Would you move to Cape Town?

If you didn't have kids and it was a temporary thing, I would say go for it, have an adventure just be mindful of the dangers. With a kid I would say definitely not. I lived there for years and still make trips back to see family. Every time I visit it's worse safety wise and quality of life wise.

It's a beautiful, wonderful country, and I think it's still fine to visit as a tourist, but don't move there.

And I bet he doesn't bat an eyelid about it.

Actually I am driving to the Free State this week, just to go and buy some curry spice 😂

I could arrange for it to be couriered, but it's such a nice drive and I love the way he does the mix just right for me. And then while I am there, I will go into the butcher and stock up. And then have a nice drive back again. There is a friendly resident giraffe nearby too, so will say hello to him too.

And who says we never get out.... 😛

Sorry the the people on this thread saying "but London has crime and unsafe parts" are being totally disingenuous comparing safety in London to South Africa.

Really? We stayed in Camps Bay a few years ago, albeit only on a holiday, and it did not seem like this AT ALL. People were out and about in the day time and in the evening. Open faces shops and restuarants, houses without LOADS of security measured. It had a very similar vibe to a European city to me. People were definitely out in the evening, eating, having drinks, walking along the seafront. We also spent some time in Tamboerskloof which was a very similar vibe to a San Francisco suburb. Again lots of cafes, and people out and about, including in the evening. I mean I wouldn't be walking in down time Cape Town at 2am, but it definitely wasn't tasers and behind locked gates by sunset or your are dead.
(and before it is suggested, I have lived in dangerous countries, I am not some clueless tourist wondering around oblivious to all the mortal dangers)

@JayAlfredPrufrock I actually did the "tea spurted out of my mouth" when I laughed at that! It's such a great demonstration of the difference between the two.

@isthismylifenow haha, yes. Like travelling to Somerset West or Stellenbosch... EPIC journeys.

We actually stayed at a wine farm near Somerset West for a few days. DH (who isn't even a native Cape Townian) got himself into a complete state about taking all this time out to travel etc.... I think it took us 35 minutes to get there! To be fair, if you're from Joburg, travelling "out of the city" is more epic so maybe he just hasn't absorbed how small Cape Town is vs Joburg!

My brother commutes from Joburg to Swaziland one day a week.

I was staying in town, and we travelled to my friends parents in Hermanus for the day. In the end they INSISTED we stay over for the night, as we couldn't possibly travel back that far again the same day 😂

Meanwhile, back in JHB I could easily travel that distance to get to work each day ....

@isthismylifenow a friend was here for work a few weeks ago and stayed with us for a night. We had a good laugh as we were talking about when I was growing up, evening activities for kids just wasn't a thing vs here where my kids are regularly at sports etc until quite late.

He was saying it's still the same (to be fair, school starts and finishes earlier too) but ALSO, that part of it is that no one does activities more than 1km from home! So his kids have a "late" football practice once a week that finishes at 18:00.... they're home, eating dinner, by 18:05! .

You don't have to live in one. There are many areas that have regular houses without the gated element.

Omg I laughed so much at this 😂😂

As it is just so accurate.

I lived briefly in Joburg and it was one of the reasons I had to leave .... I couldn't stand the fact that I regularly did 300km on a weekend. I felt like I spent my life driving places. Returning to Cape Town was so fabulous after that as I didn't mind the driving around so had a really diverse life and it was still 100x less driving etc than living in Joburg!

I had a friend who lived just on the corner near there!

@Triffid1 yes the distance thing! Whereas my friends from Johannesburg would happily cover about 150km on a night out popping into a few places.

Yes! Without a thought I would do.

@Myfirstcarwasamini I find that so odd. I had a lovely dinner at the top end of the City, walked up to my friend's car, got an uber home just a few months ago. DH and I were out most nights - visiting friends and family too.

My friends do most likely have personal security devices - haven't actually asked - but they walk or drive as needed. Although, it's Cape Town so you have to also understand that Cape Townians have a very skewed idea of distance and are NOTORIOUS for a) thinking distances the rest of us consider normal are mammoth and b) refusing to walk short distances eg from one side of a high street to the other. This is a cultural reality that has caused friends from other parts of South Africa or other countries much amusement over the years and now that I've lived away from Cape Town for a long time, I love to tease my friends and family about it. (as a test, ask any local how they would feel about travelling from say the City to Claremont for dinner - trust me, they will treat that like you've suggested a drive of 3 hours when it's really just 20 minutes. My Dad still considers driving to my mother in law's house an epic journey... I think it's 15 minutes from where I grew up! Both DH and I, even years later, still marvel at how Cape Town is actually so small that the day after we got engaged we were still able to make the rounds and see pretty much all of our respective families.)

i would debate that anyone "has" to arm themselves with a taser to go out to their local shops in the daytime in that area of CT but i knew certain people that very palpably lived at that level of fear...but everyone has different levels of tolerance and acceptance. for me, being there as a single person was different to to how i would feel now having 2 kids.

Our old neighbours moved from Cape Town, some of the stories they told us were horrendous. We've visited Cape Town on holidays and loved it, but that was 10 years ago. Not in a hurry to go back after talking to the neighbours.

Where near Camps Bay do they live?

As I was there a few weekends back. And we were out, after 6pm i.e. night time, No tazer. I have never had a stun gun nor would I need one to go shopping in the day.

And we had a fabulous time.

We do have to prepare for loadshedding yes, it can be a pita. But it is not going out for 10 hours straight unless there is a cable fault somewhere.

And here is a typical house in a nice area closer to central Cape Town. You can see from the picture that there's an electronic gate and a sign up for a security company but it's not Fort Knox other than that.

And yet my sibling lives in a similar area and walks to the shop as normal and definitely doesn't have a taser.

Gated communities aren't common in the older parts of Cape Town either, it's just freestanding houses although admittedly most people will have a contract with a security company if they can afford it.

This is fairly typical of where some of my relatives live (ignoring that the main house is half built). But you can see that the other houses in the area aren't covered in heavy security measures and it's freestanding houses on public roads, not gated communities.

My sibling lives very near Camps Bay and they have to arm themselves with a taser to go out to their local shopping areas in the daytime. They often spend 10 hours a day without power and are now also experiencing loss of water supply. They live in a luxury home behind gates amidst others in similar properties. They can’t ever go out at night - night being anything after 6pm when it’s still light out. Why would you consider taking your child there?

I worked there years ago pre-kids. And no, I wouldn't. I didn't personally feel safe even back then and that was without the risk of having young children. Obviously, I'm aware that people do live there and raise children there, but it wouldn't be my choice if I had other options. I've lived in several less 'developed' countries than South Africa and I personally would feel more comfortable in those. I'm still not sure I'd take my family to live there either, but it would be more of an option.

My opinion is based solely on how I felt living there. I don't like feeling hypervigilent all the time and I felt like I had to be on edge when there. When I was 25, that was doable. But I'm older and too risk averse now. I like my comfortable, safe life here.

I grew up in Cape Town and still have many friends and family living there. I am not going to lie and say the crime and violence isn't an issue but I will say that for some people this seems worse than for others. Both my parents and my in laws live there. Sil is terrified and will not take her dc there even for a visit. Me and dh and our dc had a lovely few weeks there just a few months ago...

In your situation, I would absolutely go, but I would be negotiating hard on the package. You need to be paid well, and the package needs to take the need to live in safer and more convenient places into account, cars for both you ans your dh, short term accommodation of necessary and, very very important, private medical insurance. Do not agree to go without that!

All the people talking about being cooped up... for a start, Cape Town is not nearly as full of gated communities as other cities. And please bear in mind that my friends' "small" house in a less nice area in a gated community is still the same size as my house in England and has its own swimming pool and a good sized garden.

It's a really lovely city with young children, with lots to do. Nursery and primary school start and finish early so it's pretty common for families to.head to.beach, parks, mountains etc after school or just spend hours at home in the pool.

Your biggest practice considerations are probably that I am embarrassed to admit that Cape Townians ARE cliquey so making friends can be hard. Your best bet will be through work or through any nuesery/school you put your kid into. Or if you are sporty through a sports club. But don't be surprised if it's a but harder than you might expect.

The other issue is that if your dc is 3 and you return when they are 6, they will only just be starting reception in SA, so will be behind. So its worth considering something like a private nursery attached to an actual school that might do at least some reading/writing and/or a tutor from when they are 4 or 5 to introduce them to some of the work they will be missing out on here. As a rule, they do catch up quickly on return to the UK but I have friends who have had dc who did find this hard.

@bladebladebla1 some of the best food I've had in the med too and very reasonable. Adored Wagyu - we went 3 times!!