Why are nursery fees not included in child maintenance?

That’s not a ‘fact’ that can’t be changed. The more people that become aware, the more vocal people and campaigning groups become, the great chance that the rules can change. Politics innit.

They are in my location outside of the uk. It’s the largest child related expense. It is also linked to custodial days and very often the NRP tries to have all their time on non-working days.

Absolutely insane not to include child care in maintenance calculations.

Indeed, what a fucking outdated cunt.

Sorry? Firstly there's no tax relief for children and secondly, why exactly should the "man" (presumably regardless of whether he is the RP, the NRP, 50/50 care, whether he contributes fairly or whether he shirks responsibility of earning and paying for his children) be stripped of his tax allowance? And the "mum" (again presumably regardless of whether she is the RP, the NRP, 50/50 care or whether she contributes fairly or shirks responsibility of earning and paying for her children) be handed it? And even if they were- it's tax on £12k pa, so the 20% tax free on £12K passed over would only amount to 2400 a year anyway and wouldn't make a dent in nursery fees and would be significantly less than many NRPs pay under CMS.

If we had a system that gave additional tax relief for children, then yes, of course the tax relief relating to the child should be split in the proportion of the child's residence. So a fully RP could get 100% of tax relief relating to the children, 50/50 would be split equally, fully non resident would get £0. But we don't so it's a moot point.

I actually fully support fully funded childcare, with the expectation that BOTH parents go back to work full time from when their child is one, and BOTH parents financially contribute, in proportion to their earnings, to the upbringing of their children. Yes, there are far too many feckless NRPs who don't pay their way. Equally, there are plenty of RP who see their children as a meal ticket and think that having a child absolves them of the responsibility of working and supporting themselves and their child.

I think we should replace the whole messy system with different tax rates. When a couple splits the mum should get a personal allowance increased by the personal allowance of all the children too. The man should lose his personal allowance. No avoiding it and mums will get much more money in our pockets.

The opposite is true though.
Maintenance is based on your salary / childcare ratio. Of you were together, what money you spend on the child would be relative to what you earn.
If DH and I break up, I'm working full time on 60k and he was on 20k but childcare came out of shared accounts, making him pay 50% may literally mean him not having the money to pay. So now he's in jail for not paying / living on the floor or his mates shed.

How's that helpful?

Whereas on his salary he'd be more mindful of using family or a cheaper nursery etc.

But he can't because the Moon doesn't want to use a cheaper nursery further away or the ex mil she detests.

What about a RP who's a SAHP but wants the child in full time nursery now whereas it was unaffordable before?

It should be a consideration and more men should have half custody so they're genuinely responsible and obliged to sort childcare

Should be 50/50 than not an issue but this wouldn't suit the rp as not entitled to maintenance.

Read the post by @Goldbar

My exh doesn't know the names of our kids' teachers or friends. I'm not even sure he even knows what school year they're in. He won't keep any toys or clothes at his place despite me buying them. For the last parents evening, I organised the time slots that he wanted then he didn't show up. You think he would agree to 50/50? He struggles with EOW!

Said it before,I'll say it again:

Childcare needs to be subsidized

From birth

Like sane countries, Norway, Canada etc

Any financial consent order can be overridden by a CMS decision.

Do you really think that the real question is why shouldn't tax payers fund free childcare for all so that feckless fathers don't have to pay reasonable costs towards their children?

Absolutely! Why should men get away with leaving their families with so few consequences? You can bet the ones that pay the bare minimum are also the ones that move on to another woman, have another family and then fuck off again!

Could you point me in the direction of this info? Not trying to challenge you as a whole heartedly agree but it would be useful to have some info to back this up in the future if needed.

Do you rent or have a mortgage? If you rent, you might be eligible for UC. If you have a mortgage, you might still get about £10 per month, which probably wouldn't be worth claiming.

Really curious to know what you put in. How many kids? What salary? What childcare costs? Sounds pretty implausible as its currently capped at £1,630.15 a month for two or more children but would be good to see your figures.

The real question should be why doesn't the government want to invest in childcare by making it free/very affordable so that most single parents can afford to work and have careers like the absent parent can. Why do they want so many children to grow up in poverty continuing the cycle of deprivation?

Children are for their parents to pay for, not taxpayers. The assumption that taxpayers must pick up the deficit, for the good of the country, as mentioned above, is exactly why NRP’s can get away with not paying.

I agree the NRP should be made to pay, but on the proviso the RP is working.

Were you married OP?

I just thought that it was during the financial settlement part of the divorce where we got to negotiate costs on top of maintenance?

I can see it is a sensitive topic for you so won't say anything else, but not everyone is out there to get you, and at no point did I call you work shy or tried to make a dig. It is just that the reality of having to pay 1-2K for childcare is quite unfamiliar to many people, even mothers, unless one has actually been in the situation.

If it helps I paid in 2006 - 500 gbp for three full days of nursery for my baby boy. I worked and paid it myself. It included pampers so was quite good. I dread to think what it would cost today.

Resident parents aren't men.

It’s just the way it is and is in some ways illogical.
the maintenance requirement bears no relation to the actual cost of caring for the child, it’s all about the non resident parent’s income and a fixed percentage of that.
Then on top of that he could have another child and have to pay less.
I see the point that if they don’t have it they can’t pay it but there is an argument for it to be more related to actual costs.

I don’t think it’s fair but I don’t know what the answer is.

😂😂 yeah nice try. I don’t have child care cost because my daughters disability is too complex to attend child care.
and has been out of school for 18 months as no school can meet needs so I care for her 24/7 and receive £7 in maintenance and can’t work because of her complex needs. But you tried to make out I was work shy. Nice one. Even if this wasn’t the case I would agree that nursery fees aren’t part of child maintenance but nice little dig you tried there! 🍀 the ops child CAN attend child care isn’t it. I can’t even go to the shops with my child 🍀

Err... I did not make an assumption or judged you in any way, just stated the fact? You don't have childcare costs so it is not applicable to you, but if you had, why don't you think the child maintenance should not cover these in a way that it is fair between the parents?

Nice little assumption you’ve made there Im a full time carer for a disabled child so if you had bothered to ask rather than assume you would have known that. I can’t work because my child CANT attend child care 🙂 don’t assume next time when you know nothing my child is severely disabled and gets HRC dla and I care for her 24/7 as she is unable to attend school and I’m a full time carer. Ops child won’t be in nursery forever then she will have £500 a month and no nursery fees. It’s not “what I think” it’s the law, child maintenance is a percentage of income and does not cover nursery fees that’s a fact and not going to change no matter how many times the op posts this.

But from your previous posts it seems like neither you nor the father of the children work, so there is no childcare cost for you? Why, in your opinion, child maintenance does not have to cover childcare?

Now let's live in the real world shall we.

A paying nrp will potentially be losing 20 percent of wage for depending on how many children. Factor in childcare and he will be unable to afford to live as will be entitled to very little.

A RP will be entitled to universal credit, child benefit and maintenance and yet wants more money for childcare.

Should be 50/50 than not an issue but this wouldn't suit the rp as not entitled to maintenance.