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AIBU?

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Relative burned through funds and now mooching

660 replies

coldcallerbaiter · 04/11/2023 22:41

AIBU to get involved? I have not said too much to him yet

So my cousin lost his parents in his 20s and got easily a million pounds in those days. He is around 60 now. Never had a job, playboy lifestyle in the Far East, womanising, divorces, no kids. Now he is back in the UK and has nowhere to go. Will not admit he is skint but then hints to live with my elderly mum in her spare room. He is not entitled to benefits as he never lived here and did not pay in or get credits. I do not know if he will even get a state pension later on. I think he should get a job and pay his rent somewhere but I doubt he will as working is beneath him, especially as it would be unskilled stuff, he wants to mooch off her. He has expensive tastes too and is in and out at night probably to bars. My mum is now phoning me worried in case he will not leave, also her quiet life is being disturbed

They are actually close as she was like a mother to him before he left to go abroad and were in touch all the years with visits.

OP posts:
coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 19:20

pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 17:59

He could hurt her.

It’s possible. He wouldn’t get away with it, he knows that much. It is unlikely knowing him though, I know he cares for her. He is like someone drowning so is doing/saying desperate things. Anyone can hurt anyone else though in reality. Even paid carers can assault. If he got a job, I would be much more in favour of him.

OP posts:
pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 17:59

He could hurt her.

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:51

binkie163 · 08/12/2024 17:47

Be prepared that when the time comes you may need to fight him in court to remove him and his belongings from the house.

I will go in and boot him out. There are more of us than there are of him. That’s not a problem. 2 sons and a husband. In fact my dd and I could probably handle the pipsqueak.

OP posts:
coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:49

pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 17:43

This is absurd of course the door can be rekeyed. Contact a security company—they rebuilt Notre Dame using 11th century technology so I think despite the absurd awe you have for your father that you can find another security expert who can make a new lock.

It is dm not me that wouldn’t change the door, so the point is moot.

mooch would just steal the new key,

I am not being obtuse, just stating facts, that it is her house and she isn’t senile.

It is just a rant and discussion. I can only do a limited amount. The big guns come out at the point he tries to move in or establishes residency.

OP posts:
binkie163 · 08/12/2024 17:47

Be prepared that when the time comes you may need to fight him in court to remove him and his belongings from the house.

pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 17:43

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 16:52

No what I mean is I think it needs a new door, the way to copy the master key has been lost idk and dm doesn’t either. It was a bespoke door, v v secure as long as you don’t have the key. And she won’t want a new door as this one is a special really nice one my dad installed and it has an antique front.
I replace the door to the same standard for 1000s and he’ll just steal the next key anyway.

This is absurd of course the door can be rekeyed. Contact a security company—they rebuilt Notre Dame using 11th century technology so I think despite the absurd awe you have for your father that you can find another security expert who can make a new lock.

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:37

Afaik if she died with him there on a visit, his things there do not constitute residency. No bills are arriving there for him etc. I doubt he can intercept letters if he is not there 75% if the time. Her shopping bills are higher when he is there plus she withdraws cash to give him.

Agree he must have funds so cannot claim benefits yet. He says he cannot ever claim them apart from a small state pension eventually as he was absent from UK and never really got NI or NI credits.

He sold a tiny property a few years ago, I think he sold it assuming he could live with dm. Bizarre assumption, we never agreed to that. He could be living in there now securely, with a little part-time job.
if he even has 30k of it left it is not too late to get a place somewhere cheap.

OP posts:
Vroomfondleswaistcoat · 08/12/2024 17:30

I understand everyone's anger - it's so frustrating to read all the things this dreadful man has done and is doing, but it's YOUR MUM that is the only one that can really do anything - and she doesn't want to. So I think your only recourse is to grey rock your mum, every time she complains about him overstaying or spending her money or whatever, all you can do is tell her that you've told her what to do, but she won't, so she just has to put up with it.

Keep a watching brief, but as your mum has capacity, there really isn't anything you can actully DO about the problem, other than keep an eye on what he's up to. Your mum is just going to thwart any attempts you make to get him out or keep him out, and as she's the one moaning about him she must be getting something out of the relationship.

Legal advice as to how to avoid him setting up home in her house, but I'd guess if she leaves it to you and your siblings you can force him out when she's gone. Anything else - well, she's a grown woman and in charge of her own life.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 08/12/2024 17:30

It sounds as if your options are limited OP unless you find evidence that he's using her home to conduct criminal activity from - that would trigger the cuckooing framework and the police would get involved:

www.devonsafeguardingadultspartnership.org.uk/exploitation/cuckooing/

Or actively stealing from her / financial abuse: https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/topics/blogs/close-to-home-spotting-elder-abuse

In the absence of evidence I'd be making an inventory of her valuables (photographing etc) and checking at regular intervals that they're still there. It might be helpful if he knows this has happened as a preventive measure.

An elderly black man looks out of a window in a nursing home.

Close to home: spotting elder abuse

Richard Roberts details the warning signs of financial abuse of the elderly, what practitioners should look out for, and the steps they can take.

https://www.lawsociety.org.uk/topics/blogs/close-to-home-spotting-elder-abuse

Ooral · 08/12/2024 17:29

coldcallerbaiter · 07/12/2024 22:35

Sorry for the late reply I did not see the comments and did not think anyone would remember this one!

I predicted he would be back. It was obvious.

He announced he will spend 3 WEEKS at Christmas with her. I have calculated he has spent 3 months with her in bits through this last year. When I say anything she agrees with me, but nothing changes, so my boundary now is just preventing him from a permanent move in. I have told her I will physically remove him if it happens, which she agreed to.
If she gets dementia then god help me. Part of me thinks she complains but does not mind him visiting. I wouldn’t mind if it was a bit shorter. Like 1 week max.

I got POA.

He cannot fit the stuff he owns in his HMO. The stuff that is not in the garage is in her spare room as it is ‘ too valuable’. They are worth a couple of 1000 at most and only if bought by the right collectors, hardly the Crown Jewels but the boxes take up room, and irritate me.

He is not claiming benefits according to him he is not eligible, so if he is skint, how does he pay £500pm rent?

Edited

If he isn't eligible for benefits, that would suggest a bank balance of £16k+ - I would wonder if he is just too proud / above all of that sort of thing mind you. (In his own head)
I hope this freeloader gets his comeuppance.

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:22

Mirabai · 08/12/2024 17:17

I’m sure she does - does she have any training?

Not sure, she is an early retired teacher. She does some freelance wfh I think too.

OP posts:
OlderGlaswegianLivingInDevon · 08/12/2024 17:21

Get him out !

as for where he can live, there is an old thread on MN where a middle aged man was about to lose his private rental, long story short he is now very happy in his social housing flat, for the over 55's. somewhere in Bristol I believe.
Apparently there are parts of the UK where the over 55's flats/bungalows etc. can be found without too much difficulty esp as your Uncle will actually be homeless once he moves out of Mum's home.

and yes he may be able to claim benefits and that would help pay the low(er) rent if social housing.

If I knew how I would search for the thread but don't know where to start. Yes the difference is that this man was working ( in prob a min wage job ) however your uncle will be expected to look for / find work in order to receive benefits ?

binkie163 · 08/12/2024 17:18

There isn't anything the op can do because her mother is perfectly happy with the moocher mooching off her. She knows op unhappy about it but is allowing this scrounger full access to her house and unlimited pocket money. I suspect mother likes the attention, drama and moaning about it. This is your mum's fault for encouraging him, I suspect if you had a frank conversation with him he will say your mum has made promises, no point tip toeing around her or him, they are both happy with the status quo. Find out exactly where you stand and act accordingly.

Mirabai · 08/12/2024 17:17

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:08

Neighbour will be paid, she wants to.

I’m sure she does - does she have any training?

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:12

Dm knows she he took the key, she is the one that told me. I hit the roof and she just shrugged it off.

OP posts:
coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 17:08

Mirabai · 08/12/2024 13:57

paying cleaner (wonderful woman) and neighbour to go over 2 twice a day when the time comes.

It’s not reasonable to ask a neighbour to go over twice a day and make her responsible for your mum. If DM needs that it’s time to start paying for care.

Neighbour will be paid, she wants to.

OP posts:
Mirabai · 08/12/2024 16:58

Surely a bespoke door has a lock?

coldcallerbaiter · 08/12/2024 16:52

No what I mean is I think it needs a new door, the way to copy the master key has been lost idk and dm doesn’t either. It was a bespoke door, v v secure as long as you don’t have the key. And she won’t want a new door as this one is a special really nice one my dad installed and it has an antique front.
I replace the door to the same standard for 1000s and he’ll just steal the next key anyway.

OP posts:
CarpeVitam · 08/12/2024 16:28

pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 15:49

I have read all the OP’s posts and I am probably repeating everyone else here but your hair should be on fucking fire at this point.

You can not control this man and you absolutely do not seem to be able to predict and counter the danger he poses to your mother. As everyone has said you are very naive—in the sense that you don’t grasp how dangerous this predatory man could get. Stop thinking of him as “the mooch h” or the loser/lost boy. He is a grown man with a seedy history of use and abuse. He is proud, greedy, and shamelessly manipulative. He is potentially very, very, dangerous to your mother. Don’t be under any illusions that he can’t or won’t hurt her to gain control of her and the house.

Change the lock. Offer to move all his stuff to storage and then do it. Tell him outright that you are contacting elder services and putting then on notice that you believe he is scamming your elderly mother—which he is!

The safest thing to do is push him far, far away from your mother. Use rage, humiliation, or outright threats but do it fast. Because this man is like water. He will keep creeping into your mother’s life and rotting it from the indife. He must be stopped.

Edited

This!

CarpeVitam · 08/12/2024 16:27

OP, you really need to report the missing key. It's obvious he's playing the 'long game' and isn't going to give up easily.

TonTonMacoute · 08/12/2024 16:07

The local council adult services should have a safeguarding department. They may be able to help with advice.

I'm so sorry OP, it must be so stressful dealing with such a parasite. Your DM is her own worst enemy here, it's hard to help people who won't be helped.

I would focussing on getting his stuff out for a start. I might also think about consulting a solicitor to draw up some clear legal agreement. Do you think your DM would go for that?

pikkumyy77 · 08/12/2024 15:49

I have read all the OP’s posts and I am probably repeating everyone else here but your hair should be on fucking fire at this point.

You can not control this man and you absolutely do not seem to be able to predict and counter the danger he poses to your mother. As everyone has said you are very naive—in the sense that you don’t grasp how dangerous this predatory man could get. Stop thinking of him as “the mooch h” or the loser/lost boy. He is a grown man with a seedy history of use and abuse. He is proud, greedy, and shamelessly manipulative. He is potentially very, very, dangerous to your mother. Don’t be under any illusions that he can’t or won’t hurt her to gain control of her and the house.

Change the lock. Offer to move all his stuff to storage and then do it. Tell him outright that you are contacting elder services and putting then on notice that you believe he is scamming your elderly mother—which he is!

The safest thing to do is push him far, far away from your mother. Use rage, humiliation, or outright threats but do it fast. Because this man is like water. He will keep creeping into your mother’s life and rotting it from the indife. He must be stopped.

Doubledodecahedron · 08/12/2024 15:47

Yeah, I'd get the locks changed (sounds expensive I know, but worth it I think) regardless of whether he has it or not. It's a security risk either way and the perfect excuse to have security cameras installed as well.

LookItsMeAgain · 08/12/2024 15:44

At this stage, could you set up some cameras inside the home so you could monitor his behaviour and tell neither of them that you're doing this (like a nanny-cam set up) because you're not sure he's not actually taking liberties and getting his feet well and truly under the table.

Would your mother kick him out if she was presented with evidence (rather than speculation) that he has a key that he shouldn't have? If he has his own belongings still in the garage, I'd start there by saying as your mother is getting older, you need to keep the clutter to an absolute minimum so if he is storing stuff in her house, he needs to start using a storage unit and you will be checking on the progress of him getting his stuff out of the house/garage the next time you're there.

Your mum thinks that she is being kind to him but she really isn't. He might as well have a disguise on and be taking part in a highway robbery because he's no better than Dick Turpin!

I like the suggestion that as the 'spare' key can't be found, that you will have to get another replacement lock and you will take charge of the new 'spare' key so that it can't go "missing". If it's one of the coded keys (so they are much more expensive to copy than a Yale key for example) might it be possible to request notification if copies are requested from the few locksmiths that are permitted to copy them?

binkie163 · 08/12/2024 15:40

I hope you have notified the insurance company that the spare master key is missing.
Honestly I would step back and let them get on with it, she chooses to have him stay. I understand you are looking out for your mum but it is becoming a him or you situation, she has chosen him. I think she is being very disingenuous, there is nothing you can do about it. He knows you are not going to move in to be your mum's carer/companion. This will eat away at you.