All old people should sell up family homes for families.

Well, fair enough – you described your experience, and I described mine. Nothing to say that they aren't both equally valid. Yes, there are problem families who fight and drink and live like pigs, but there are plenty of people who take a lot of pride in their houses, and are very glad to get somewhere that's not a short-term rental. The one big issue there is with social housing though is the UC/HB/tax credit fraud that goes on – the phantom dad or live-in boyfriend who isn't declared for benefit purposes – that does piss me off, and I know of numerous houses where it goes on.

I find people who spout this shitty mantra... 'people should give up their social housing as soon as they start earning over a certain amount lalala,' are jealous. Jealous of the low rent, and the secure tenancy people have, and how they have all the repairs and maintenance done...., While they are struggling to make ends meet, struggling to pay ever rising mortgage rates, and have to pay for repairs and maintenance and all the structural flaws with their house etc..

OR they are desperate for social housing themselves, and are bitter and angry they can't get it... Hilariously - these people who are demanding others move out of THEIR HOME so they can have it ... (the home that they have always paid rent for, and made their family home and sanctuary for 40-50 years or more,) will never EVER EVER move out themselves.

And what is the point of someone moving out, if, for example, their family income suddenly bumps over £40K??? They have to go private let, or try and get a deposit together for a deposit for a house. Then a year or two down the line, their income drops again, so they are on £30K or less family income.

What then? Are they going to be given a shiny new tenancy on another social housing home? Are they FUCK! They will very likely never get another social housing home!

You would have to have rocks in your head to give up a social housing home willingly, just because others are jealous and bitter that they don't have one!

And in my experience, the people who are allocated social housing, (ergo people on fairly low income, or state benefits, or pensions,) are very VERY unlikely to EVER be on a very high income, in a high flying career, and in a position to pay high private let rents, or BUY a property.

Leave them alone FFS. The young - and the old - AND the ones in the middle.

YOU not being able to get a social housing property, or struggling with your mortgage and house repairs and maintenance are NOT the problem of people sitting pretty in social housing. As has been said before, you are angry at the wrong people!

@gemstoneju Yeah sure some social housing homes ARE kept nice by young families - but some are NOT. As I said, I have seen quite a few kept beautifully for over half a century by people, only to turned into shitholes within a year by a certain type of person. (When the old tenants of 60 years or so leave....)

And as I said, the people who had this place as their lovely home, are turfed out against their will, for THAT.

Like I said, don't pretend it never happens, with your faux naivety - because it does. People have much less respect for their social housing properties these days. Many people were grateful for them pre 1990s, now, some people believe they are entitled to them, like the 'old people need to fuck off so I can have their house' types.

The income test was to ensure the main earner could afford the rent. In the early days of council housing, inspectors visited prospective tenants, and made judgements about the standard of cleanliness. Some of the files make for fascinating reading!

Families valued the improved standards, most moved from homes without hot water or bathrooms and took a pride in their new homes and gardens.

I don't know where you live, @PurpleButterflyWings, and maybe you're just very unlucky, but social houses where I live are kept pretty well by young families. The only real dumps are the houses owned by single men, alcos and an old woman who lives near me and is an enthusiastic feeder of pigeons and who has inadvertently infested every bloody garden in the street with vermin. Please don't tar all families who need social housing with the same brush.

Well they would think differently about it if you were only entitled to live there for say five years or until your youngest child was 18, obviously with exceptions for disabled etc. If you knew you only had a limited period you would work your arse off to save money to buy or rent when your time is up.

@Luckydip1 🤣🤣🤣🤣 you need to accept social housing is a way of life for some people. It's very much needed it's literally impossible for some people to buy a house. Be practical do you actually understand how difficult it is to gain social housing today or you still living 30 years ago? @AutumnCrow is right.

My mum is 60. She absolutely admitted lifw for us (her kids) is more expensive. Thpugh we are from another Eu country, but still, similar should logically apply in UK.

Social Housing isn't hostels, @Luckydip1. It was designed, policy-wise, as housing for working families and families in need. Originally there was an income test.

I think some people on MN think it's free or something

Even desperate women with children in refuges are required to apply for UC and housing benefit to pay their rent.

Tell me you have never been in social housing with a lifelong tenancy and affordable rent, without telling me you have never been in social housing with a lifelong tenancy and affordable rent. 🙄

Another thing is ... I know loads of senior citizen/elderly people, probably 75-85 plus, who've lived in the same council house, (3 or 4 bed property that they've lived in for 60+ years,) that they raised their two to five children in ... and they've lived on their own for the last 25-30 years since all the children left.

They looked after it, and it was immaculate and looked after as if it was their own property. Beautiful garden, lovely curtains, nicely carpeted and furnished, lovely decor, lovely flooring etc....

Then what happens is they're pushed or forced into care - or into a one bed flat or bungalow (bullied by the younger generations in their family and occasionally by the council,) to 'free up the house.' And what do they move in? A single parent or family with two to four kids - entitled and shouty, who scream day and night at one another, and exhibit appalling behaviour ... and within 12 to 18 months the place is an absolute shit tip, after being kept immaculately for 60 + years.

Don't even pretend this never happens. I know at least 7 or 8 properties this has happened to ... 3 and 4 bed properties kept beautifully for 60 years or more, and when the older tenants of 60 years leave, the council completely does it out.... new kitchen, new bathroom, new windows and doors, new central heating system, all decorated out for this new family ...

And within 12 months it's an absolute dump. Stuff broken and smashed - after arguments and rows, or one of their parties, and the new tenants demanding it's repaired immediately... And the garden is full of broken toys, smashed up rabbit hutches, dog shit, knackered garden furniture, old car and motorcycle parts, and grass that's never cut, with weeds all over the driveway and lawn... Yeah, yeah. right. Let's make people 'free up' their homes that they've had for 60-70 years to make way for THESE kind of people. 🙄

It was my understanding that this does happen but there is a cut-off point. No-one over 60 can be compelled to move, whereas a person in their fifties, who lived with elderly parents who died, for instance, gets told they can't stay in the property unless there's a child or disabled person resident. Those are the rules where I live. They will be offered a tenancy elsewhere. But I wouldn't say by today's standards that even 60 is particularly old.

With regards to social housing, sadly there isn't enough to go around. In an ideal world the government would be building bungalows, flats and family homes so none would be in short supply and everyone was covered throughout the stages of their lives.
This isn't happening though and women with young children are living in refuges while the elderly are housed comfortably in three bedroom family homes as there is nowhere else suitable for them to go.
I don't agree with tenancies that last a lifetime, if your needs change you should be moved on to free up the accommodation for someone who could benefit from it as you did. Social housing wasn't meant to be a permanent way of life, it was a safety net and a stepping stone.
The difference with home ownership to me should be obvious. Once you own something it is yours to do with as you wish for as long as you wish.

Social housing should be temporary to give people time to get back on their feet, not to live in until they die. There simply isn't enough housing stock to go round and it's not fair on the young families in desperate need for accommodation.

If you are a single person in a 3 bed council house, yes you should be moved to a smaller property.

If you OWN the property, where you go and if you choose to sell is your decision.

@Ingrowncrotchhair I think it's really difficult. As I've said up thread, I don't think a three bed house, and social housing tends to be smaller than.orivate housing, is a large property. However, if a couple or an individual end up there alone and have to rely on benefits to pay their bills, then I find it hard to square the argument that more money should be spent than is necessary. That ought to be made clear at the beginning of tenancies, which should be reviewed every five years, both to make sure they remain big enough and if they have become too big

Regrettably one's own money buys choice. I think too that many people do downsize. We will in 7 to 10 years for the simple reason that the running costs for our house are significant and when our income has reduced we wish to reduce our outgoings. Also by then we will be 70 and rattling around on our own. Filter the money down to the next generation I say.

I’m loving the argument that social housing should be returned, though.

so poor people don’t deserve to keep hold of their memories, to have security, to host extended family for special occasions…..
interesting

Definitely poor sound insulation causes misery for so many people.

I wouldn't really want to make rules about the size of property people can buy, depending on their household composition. Young families grow/have more children. Older couples may want spare bedrooms for visitors - ideally all my adult children would visit together, with their partners and children.

It's never going to happen because it would have to be rolled out all over . MPs giving up their massive homes , celebs , actors the lot .anyone who had a broom cupboard more than they need . Where would Victoria Beckham put all her clothes. Well I have a ton clothes and shoes so I have a walk in wardrobe because I grafted HARD for it. I had fuck all in my teens cause my father decided to fuck off and take his money with him and my mum died broken hearted that she couldn't stop him . My house is my safe place , my everything that reminds me I deserve to have it because i nearly broke myself getting it and so did my husband 5 redundancies and we are still here and it's the only thing I have . Isn't that enough reason. It will be sold when I'm no longer here to need it until then it's my house I paid for it and I'm living in it .the rest of you will have to wait !

If anyone thinks that I'm sleeping in the same bedroom as my stbDH for the rest of my life, they can feck off. Dear god, the tossing and turning and the noises and different waking times ... I'd be a basket case.

I need my own decent-size bedroom-office-study for my mental 'elf and to protect my income, thank you very much.

Exactly sounds like madness. If you have managed to buy a house it's entirely upto you if you want to live in a 5 bed house alone. You've bought it!

@PurelyOrnamental

My plan was to sell my large 3 bed end terraced when my children are much older and settled with their own families, I wanted to move to a smaller cottage with 2 bedrooms and smaller rooms (mainly because I don't fancy cleaning the house I have now until I'm in my dotage)
Some of the comments on here have honestly changed my mind, I think I will hang onto my large family home until I die and just get a cleaner!!
Me and my husband have worked damn hard to buy our property, we received no help from parents, no inheritance, nothing! The only reason I will move out of it is because I want to, most certainly not because there is a fictional queue of families desperate to buy it.

LOL, good for you!

@MintJulia

Well said @PurpleButterflyWings.

I've spent the last 12 years renovating my house. No-one else wanted it, it had been on the market for 18 months, and was barely habitable.

But now that I've rewired, replumbed, redecorated it. Had it reroofed, insulated, repointed, new kitchen and bathroom fitted, all windows and exterior doors replaced. Spent hours negotiating with the local planning office, finding good contractors, sourcing compliant materials, doing a lot of the work myself and worked for 10 years in the garden.

Now it is a warm, comfortable, clean, decent home, suddenly it is desirable and somehow I'm not entitled to it any more!

Err...no! Sod off. Anyone expecting me to surrender it before I choose to, will get the door shut smartly in their face.

YES!

@Wiccan

Well said 👍. It's gone a bit quiet now the over 50s are putting there foot down ! 🤔🤣

Yep, we are fierce when we wanna be! Took enough shit from people over the years, and won't take it anymore!

@Namddf

I don’t think anyone on the thread is talking about people living in a bog standard 3-bed semi. That’s not disproportionate to their needs.

Sorry but that is exactly what many people want. Even if it's a small 3 bed, with very little storage/small bedrooms etc, SOME people would still have you move out into a shitty little private let 1-bed flat, the SECOND your last child has left home! (So a BIG family can have your home!!!) 🙄

I don’t think anyone on the thread is talking about people living in a bog standard 3-bed semi. That’s not disproportionate to their needs.

The problem in my city isn't older people having the larger homes but the amount of homes that need work to make them liveable. There is social housing stock but the decent stuff was sold.

A relative of my bfs lives in a social housing 3 bed and it would be cruel to move him but it is a family home that's in short supply.

If you've bought your home or rent under a lifetime tenancy and are happy there I think you get to a point where you cannot face moving. My DGM lived in a massive house that was hard to manage until she went into a care home.

I've never owned a home larger than my needs but even so to future proof I live in a small bungalow now. But that's because I didn't want to rattle around a house when I'm old.

I've just changed some 25 year old door knobs and I felt a bit guilty.