To think this “crackdown” on benefit fraud is absolutely pathetic

Thank you @therealcookiemonster

@Crispedia indeed. don't get me started on the government's attitude to supporting individuals who are suffering from lifelong, debilitating impairments

And please don’t forget those - I am one - who can’t work at all even with support.

“Chancellor Jeremy Hunt doesn’t rule out withdrawing benefits from claimants who have been assessed as unable to work due to ill-health”. V worrying.

https://www.itv.com/news/2023-11-16/chancellor-refuses-to-rule-out-withdrawing-benefits-from-long-term-sick

@XenoBitch couldn't agree with you more. I feel like the whole system - from health care to benefits is not designed to enable people or support people to work at all.

Rupert Murdoch is Australian by birth, but now a citizen of the US. So no, you can't expect him to pay tax in the UK. When you own a media empire, you (with advice) choose the most favourable place to be resident for tax. But if you work in the UK, for a UK supermarket, use the NHS and expect state education for your children, and a state pension at 67/68, you don't have many choices.

So, the disabled people you mentioned could work. Good for them. An amputee is not going to be having constant time off of work for medical appointments, or end up in hospital regularly.... neither is the partially sighted person.
Many people with disabilities do want to work, but the workplace is not set up for them, or they come across badly in interviews (such as maybe with someone with autism), or they will just need too much time off of work to manage and recover from their conditions.

There is little help out there to get disabled people back into work. DWP will see someone wanting to work and cut their benefits to the bone and expect nearly 40 hours a week jobhunting, then applying for full time roles.
DWP sees a threat of poverty as a way to get people working. The next budget is going to mention jobseekers having their meagre benefits stopped if they don't find employment within 18 months.... all whilst having any spending watched too. If you have been out of work for over a decade, no qualifications or experience to your name... how are you realistically going to find work in that time? Add a disability to the mix and it makes for a very bleak outlook.

That's obviously not her argument. Shes saying they make a big fuss about benefit fraud and trying to reduce benefit payments, but because they are scum they dont have any plans to crack down on tax evasion.

Is this in reference to hunts latest proposal to cut benefits to people who dont work? I completely agree with you, the tories make me sick, I try to avoid reading things on this topic as it can really chew you up inside.

I also had clients without disabilities who could have worked, but found all sorts of reasons not to.

V hard now to get benefits long term if physically and mentally well. Hard even when unwell!

I have been bedridden now for 10 years with severe ME, even when moderate I was too sick to work.

Disability benefits (DLA/PIP) are paid to people in work, and lots of people with disabilities and life limiting conditions have jobs and careers. Those payments are not means tested. But surely the first group that need to be working are those without disabilities or chronic conditions.

I’ve been retired for some time, but I had lots of colleagues who could have used their disability to claim they couldn’t work. My last boss had MS, I’ve had colleagues with Autism, partially sighted (one brought his guide dog to work), wheelchair users, amputees, people with epilepsy. I also had clients without disabilities who could have worked, but found all sorts of reasons not to. Its not fraud, but is it acceptable? Is it good for children to grow up in an environment where they don’t learn the value of work, or the opportunities it might bring?

I work in welfare rights. We are a tiny team (equivalent to 3.5 FT staff) and one of our KPIs is how much extra money we get for clients by identifying benefits they are entitled to, but not claimed, or benefits being underpaid.

In 22/23, this was over £680,000 - equivalent to nearly £200k for each FT worker. In the 5+ years that I've been in this role, the number of people getting paid more than they should be is vanishingly tiny, and off the top of my head, I can only think of 4 such cases, and none of them had led to overpayments of more than approx £5k. One client had been underpaid so much, for so long, that her arrears payment was in excess of £25k, and 5-figure sums are not unusual.

We routinely do a full benefit check for every client that's referred to us, which is how we identify over- and underpayments. If our experience is in any way indicative of the overall picture, the level of underpayments nationally must be massive. And it's no surprise that the introduction of the Welfare Reform Act, which made it harder to get benefits, also coincided with the end of Legal Services Commission funding for welfare rights work.

@AutumnCrow just read your link. That is absolutely terrible and I fear there are going to be more of these tragic cases if these "attacks" on the sick and disabled go ahead.

The Guardian at least are publicising this.

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2023/nov/18/minister-warned-about-mental-pressure-of-benefits-system-after-applicant-kills-himself

@XenoBitch yes, I pray these changes punishing the sick and disabled don't go ahead. That's terrible if they want to check your friend's bank account, just how far will this go? It's as if they think people on benefits are second class citizens who don't deserve the same privacy as people not on benefits.

We can only hope that there is some work going on behind the scenes by welfare/mental health charities about this.

I have a friend whose son has been experiencing mental health issues. His benefit money goes into her bank account. Will her account be checked too? Even though she is not on benefits herself.

@CherryMyBrandy, thank you. I receive PIP and ESA, nightmare process. Before that I was on DLA and Incapacity Benefit. Remember Cameron’s 2011 Welfare Reform Act which tightened criteria for new PIP (that replaced DLA) and the new ESA (that replaced Incapacity Benefit) creating 2 groups (admittedly ESA began under Labour) which the Tories in 2017 cruelly then voted to reduce payment for one of the 2 groups. Now sounds like they are looking to tighten the screw further, so depressing. Following trajectory of US of offering threadbare state support for the sick and disabled.

My dh has psychosis amongst a whole load of other mental health issues. Last time he had an attack, just before he got hospitalised, he was running around half dressed telling everyone the government was monitoring him all the time and he was going to be sent to prison (even though he hadn't done anything wrong). This checking of bank accounts, if it happens, is really going to send him over the edge again!

Right. I've found a few newspaper articles all saying exactly (as in word for word) the same thing. So basically just one article disseminated over a few outlets.

Nothing else. Unless I'm just looking in the wrong place. 🤷‍♀️

I guess I'll wait for the Budget

I've only found this on newspaper sites. I think there's some scaremongering going on. I'll believe it if / when it's announced.

I can't find much about this online.

Do we know when/if this is actually going ahead? All I can see is that it will be mentioned in the Autumn budget.

Don’t have specific links, sorry. The info has appeared in various public consultations on welfare reform, and more recently, those for the white paper published this year entitled ‘transforming support’. A number of changes to disability benefits were announced in this, including a new UC ‘health payment’ which can be claimed by PIP claimants.

Love a bit of TP 😁

Sam Vines boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness is one of the best economic theories ever written IMHO.

Absolutely this.

Terry Pratchett — 'The news that they have nothing to fear is guaranteed to strike fear into the hearts of innocents everywhere.'

TP knew the score.