have inadvertently taught them that bad behaviour pays off.

You would only have to put them back in the car and go home 2-3 times for them to realise that bad behaviour has negative consequences.

Distraction, pre-empting triggers and following through on consequences work.

This get out clause will give you 10 year olds who can't sit still / are addicted to screens in restaurants.

Start small when they are small

^^

Clue is in the response. It will take you 10 years.

I don't think children at that age have any need to be in a restaurant.

The restaurant is your preference, not theirs.

Restaurants results in double the amount of parenting and expensive, uneaten food.

Total waste of your time and money and they don't enjoy it! Neither do you!

OP I had three under 3.5 at one point, I know, what an idiot! Young children are hard to manage, partly because it can be so random. One minute you’re bathed in a happy glow of being with adorable, beautiful souls, the next minute it’s bedlam and you fear you’ve brought demons into the world!

Once I had the second, and until the youngest was about 3, I stopped going to supermarkets with DC, full stop. They are stressful environments. DH or I went alone, often late at night. Not sure if this can be an option for you?

i also stopped socialising except at my/someone else’s home. Hearing the tuts of disapproving/stressed strangers just drove me crazy. Again, could this work for you?

Good luck OP, it will get better - but you do need to be firm.

I agree. They ran around cackling because they are allowed to. I can't understand why you wouldn't leave because it would ruin your day out. You could not have possibly enjoyed yourself with the DC behaving this way. You had to have been mortified. Give them the talk before Remove them immediately when acting up.

Well, it seemed to work for my daughter and later on her child. I suppose my message was that if they run rings round you at home why should they be any different in a cafe?

DS is a live wire more so than my DNs, however he doesn't run around in restaurants, cinema, theatre etc because from a very very young age we made it clear what was expected and if he couldn't do that we left. He didn't get snacks or screen time for poor behaviour. He doesn't get small screen time at all and he's just turned five.

We have always made sure we build active things into our days so we walk into town rather than drive, if there's a park where we're going he can play on it (weather permitting) , if we are doing something sedentary or boring in one part of the day we try and offset that, because it's a balance. I recognise his need for activity, but I expect him to recognise the need for behaviour appropriate to situations and environments.

DNs on the other hand more placid characters generally, older one definitely more compliant than DS. They run around restaurants, make noise in the cinema, and they are quietened with screens and snacks. It's just a very simple message about what the consequences to their behaviours are. They misbehave they get snacks and tablets, DS misbehaves he is taken away from the activity.

Her kids ARE perfectly normal. There is nothing naughty in the way they have responded to their parenting.

All children will behave exactly the way they are allowed to behave.

OP has allowed them screens and screams for entertainment and sweets, so this is what they do.

This get out clause will give you 10 year olds who can't sit still / are addicted to screens in restaurants.

Start small when they are small.

This.
You take them outside and sit them down and explain why it's not acceptable and they need to sit still and be pleasant.
Each and every time until it sinks in. It's shouldn't be long if they are of normal development.

Laughing at the thought of wrestling a 4yo into a highchair! It would have been a tight squeeze. Even if I'd managed to get mine in, I never would have got him out again, short of power tools ...

Helen Simpson has a very good short story about this exact situation in her collection Hey Yeah Right Get a Life. The exhausted, lonely mother is desperate to talk to her friend and feel understood, but their conversation is drowned out by the noise of her 2yo banging on the glass of the cafe display case. I often thought of it during those difficult toddler years. Hang in there OP, it does get better!

If you were feeling unsure of your parenting OP, I expect you are feeling rather hammered now! I’m amazed anyone would subject themselves to the judgement of this forum but hey-ho, you asked. Have to say I agree with all the posters who advocate consistency and boundaries. I despair at the use of screen time to avoid the difficulties of parenting young children. Yes, it’s hard and boring and often not much fun but it really is short term pain for long term gain. I have three DCs - it was hold my hand or go in the buggy and i would go straight home as a consequence for ignoring warnings and tantruming. Running around in a restaurant. No bloody way! DH and I spent many tedious lunches playing card games, doing stickers etc and reinforcing table manners and it did pay off. We can take them anywhere now and never use screens. I’m sure we’ve failed on other fronts and I do sympathise with you that this is a difficult stage but DO NOT give in for an easy life.

All I know is, if I was paying good money in a restaurant and toddlers were left to run around “cackling”, I would be complaining to restaurant management.

If my DC ever misbehaved in a restaurant, he would have been removed after fair warning. Yes it would have spoiled our meal, but failure to parent and control your own kids should not impact on a restaurant full of strangers.

Some kids are more active and spirited than others which means they may be harder to control in somewhere sedentary like a restaurant. I have 2 friends with toddler girls the same age, one of them is into everything and the other is more placid.

My ds2 doesn't need as much activity as ds1 does. They are older now (nearly 9 and nearly 6) but I still make sure we do something active like soft play or a bike ride to burn some energy off if I want them to be calm for a couple of hours after. Any bad behaviour is met with age appropriate consequences, my ds2 was playing up in Tesco today so after repeated warnings i didn't buy him the magazine that he'd picked.

But also I know their limits, we can manage a restaurant for a couple of hours but not all afternoon like a group of adults might do.

Your kids are young, I'm still learning, so are you.

They are far too young for screens.
they sound overstimulated and don’t know how to be bored.

If they are ok most of the time then don't worry to much.