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Land dispute!! Cheeky offer?!

307 replies

NewHere77 · 06/01/2024 20:41

It has recently come to light due to neighbours pending house sale, that our neighbour has around 20 square metres of land at the top of her garden that legally belongs to our boundary. She has asked us to sign over the land to her for £200.

AIBU to think she is being a CF offering £200 for the land, as I think it likely adds a lot of value to neighbours house? (She initially wanted us to sign over land for free)!

The land adds about a third to neighbours garden and has a pretty view which isn’t overlooked.

Neighbour is playing down desirability of land but has also said that buyers will pull out if land is not included and has said she is willing to go to court to claim land.

If we disagree, she is threatening to use adverse possession claim but neither parties have been in either property long enough to claim adverse possession, although neighbour is talking about getting accounts from relatives of now deceased previous occupants of our house.

Part of me feels bad that we bought the house not knowing the extra land was ours so feels a bit rich asking for more money for it, the other side of me is thinking why should our neighbour profit from land that is not legally theirs. Interested to hear others perspectives and what land could be worth.

Thanks!

OP posts:
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TervenAcademicals · 12/04/2024 18:27

@NewHere77 any update? Hope it has been relatively drama free for you.

GrannyRose15 · 10/01/2024 03:46

Saltysausage · 06/01/2024 20:48

Would an estate agent do a land valuation, if not I’m sure they could recommend someone.

I would want to know the proper value before signing it away.

What does the land registry show, how did you not realise before now that it’s yours?

You need a surveyor not an estate agent as they are mostly only concerned with properties that are easy to sell. A surveyor will give you a valuation. You then have to decide if you want to sell or keep the land. Don’t let your neighbour bully you into letting her have it cheap. It is not your problem if her sale falls through. Of course there is always the option of negotiating a sale directly with her buyers. Still get a market price for it.

TempleOfBloom · 09/01/2024 21:22

I would say to the neighbours that you need to restore the boundary to that which your mortgage company have agreed to lend on.

It is OK to say you have thought about it and you are sorry to say you don’t want to sell, and that your consideration of the issue brought the mortgage issue into focus. So in fact you would now like to tidy it up and restore the boundary.

it is yours after all: that’s hardly confrontational.

NewHere77 · 09/01/2024 20:52

The wooden fence is on the boundary between my next door neighbour and next door but one. Mine and neighbours current boundary is the metal wire fence.

When the boundary is rectified the wooden fence will never be in our boundary as the line goes up diagonally and meets the corner of the wooden fence and the dry stone wall at the back.

Hope this makes sense.

OP posts:
dawngreen · 08/01/2024 21:38

Do you own the land up to the large trees across the field past the 2 fences? You could build rentals on that land if you wanted.

PeachyPeachTrees · 08/01/2024 20:21

Wow! That extra triangle of land would make a massive difference to NDN garden. Personally, I would only sell if I needed the money and only for what it's really worth.

forcedfun · 08/01/2024 13:10

Flowersbutpain · 08/01/2024 11:56

No legal action is simple. In most cases the only winners are the lawyers.

Totally agree. (And I am a lawyer).

Flowersbutpain · 08/01/2024 11:56

25yearstilretirement · 08/01/2024 10:18

You can prosecute her for trespass if she wont move. Simple

No legal action is simple. In most cases the only winners are the lawyers.

25yearstilretirement · 08/01/2024 10:18

You can prosecute her for trespass if she wont move. Simple

Pr1mr0se · 08/01/2024 09:24

If your fence is not around the land in dispute then legally she may be able to claim it without paying you anything. Get a fence around the land promptly.

Nanaof1 · 08/01/2024 09:21

NewHere77 · 07/01/2024 23:10

The fence in the pic doesn’t represent legal boundary yet. It’s from what we thought the boundary was when we first moved in.

I still think that where your boundary should be makes your garden more rectangle and improves the ability to enjoy the view. I wouldn't sell it. I also find it hard to believe that anyone would really think their land would branch out like that without knowing they were encroaching.

CrazyLadie · 08/01/2024 08:36

There is a fence in the background behind the chicken wire and buahes, is that not your boundary line?

gottogonow · 08/01/2024 08:12

Sounds like a tricky situation but you can depersonalise it by saying that the correct legal position must be established & followed for future sale of both properties. It is possible to do a land swap whereby you would exchange this land for another section of garden that works for you. This would need to be okayed by both mortgage companies and handled by a solicitor so takes time. The value of your property is based on land registry documents so don’t be pressured into rushing a decision for the sake of their sale. If it falls through, so be it. Otherwise you could go straight into a dispute with somebody new. You need it corrected in order to sell your property, but this can be sorted & you are not looking to move yet. A surveyor can check & advise both parties (to neutralise things), and mark out the correct boundary. No concessions to the neighbours, it needs to match land registry.

belgiumchocolates · 08/01/2024 08:04

Excellent update OP, good luck with getting it sorted and keep us updated

DeeLusional · 08/01/2024 07:47

RosaCaramella · 07/01/2024 23:03

Re your second point, people didn’t used to be so money-grabbing and were often friends with their neighbours. So it is perfectly feasible that one neighbour could have given over a tiny part of their garden to a neighbour for any number of reasons. Costs of signing over and changing title deeds would most likely have prohibited a lot of folks from doing so officially causing problems further down the line as seen in OP’s case.

For those who say how could you not know the title deed plot boundaries, I have never been sent such details when purchasing a house, although I haven’t purchased for 17 years. Maybe it’s more common now but it certainly wasn’t in the past where I live in Scotland.

I hope things can be resolved with minimal stress to all concerned. I just wonder how people here would feel if they suddenly discovered that part of their property / curtilage didn’t actually belong to them and a neighbour was asking for £xxx for the privilege. Tough luck eh?

UK - It's not an automatic legal right, the claimant has to go to court for a judgement which they may or may win., and amazingly, you can try this where there is actually a legal owner

Mirabai · 07/01/2024 23:57

NewHere77 · 07/01/2024 23:10

The fence in the pic doesn’t represent legal boundary yet. It’s from what we thought the boundary was when we first moved in.

It’s not a very old fence if it’s the one in the wrong place.

Poodleydoodley · 07/01/2024 23:55

NewHere77 · 06/01/2024 21:11

Hi,

Thank you for all your messages so far. It really helps to get your advice and input!

I’ve attached a photo of the boundary. The green is ours and what the boundary should look like in reality. The yellow line indicates the triangle of land that is currently in neighbours garden.

In my previous message I meant that the land is about one third of her garden, not including house etc.

To answer a question about how we didn’t notice when we bought the property.. we are first time buyers and I think we just assumed boundaries were correct. Also there is also thick bramble and nettles at the top of the garden and hard to get a proper look over boundary. Lesson learnt if we ever move!!

By the neighbours pricing of land they’re valuing your entire garden at about £1500!!! Absolute jokers! See if they want to sell their garden to you at that price!

Angrymum22 · 07/01/2024 23:45

Both OP and her neighbour have not checked the boundary correctly when they bought their respective properties. The fence on that side of your boundary is OPs responsibility, at some point it has been moved from its original position. It looks fairly new so I’m presuming that the op had it replaced recently It may have been a simple error by the contractor who has just straightened it out. If the op had no idea of the actual boundary it would be easy to instruct the contractor. It doesn’t mean they have “gifted” that part to the neighbour.
I think your best course of action is to contact your mortgage lender first thing tomorrow, explain the situation and ask if you are allowed to sell the land. If not then it’s an easy course of action.
I would also pay £3-6 to download your neighbours land registry documents to see what they agreed to. If there are discrepancies then it will be obvious.
Fences do not legally demarcate your boundary they are just to secure your garden. I know plenty of people who have large gardens rurally that don’t fence to their boundaries, if you have a badgers set in that part of the garden the badgers will demolish a fence overnight. So where you put the fence is irrelevant.

PenelopeChicken · 07/01/2024 23:42

We were in a very similar position when we bought our house (although I was aware that the land was ours but had been fenced off by the developers). Check if your home insurance policy has legal cover. Ours did and we used it to claim our land back. No surveyors were required in our case. Good luck

Boomboomshakeshaketheroom · 07/01/2024 23:28

OP you need to get a fence or some sort of boundary marker up. That will stop an adverse possession claim in its tracks. She could be going to her lawyers tomorrow too to start a claim - and then whether it's successful or not, you're stuck in expensive legal hell for god knows how long.

ETA: and start using the disputed land. Pop a table and chairs there or something.

RosaCaramella · 07/01/2024 23:24

@porridgeisbae

The neighbour is being money-grabbing as she's trying to get cash from something that isn't hers.—

Well we can only speculate on their outlook but I suspect the couple just want to sell quickly to end their joint financial affairs since they are splitting up. I expect that finding out there is a question mark over ownership of part of the garden is a the last thing they need. They likely bought the property thinking what they saw was what they were buying as did the OP. Next door should be going back to their purchasing solicitor to ask how this has come about and what can be done to rectify it. Sounds like it could take some time so they may just allow the overgrown bit of ground to go back to OP.

porridgeisbae · 07/01/2024 23:19

Best wishes with sorting it out OP. It sounds like you've got a bonus bit :)

NewHere77 · 07/01/2024 23:10

The fence in the pic doesn’t represent legal boundary yet. It’s from what we thought the boundary was when we first moved in.

OP posts:
porridgeisbae · 07/01/2024 23:08

Re your second point, people didn’t used to be so money-grabbing and were often friends with their neighbours. So it is perfectly feasible that one neighbour could have given over a tiny part of their garden to a neighbour for any number of reasons.

I don't think they would've planned it to be a permanent thing, unless they were absolutely minted.

The neighbour is being money-grabbing as she's trying to get cash from something that isn't hers.

Mirabai · 07/01/2024 23:08

Is the fence on the legal boundary or is that where it has been put?