AIBU to believe FIL time slip experience?

It's impossible to be a sceptic for the paranormal, time slips, multiverses etc because none of those things are accepted opinions within most cultures and have zero evidence behind them. It would be like saying 'you're a sceptic about unicorns'. There's no such thing. They don't exist. Even if some people claim they do.

Yes, yes. We know how much more scientific you are than people who’ve had a strange experience. I’m simply trying to illustrate how the Mandela effect is not the principle at play here.

@Yellowishstone

Most of them didn't, but they create this narrative based on the present which they project onto the past. They only 'remembered' they'd had a bad feeling about them when they were arrested and/or convicted.

But this is the bit missing from the stories on this thread! No one has said “Oh, you remember that time you got lost on the way back from the campsite/other weird incident on this thread” causing the person to reinterpret the incident! The Mandela effect is sparked by a collective prompt (eg the actual death of Mandela, or the arrest of the serial killer). There simply is no such prompt in these cases. The only reason they are cited is because of their original weirdness. That’s why they’re not like the Mandela effect.

But we don't know it really stuck with them at the time though?

They're retrospectively saying it did. Everyone here is retrospectively saying they felt it was weird at the time. But we don't know what they thought or said at the time because they didn't post about it. Their memories or opinions are clouded by time and other information.

Like all the people that met or knew someone who later gets arrested for violent and/or sexual offences and comes out of the woodwork to say "I always had a bad feeling about them".

Most of them didn't, but they create this narrative based on the present which they project onto the past. They only 'remembered' they'd had a bad feeling about them when they were arrested and/or convicted.

And aaaaaalll the people who apparently have a memory of encountering a serial killer, but only after (years often) that serial killer has been put in prison and/or died. I've personally had about 20 people tell me that Fred West either tried to pick them up or actually gave them a lift home. And there are hundreds if not 1000s who claim that on social media. Mention Fred West anywhere on the Internet and those tales with happen. A very witty MNetter in response to yet another MN poster who said Fred West gave them a lift home commented "you'd think he was a bus driver, not a builder given the amount of people he was allegedly driving around".

The whole Mandela effect idea was that when he was realesed from prison, there was a huge amount of publicity around it. Which doesn't normally occur for people being released from prison but does occur when people die.

So when he did die, lots of people remembered that coverage, hadn't paid a massive amount of attention to it at the time, or the repeated coverage they saw as adults when they'd been kids, and thought "wait, didn't he die and there was a whole thing about it in the media"

And lot's of people think that someone that gave them a lift or looked at them funny 30/40 years ago was Fred West.

And lots of people who had a very mildly confusing experience years ago think that it was a time slip and not just something really explainable related to real life and neurology.

I don't think that humans on earth know everything or that things outside of our current paradigm of thinking can't happen but the proposed 'evidence' of the paranormal, multiverses, time slips, clairvoyance, tarot etc is so weak and so obviously driven by people who want it to be true, who are often making money from it, that it can't be taken seriously by most people.

P.S. I'm not a sceptic. A sceptic is someone disinclined to agree with accepted opinions. So that would be someone denying the reality of covid for instance, which is backed up by clinical research, global deaths, the WHO etc.

It's impossible to be a sceptic for the paranormal, time slips, multiverses etc because none of those things are accepted opinions within most cultures and have zero evidence behind them. It would be like saying 'you're a sceptic about unicorns'. There's no such thing. They don't exist. Even if some people claim they do.

It’s a completely different principle!

The Mandela effect is about retrospectively coming up with a narrative. By definition, the Mandela effect can only occur when inaccurately recalling a past event.

By contrast, the events people are describing are, by and large, things that struck them as strange at the time - that’s why they’ve remembered them!

For example, with the weird ‘losing the campsite story’, the PP remembers it because it seemed so extraordinary. (That’s not to say there isn’t a rational explanation of what happened at the time.) If it were an example of the Mandela effect, it would, what, be more a case of people random getting lost, not thinking it was anything strange and then randomly deciding to pick that non-memory from years ago to reconstruct as a time slip experience?! Doesn’t make any sense!

The whole point about the Mandela effect is that the initial thing (eg Mandela’s first “death”, the change of crisp packets) didn’t happen at all, not that people have misremembered details of the event.

Even if you’re a total sceptic, please tell me you can see how the experiences on this thread are a completely separate phenomenon from the Mandela effect!

But they're all (the ones I've read, i admittedly haven't read every post) reporting things that happened years ago and relating a narrative that at that time they thought it was extraordinary. When we have no idea that was true.

As years have elapsed for false memories and narratives to have occurred. Which would have been influenced by other people, other events, other 'research' that they conducted online, things they saw on TV etc.

So the same principle applies.

‘A glitch in matrix’ rather than a time slip?

I think we all know about the Mandela effect and the crisp colours etc.

What’s being discussed on this thread is things that seem extraordinary when they happen, so a different phenomenon altogether.

It's generally boring misremembering then constructing a narrative around that, then people come up with wild theories to explain simple misremembering and the brain (or the individual) making things up.

It's like with the 'Mandela effect' where people claimed they specifically remembered Nelson Mandela dying years before he did, when what they remembered was the extensive coverage of his release from prison. Then that was extended to many other accounts of misremembering which where then attributed to time slips or glitches in the matrix or whatever nonsense.

My favourite is in the UK, the idea that Walkers crisps swapped the colours for cheese and onion and salt and vinegar.

Which never happened. Walkers even put out a statement saying their C and O had always been blue, and S and V always green. Which led to lots of bizarre conspiracy theories about why Walkers were lying. I mean, why would they?

There have been several threads about it on MN and hundreds elsewhere with people railing about how they very specifically remember when Walkers swapped the colours.

The problem being that not only did it never happen, all the very specific memories people had of it happening span decades. Some people relate really detailed 'memories' of it happening in the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s and early 2000s.

So even if Walkers were for some bizarre reason, lying, it still couldn't possibly correlate with all those people's 'memories' and narratives.

What actually happened was Golden Wonder always had blue packets for S and V and Green for C and O. Walkers the opposite. Golden Wonder was the most popular brand for years so people identified with the colour scheme. You picked up a packet of blue crisps knowing it was S and V.

When Walkers started taking over as brand leader, people started picking up blue crisps not paying attention to the brand and got Walkers C and O.

Which led to the idea that all crisp makers had had blue meaning S and V so Walkers had swapped the colours.

The rest of all the conspiracy theories were all the people 'specifically remembering' when Walkers changed their colour scheme because one day they picked up a blue packet of crisps and were shocked to find it wasn't the flavour they intended to buy.

And the rest of it is just about how susceptible people are to implanted/false ideas and memories.

Like all the people who think they saw the first plane hit the twin towers on 9/11 and think they have specific memories of how shocking and traumatic it was, when the only footage of the 1st plane hitting the twin towers was filmed by 2 French brothers making a documentary about NY firefighters who just happened to film it and it wasn't on TV the day of 9/11 and came out later.

False memories. Susceptibility to implanted memories and then curating a narrative around that. It doesn't mean people are lying, just misremembering and then constructing a story around it.

@SurprisedWithAHorse

whereas when that happens to me, I assume the simplest, most obvious and most likely thing - that I went in the wrong direction.

I think the thing is that this hasn’t happened to you? Quite often on these threads, people say that a certain stand-out experience, unlike anything they’ve experienced before, changes their view. For you to suggest that they’re just misinterpreting ‘mundane’ events that you have all the time is surely missing the point?

I get that you’re a super-sceptic so this is what you do, but at some point even you must believe the evidence of your own senses? So if something really contravenes all normal rules of the universe as you normally experience them every other day of your life, aren’t you going to remark on that, wonder about it, question it? Or is it immediately just funny to you?

There may be some other bizarre explanation, sure, but to just reframe it as normal, funny or ‘mundane’ when it is the single weird, stand-out experience of someone’s life is, frankly, condescending, supercilious and ungracious.

Actually you are.

Now let’s deconstruct your answer.

The OP says that she had done the journey at least once before, you choose to reframe that as “ might have only done this journey once before”. Now while both might be true, it is equally as true that she might have done this several times. - this would indeed be the more likely scenario as the OP then clarifies they had done it several times before. However you choose to reframe that as a change in an attempt to make the OP seem an unreliable witness.

You then appear to try the same tactic of undermining me - “I’ll humour you”. Lol.

So let’s discuss the physics of this, why do you think it’s “nigh on impossible” to experience a time slip? What about the Multiverse? How do you see time?

Your position is vert interesting. You seem extremely certain in an area with no certainty. Why is that? How would it affect you if time slips were proven to exist?

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I mean, don't get me wrong. I'm flattered at the idea that I'm so infallible that unintentional time travel is more likely than the idea that I just make wrong turns sometimes. But I'm not. And with no disrespect to the poster, I don't think she is either.

Honestly, I can't relate at all to the idea that time travel is more likely than me just making a common mistake!

And if we hear the story again, there'll be some further change towards a time slip theory. I can definitely see how over time the story becomes "and the local was wearing weird clothes" or whatever. It's already changed significantly from the original.

I'm not reframing anything. I'm noticing that the poster's story has significantly changed in just two tellings, and the only reason anyone might think it was paranormal is because she's saying it was.

The objective facts are that she was on holiday (so in an unfamiliar area), tried to walk somewhere and ended up somewhere she didn't recognise. She then got directed to the right place by a local.

She is framing this as something that can be explained only as a paranormal time slip experience, whereas when that happens to me, I assume the simplest, most obvious and most likely thing - that I went in the wrong direction.

As the time slip experience is nigh on impossible (actually it is impossible but I'm humouring you), the only reason to suppose it is if you twist the story to it...which we are seeing already as the story has changed significantly on the second telling to try to support the time slip theory.

Ah but now you’re the one reframing the narrative to fit your perspective.

maybe you’ve experienced several time slips but been so desperate to discount them you’ve explained the narrative away within a framework you’re comfortable with

I'm always trying to make it happen when I'm wandering on Bold Street.

Could it have been a vivid dream OP? I occasionally take dreams as fact, until I realise I was dreaming.

Story 1: I might well have done this journey only once.

Story 2: I did this journey several times over a week. And it was impossible to take a wrong turn.

It's actually a pretty significant change, and that's with only two tellings. What's it going to look like on the seventh telling?

Whereas if I told this story - and I've got lost numerous times on "easy" routes - there'd be no suggestion of time slips. It would be a comical story about how I managed to get lost on a route everyone said was too easy to get lost on. Everyone would laugh and nobody would imagine I'd time travelled because I wouldn't frame the story that way.

But I don’t think these statements are any different. The emphasis being yours is probably true in more ways than one.

Which is more likely? Well surely that depends on your perspective- being lost is Only the more likely explanation if you’re sceptical surely?

I mean, the nuances of the story are changing already. In the first post, it was "We were walking back with food shopping, something we'd done at least once before without anything strange happening." Then, on being challenged, it became "We were on the same path we had walked along several times before during our week's holiday." Emphasis mine.

I know both statements can be true, but you're already exaggerating from "at least once" to "several times over a week" to make it seem more impossible that you just made a wrong turn. Next time you tell the story, you'll have definitely done the walk twice a day for a week and were guided by Kenton Cool or something...basically, every time you retell it, you'll have even more reasons why you couldn't possibly have just taken a wrong turn.

Do you really, truly believe that it's more likely that you travelled through time than that you just...made a mistake in an area you didn't really know?

It was clearly not as straightforward a route as you think, because you made a wrong turn and can't even figure out where (clearly it was much earlier than you think it could have been, which makes your sense of direction even less reliable). People who get lost usually don't know how they went wrong. That's why they're lost.

The simplest explanation really is usually the right one, and the simplest explanation here is not that you somehow entered another dimension or travelled in time, but that you got lost in an unfamiliar place. And saw a frog. It's really OK. We all have mundane experiences.

Why was it impossible for you to miss the entrance?

You know how it was @Mondaymorningtoday it doesn't really matter what others think.

No, we weren't in woods. It was a straight path. We were on the same path we had walked along several times before during our week's holiday. If we "missed" the entrance, then that entrance had turned into a dried-up pond.

it was actually impossible for us to miss the entrance.

Clearly it wasn't, because you did. You didn't know the area very well and it was full of trees. It's easier to get lost in woods than in most places! Sounds like you went wrong earlier than you think you did...pretty standard way of getting lost.

I've got an appalling sense of direction. I've missed many things that were apparently impossible to miss. I used to go on a roundabout every day that, from the way the roads were laid out, always felt exactly as though I was going straight back down the road I'd just come off, but I wasn't.

You didn't have a paranormal experience with a time slip. You missed a turning in an unfamiliar area and saw a frog.

Back in the early 90's my now ex and Iwere househunting in East London. We went to see a terrace house. I liked the lounge but the kitchen and dining room were in need of a lot of work. It was your typical brown and beige older stuff and the floor was partially lino and partially horrible carpet tiles. There was a door to the back garden from.the dining room and when I went to open it it scraped on the paving slabs. The back garden was dark, overgrown and very mossy. It was cold and overcast even though it had been sunny when we walked in. The upstairs was fine and modern but when we got out I said how i'd not liked the downstairs rooms.

Ex had seen completely different rooms to me. Not at all the same. And a patio area that was manicured with lights and seating. I couldn't marry my sights with his at all. We even went back to the agents and I looked at the paperwork and photos and it was true- what I had seen was nothing like what was actually there.

Couldn't explain it then, still can't and never had another weird experience yet.

I don’t think you’re the arrogant one tbh!

Well, you are if course entitled to your opinion, but it was actually impossible for us to miss the entrance.

Next to the ornamental pond was a huge sign with the name of the caravan site. (Its name escapes me now, but it was in Brynteg near Bryn Bras Castle.) But this day all we saw was a dried-up pond (no name sign).

Until we turned off to ask the woman directions, it was a straight route along the path and opposite the caravan site were just trees so we can't have been looking in the wrong direction.

When we walked back as the woman advised, the ornamental pond and name sign were there again.

Now whether it was a time slip, some kind of ancient memory, whatever, I have no idea. All I know is something weird happened and I never want to experience anything like it again, it really freaked me out!