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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

All old people should sell up family homes for families.

712 replies

benigogo · 27/07/2023 13:13

Not really an AIBU, more a hypothetical question really. This view comes up a lot on MN, and I'm interested in the detail of what people actually imagine when they say it. What type of property should they be giving up? What type of property should they be moving to? How old is old? What about younger people who under occupy a property? For example 2 friend couples, have recently downsized. Both from a 4 bed detached, one to a 4 bed semi, and the other to a 3 bed semi. Their homes were bought, one by a young professional couple, and the other by a couple in their seventies, themselves downsizing. If you hold this view what do you visualise?

OP posts:
User16496743 · 28/07/2023 20:08

My niece bought a small townhouse type house with a friend about five years ago as that was the only way she could afford one

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 20:06

@PurpleButterflyWings

I tried to find some data on this and unfortunately mortgage lenders don't collect data on relationship type. But here are some articles to demonstrate that this is A THING and didn't just happen in the 80s.

https://www.standard.co.uk/homesandproperty/buying-mortgages/buying-a-home-with-friends-london-legal-mortgage-how-to-b1016260.html

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-46895770.amp

If you google 'buying house with friends' you'll see this is indeed not something I invented to make someone on Mumsnet look silly.

RosesAndHellebores · 28/07/2023 19:58

@PurpleButterflyWings quite a lot of young people did as you suggest and bought a flat or house together as friends. I remember it well. About half ended in tears. It was all the rage in the late 80s.

My neighbour is 93. Her five bedroom house and large garden are absolutely perfect and she's as rich as croesus.

Within 10 years a family are welcome to move into our house when DH and I downsize. They will just have to find about £1.8m at todays prices and they can have the keys.

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 19:54

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:07

When I say I know a few young folk who are flat sharing/house sharing. I mean RENTING with other people obvs! NO-ONE is buying anywhere with a 'friend.'

Well I'm assuming you're a good bit older than me and maybe live in a different area so maybe we don't know the same type of people 🤷🏻‍♀️

What can I say? I do know multiple people who bought a flat with their mate in London. It makes loads of sense - neither could afford to buy alone and they would probably be living with them anyway - may as well pay a mortgage than rent. I actually considered doing it with a friend about 10 years ago but decided not to.

It's a thing young people have always done there as far as I know. Really not that outlandish!

And I didn't say I think older people should do this. I certainly wouldn't want to now, let alone in 30 years. But the previous poster thought she had a clever 'gotcha' and she didn't. The fact you think this is made up just makes you sound massively out of touch.

coeurnoir · 28/07/2023 19:49

I get so sick of the ageism and discrimination against both older people and those who don't have children on this site.

I'm 51 (just). I had my kids when I was fairly young by todays standards so this was late 90's. My ex husband and I graduated at the end of a recession and there were few jobs for graduates and we both spent a year or so doing low paid temping and living in a bedsit. By the time we married we had jobs in our field - medical research, but as our contracts were only 3 years and our salaries pitiful, we had to stay in that bedsit. When our first was born we were able to upgrade to a three bedroom flat in a dodgy area. We stayed there for our second child and until we split up a few years later because we still couldn't afford to move.

When my first child was 3 and when I was pregnant with my son, I decided that if we were ever going to buy anything one of us needed a full time permanent job. That was me because research is not family friendly and his career was going well (no mat leaves) so I trained on the job as a teacher on £16k.

When we split up in 2004 I had to move back to live with my parents because I could not afford even the shitty three bed flat anymore on my teachers salary. This wasn't even the South East btw.

I stayed with my parents and I quit that career to work in the NHS as the money was better than a teachers salary. It was also a better place to work but that's a different thread.

It wasn't until I had met my second husband 15 years ago that I was able to finally move into a proper house and get a mortgage. We were 35 and 40. Both professionals, but public sector so 🤷‍♀️.

My children remember how i was always worried about whether I could ever move out of my parents house ans the three,of us have one of our own. We didn't even think about buying then, I'd have been grateful to have afforded to rent that shitty three bed flat again.

My parents weren't able to help us because they had lost their house, that they had worked hard to buy, when the interest rates hit 15% and my father had to give up work because he had a heart attack. My mother worked, but being a middle aged woman who had taken a few years out of the workplace to raise 4 children she couldn't earn enough to cover the mortgage herself. My sister was able to help for a little while, but she was single and could barely afford her own rent. So the house ( a modest three bed terrace) went.

My sister is now married but has no children. Her husband inherited a beautiful large house in the middle of a national park. She is frequently told that she is selfish and that they should sell up, downsize and let a proper family live there. As if a couple aren't a family and don't matter to society. As it is my parents are in the process of moving into an annexe next to my sisters house ans she and her husband will provide care when they get older. It's entirely her and her husbands decision and she has told our parents that they are to use what money they have now to have fun and travel - as they've never been able to.

My children do have it tough now, at 22 and 25. But so did my generation and my parents generation.

For every "boomer" sat in a multi million pound house that they bought for £10, there are millions more older people in poverty. People who never had the opportunity to buy a house. People who scrimped and saved to do so, only to lose it in a recession.

Many of the people on here moaning about boomers will have those huge houses passed onto them. I bet the moaning will stop then.

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:46

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:45

What planet are YOU living on?

Is the sun out there?

I could walk to the next street and take pictures of 2 such houses.

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:45

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:44

I suppose for me I always question these houses that are falling apart because the owners can't afford to maintain them, rattling around in a 4 bedroomed house where they can only afford to heat one room living in poverty and I just think, if you downsized to even 2 bedrooms you could live like a king in comfort and still have £200-300k to play with. Why would you choose the rotten house you cannot afford that's falling to bits?

What planet are YOU living on?

Is the sun out there?

CaroleSinger · 28/07/2023 19:44

I suppose for me I always question these houses that are falling apart because the owners can't afford to maintain them, rattling around in a 4 bedroomed house where they can only afford to heat one room living in poverty and I just think, if you downsized to even 2 bedrooms you could live like a king in comfort and still have £200-300k to play with. Why would you choose the rotten house you cannot afford that's falling to bits?

Daisybuttercup12345 · 28/07/2023 19:27

curaçao · 27/07/2023 13:33

Well there's a continuous stream of people dying and their houses bring sold, so what difference would a continuous stream of (say) 70 year olds sell8ng their homes be?

Life is short. You will get to that age soon enough. Then comment.

AutumnCrow · 28/07/2023 19:19

The last friends I knew who bought together - it was back in the 1980s / 1990s. Different economic world.

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:07

When I say I know a few young folk who are flat sharing/house sharing. I mean RENTING with other people obvs! NO-ONE is buying anywhere with a 'friend.'

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:06

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 17:44

I'm surprised younger people haven't recognised the wisdom of your plan, and clubbed together with friends to buy shared houses.This would have the added bonus of sharing bills so would be cheaper and would also free up homes so less house building would be needed so we'd all have more green spaces.

Loads of young people are already doing this @2bazookas

I know quite a few people who bought a 2 bed flat with a friend because they wouldn't have been able to afford it alone.

I don't know one single 'younger' person who has done this. Yeah a few are flat-sharing/housing sharing because they've got fuck-all choice, as they can't afford to live alone - like everyone else couldn't when they were younger with one wage...

But I know NO-ONE who is buying a home with someone else. Not one person. I am sure some posters will come along and say they know DOZENS of people they know are doing this... 🙄

Funny how no-one mentioned it at ALL, until posters started saying 'OK young people why don't YOU do communal living seeing as you expect 'OLD' people to.' Funny that eh? Hmm

PurpleButterflyWings · 28/07/2023 19:02

OMG12 · 28/07/2023 07:53

Ah I see, so at what age should I move in with my brother and sister in law who I can spend about an hour or two with before they drive me mad? With friends who I love dearly, like going on holiday with for a few days but then need my own space, friends who live their lives with different priorities, different tastes in food, decor etc. maybe I should really get on with people they happen to have picked as friends better!

Why can’t young families do all of these things, live communally. Live with siblings? Parents of their kids friends. The entire year group buy a mansion together and live in it?

You either hate old people or you struggle to think of anyone apart from yourself or most likely both. I despair at times

100% this @OMG12 Why don't YOUNG people (with children,) live communally/live with siblings/live with parents/live with friends etc etc etc?! Or why don't THEY live in a big HMO with a bunch of randoms?

They expect 'older' people to live communally and give up their home (that they've sometimes lived in for 30, 40, or 50 years or more,) and move in with 'family' or general randoms, so why don't THEY do the same? Hmm

Not in my back yard eh? Do as I say, not as I do etc etc etc.....

Chickpea17 · 28/07/2023 18:06

2bazookas

Are we....

Seymour5 · 28/07/2023 17:58

I’m at the stage in life, over 70, where I, and DH, may need to consider a move to more manageable housing in the near future. We own a three bedroomed house, the smallest is really a boxroom, with the only bathroom upstairs. There is nowhere to fit a downstairs loo, and we couldn’t afford it anyway. We wouldn’t get enough for our house to buy a a bungalow. We wouldn’t qualify for a mortgage. But we’d be happy to downsize, to a two bedroomed apartment, and pay reasonable rent.

We don’t have great pensions, we’re not at the level of pension credit but not far above. The capital from our house would provide a better standard of living, and we wouldn’t have the worry of maintaining our home, which is increasingly unaffordable. Our DC don’t live nearby, it would be peace of mind for them. Its also the case that living in the right kind of housing with accessible care (if necessary) means quicker discharge from hospital, and less likelihood of having to move to a much more expensive care home.

Local authorities and other social landlords are building more of these types of accommodation, Independent Living for Older People, Extra Care, Assisted Living etc. For some of us, they could offer the right kind of independence.

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 17:44

I'm surprised younger people haven't recognised the wisdom of your plan, and clubbed together with friends to buy shared houses.This would have the added bonus of sharing bills so would be cheaper and would also free up homes so less house building would be needed so we'd all have more green spaces.

Loads of young people are already doing this @2bazookas

I know quite a few people who bought a 2 bed flat with a friend because they wouldn't have been able to afford it alone.

2bazookas · 28/07/2023 17:41

Chickpea17 · 28/07/2023 16:59

Does that's also mean one child family shouldn't have big family homes?
Only people chosen to have large families get the family homes?

You're all co-sleeping so you only need one bed, one bedroom...

2bazookas · 28/07/2023 17:40

Remotecontrolatmyside · 27/07/2023 20:07

I think more elderly people should live together so they can support each other and give each other company. Life is easier when you have a community. This would have the added bonus of sharing bills so would be cheaper and would also free up homes so less house building would be needed so we'd all have more green spaces.

I'm surprised younger people haven't recognised the wisdom of your plan, and clubbed together with friends to buy shared houses.This would have the added bonus of sharing bills so would be cheaper and would also free up homes so less house building would be needed so we'd all have more green spaces.

AND, they could co-ordinate reproduction and share child care. Instead of expecting their elderly parents to do it.

OMG12 · 28/07/2023 17:26

Remotecontrolatmyside · 28/07/2023 11:44

Oh the irony of saying I only think of myself 😂

Well actually I’m not old, so it was a hypothetical “I” but you’re obviously not that bright do we will let it go

Chickpea17 · 28/07/2023 16:59

Does that's also mean one child family shouldn't have big family homes?
Only people chosen to have large families get the family homes?

gingerguineapig · 28/07/2023 16:07

Some elderly people take in lodgers - if you choose your host/lodger carefully I can see how it works. The lodger gets a decent room for a low price in exchange for a bit of helping out eg doing some light housework or giving lifts to medical appointments.

Also when I think of "elderly" I am thinking of the over 80s! People in their 60s don't need to downsize, they are perfectly healthy and mobile in most cases. Of course you do need to think about things in advance before you get to a difficult situation. Example: SIL currently lives alone in a 3 bed terrace house which needs stuff doing to it - the only advantage of where she lives in good public transport but she could afford to sell up and move to a nicer area which still has good public transport. She's in her early 70s so really does need to be thinking about it (she doesn't drive due to bad eyesight and doesn't have any kids to help her either).

AutumnCrow · 28/07/2023 16:04

MsRosley · 28/07/2023 11:53

'which was nice'

And the whole first class train carriage stood up and clapped.

Wiccan · 28/07/2023 15:58

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 15:55

@Wiccan

It took until you were 20 to save for a deposit? Fuck me, you must have life long trauma from that level of hard graft and sacrifice.

So exactly what is your problem ? You know nothing about my life .

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 15:55

@Wiccan

It took until you were 20 to save for a deposit? Fuck me, you must have life long trauma from that level of hard graft and sacrifice.

Wiccan · 28/07/2023 15:45

wutheringkites · 28/07/2023 15:33

What a second aren't you the poster than said 'The haves used to be the have nots they worked for it'

So by work for it, you mean lived in your parents' house rent free to save a deposit at a much cheaper time to buy?

Again, I don't agree that people should have to sell their houses but you sound woefully out of touch.

FFS I was 16 at the time . Took me 4 years to save enough for a deposit met my hubby when I was 20 . Fuck me we worked our asses off for it . Christ nobody is allowed to be proud of doing ok or achievement on here. Definatly not out of touch . I'm not responsible for other people not having a mortgage . The jealousy is deafening on this thread !