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AIBU?

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Original poster

for giving DW an ultimatum to cut out her male friend or face separation?

189 replies

Froaway2023 · 07/04/2023 20:33

I am 43, DW is 39. We have been dating for six years and married for three and a half. She is white, I am a Egyptian Christian (will be relevant later). She does not know what MN is so, I can be frank with details.

Our issue is her male friend of 5+years. Said friend clearly has designs on my partner. In conversation he has (playfully ) confessed to a relaxed and enlightened attitude towards such adulterous relations, albeit in a more abstract context. He is also just a bit too familiar with my wife for my liking, i.e. massaging her shoulder in my presence to which she acquiesced. In the last few months, they have been spending time together i.e. dinner parties, cinema (they share interest in certain things), and other events I cannot make owing to my commitments at work and cleaning up after my alcoholic sister's mess (she has three kids I practically co-parent, they live a mile away, I am there every three days for about an hour). I began to be really bothered when, one night, whilst I was abroad for business, she locked herself out of the house and informed me that she would spend the evening at his. I objected, offering to book a hotel room instead. When she refused, I went ahead and paid, presenting her with a fait accompli. Guess what? She says oh well! Goes to his. When I remonstrated with her I was told this was not the Middle East. She was not my property. Admittedly she apologised for this and bought me gift.

Things came to ahead when on talking with said friend at a dinner party he made mention of a disease I had in early 2000s. I was astonished and hurt by the revelation that she freely shared what was for me a big burden I carried on from a dark time in my life.

This month, I booked a week off from work to recuperate. When she came home, I sat her down and gave her an ultimatum. My terms? To cut off said friend forever, or it was toast. I was off. I even showed her (admittedly fake) housing arrangements I had made should she refuse. Cue a breakdown. Cue tears. Cue apologies. She said has been her friend for 5 years and has been there for her in desperate times. She says she can have a talk with him but by no means will she cut him off.

Thoughts?

OP posts:
EliflurtleTripanInfinite · 07/04/2023 23:15

Luredbyapomegranate · 07/04/2023 21:53

it sounds like it might be time to call it a day

You cannot tell your partner to cut their friend off, and neither can you tell your partner they can’t stay overnight at a friend’s house. This is controlling behaviour. Faking a house you will move to when you threaten separation is manipulative.

But equally, allowing a platonic opposite sex friend to massage your shoulder in front of a husband who you know isn’t keen on him is disrespectful.

What’s telling is you don’t talk about you and your wife’s relationship at all. Do you get on when you spend time together? Do you like and love her?

You need to either call it a day or have some serious talks - and probably counselling. You will have to accept it isn’t all your wife’s fault if you try this route. Apart from the above, I am guessing she will have some complaints about the amount of time your sister sucks from you.

Don’t let this go on and on - get to a conclusion.

This is how it reads to me too.

She is being very unreasonable, but you trying to manipulate her isn't ok. If my husband booked a hotel for me like that it would immediately make me want to go stay with my friend because I'm not a child, but I also wouldn't have been acting that way in the first place. There is toxic behaviour on both sides, your DW is arguably worse, but the relationship is not healthy either way. I can see three options, go to marriage counselling,
seperate now, and the easy one is for you both to continue behaving the same and blaming each other while things get worse and worse and you get more and more harmed, and end up hating each other until someone eventual cracks and finishes the marriage.

bitcharming · 07/04/2023 23:11

pussycatinfluffyslippers · 07/04/2023 20:48

She's not your property.

Toast.

I know this is a typo but I just laughed my head off.

JohnnyYenSetHimselfOnFireAgain · 07/04/2023 23:09

mybeautifuloak · 07/04/2023 23:07

Hahaha. Imagine if this was a reverse and a dw was in here saying her dh had a female friend whom massaged him and he stayed over at her house. I doubt your response would be the same.

Show quote history

100% correct.

mybeautifuloak · 07/04/2023 23:07

Hbh17 · 07/04/2023 20:52

She is allowed to have friends, both men and women.
She doesn't have to do what you tell her.
She may well be better off/ happier if she leaves this marriage.

Hahaha. Imagine if this was a reverse and a dw was in here saying her dh had a female friend whom massaged him and he stayed over at her house. I doubt your response would be the same.

DHsPoorBack · 07/04/2023 23:06

Tandora · 07/04/2023 22:57

there are a million reasons for not answering the phone, and who even has a landline these days anyway? And how many people are monitoring where their neighbours sleep on a daily basis and reporting it to their spouses? And if she really did need to justify being out of the house; why not just say she was going to a hotel or staying somewhere else? Honestly if she is having an affair with this man she’s being incredibly obvious and dumb about it. Every time she wants a shag is she going to pretend she locked herself out again? Don’t be daft.

Show quote history

Also, why didn't she just call in a locksmith. Just told DH this story and he pointed out that's what either of us would do.

Exactly.

Sorry, but you're being incredibly naive if you think she actually locked herself out and had to stay with Mr Massage. She just came out with the first nonsense she could think of as soon as her husband was away and couldn't physically catch her out.

Obvious and dumb? No. Doesn't really care about her husband so doesn't bother to hide it that much? Yes.

mybeautifuloak · 07/04/2023 23:05

IrregularChoiceFan · 07/04/2023 20:44

You'd be out, I wouldn't be told who I could and couldn't be friends with by my partner.

To be fair, she'd be out if I was her husband so no loss there

Saracen · 07/04/2023 23:03

At this point, does it really matter whether YABU? You gave her an ultimatum. She chose not to comply. The relationship is over.

It seems the two of you aren't compatible. Whether or not she was cheating on you or was heading down that path, she thinks it's acceptable for her to have a male friend who is openly willing to sleep with someone else's partner, whereas you don't think it's okay for her to be friendly with such a person. You both feel strongly enough to end the relationship over it.

Curseofthenation · 07/04/2023 23:02

She shouldn't have let her friend massage her, that's weird. However, if I was her friend then I would be telling her to put you straight in the bin. You're a manipulative bully. I hope there are no children in the picture.

JohnnyYenSetHimselfOnFireAgain · 07/04/2023 23:01

FloydPepper · 07/04/2023 22:40

Those posters will find a way for the man to be at fault, whatever it takes.

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Absolutely spot on. Welcome to Mumsnet!

Mummynew08 · 07/04/2023 23:01

Also, why didn't she just call in a locksmith. Just told DH this story and he pointed out that's what either of us would do.

JohnnyYenSetHimselfOnFireAgain · 07/04/2023 22:58

Luredbyapomegranate · 07/04/2023 22:05

I don’t think they would be different. They are both behaving badly. The OP is controlling, the OP’s wife is disrespectful. They are clearly unhappy and need to call it a day. Most people have said this, and would also say this if the sexes were reversed.

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You really don't think the replies would be different? So if a woman posted that a female friend of her husband had become too close to him
for her comfort, her husband had discussed his wife's medical issues with this friend and this friend had been behaving inappropriately
towards her husband even in your presence, you think the replies would be the same? 😂😂

Tandora · 07/04/2023 22:57

DHsPoorBack · 07/04/2023 22:34

Methinks you are a tad naive.

Why would she need to invent a story?

So that when OP called the house and couldn't get hold of her, she had a cover story.

So that when the neighbours/friends who randomly called by and noticed she wasn't home, and could potentially refer to it in front of her husband, she had a cover story.

If something weird happened, and she wasn't at home (burglars generally target an empty house) she had a cover story.

Show quote history

there are a million reasons for not answering the phone, and who even has a landline these days anyway? And how many people are monitoring where their neighbours sleep on a daily basis and reporting it to their spouses? And if she really did need to justify being out of the house; why not just say she was going to a hotel or staying somewhere else? Honestly if she is having an affair with this man she’s being incredibly obvious and dumb about it. Every time she wants a shag is she going to pretend she locked herself out again? Don’t be daft.

Whatifthecathatesthebaby · 07/04/2023 22:57

Op you shouldn't be lying to your wife or giving her ultimatums BUT she isn't being reasonable here either, especially if she has previously asked you to cut a friend out of your life for similar reasons. Honestly you don't sound like either of you truly has happiness in this marriage. Consider couples counselling or separation but do not continue to treat each other with such little courtesy, love or respect.

SkyandSurf · 07/04/2023 22:56

Oh just break up. You'll both be happier.

What disease was it? Was it something you keep strictly private or something you've talked about before? My DH had malaria 20 years ago and I wouldn't think anything of telling someone that.

Also if you're going to be fastidious about your own privacy maybe don't post details about your dysfunctional marriage on a public forum prefaced with 'it's fine she doesn't read Mumsnet' implying she wouldn't be happy with your choice to do so.

Booking to hotel room and presenting her with a 'fair accompli' when you knew it was against her wishes makes you sound like a controlling prick. As do ultimatums and fake housing documents.

Stop messing about and move out. You don't trust her. It's done.

ItchycooParkCult · 07/04/2023 22:56

Froaway2023 · 07/04/2023 21:31

An hour doesnt include the constant phone calls and school meetings. Or bailing the elder one out of jail. Or trying to keep him our of gangs. The hour there includes getting them to shower (they dont do so frequently) hissy fits etc.

With your sisters needs is there a chance you’ve neglected your wife? You said yourself she’s taken the friend to events because you can’t go because you’ve prioritised your sister and her needs.

I know alcoholism and it’s notoriously draining and many can be severely needy especially where there’s children to care for. You can’t tell kids to fuck off like you can a drunk sibling. I know how tough this is.

many would balk at the prospect of doing this but if your sisters alcoholism is so bad you have to attend school meetings and help them shower, take constant phone calls, it’s bad enough that the children can’t be cared for and you need to contact social care (if not already involved) because you cannot fix your sister as you are her crutch. You’re stopping her from hitting her rock bottom and thus wanting to seek treatment. This doesn’t mean you abandon her. Tough love is still love. Boundaries are still care. Intervention is protecting her and the kids but you need outside help here.

This does not in anyway excuse your wife’s behaviour nor lay blame on yourself but perhaps explain why she sought out a friend rather than yourself and why that friendship has blossomed and yours is stagnating.

However the friend is a bad egg and clearly pushing boundaries around you. Massages are intimate and not something done between friends in that way (unless same sex or single I suppose) This is the kind of man who doesn’t respect that a woman is married and thinks it’s ok to behave inappropriately in front of her husband is not a man I’d like to be around. . Regardless of if your wife allows it who the hell does that? Basic respect surely? However your wife is her own person too and she should’ve said no as it was inappropriate.

you are absolutely in the wrong for creating fake housing options. That’s incredibly manipulative to do that. The same as the hotel room trying to force something your way will never work.

but I agree with you the wife and her friendship has to be cooled for a while perhaps permanently though the ultimatum is just going to push the friendship into real secrecy.

I would suggest you seek some outside help for yourself. You need to set better boundaries with your sister and the rest of your family I think too; if you’re bailing them out so often. You describe yourself as a pushover and people abusing your trust I suppose? Doing this in a healthy way - not the ultimatums you’ve placed down are very strong almost immediately and extremely controlling- will make you and all round better partner and brother. It’s going to be tough though.

you and your wife really are at breaking point. You’re trying to control. She’s pulling away. Counselling might help her but you both have to be willing.

and you both need to be more present in the relationship!

Rowthe · 07/04/2023 22:53

Froaway2023 · 07/04/2023 21:09

Typical racism. The behaviour of my wife would be unacceptable by any standards and I have been backed up in this by almost all my friends (all lily white if that makes you feel better). Back massages? Overnight stays at a friend who confessed to feeling relaxed about f*cking other people's SOs. Am I crazy here?

YANBU

I wouldn't be happy with it either if my husband was doing the same.

And yeah I would separate if I had to.

CheersForThatEh · 07/04/2023 22:52

If you trust her then leave it alone..

She could have shagged him when she stayed over. She could leave you for him. She doesn't.

You dont have to trust him, just her.

TreadLightly3 · 07/04/2023 22:52

Puppalicious · 07/04/2023 20:52

I can’t believe how different the responses to you are compared to what they would be if this was a woman posting about her DH having her shoulder massaged, staying over in his female friends house, telling her very personal info etc…

whoops I mean this one - the behaviour by OP’s wife is completely inappropriate

TreadLightly3 · 07/04/2023 22:49

This reply has been withdrawn

This message has been withdrawn at the poster's request

Glitteratitar · 07/04/2023 22:49

You made a huge mistake posting here. A vast number of MNers are racist man haters. Unfortunately you’re both Arab and a man, so even if you caught your wife having sex with this man, they would still blame you for it.

YANBU. Your wife has shown blatant disrespect for your marriage and you reaching breaking point is not unusual. If a woman was giving her husband the same ultimatum, she would be applauded here for standing up for herself. But because you’re Arab and a man, you are controlling and evil.

Your wife needs to choose her husband or her friend. You gave her the choices, now it’s on her.

Wetwag35 · 07/04/2023 22:47

I would get rid of her, doesn’t sound worth the effort.
you seem to be mal aligned and it feels a bit like (from what you’ve written) that she is taking the piss. It could also be making you more controlling and you’re clearly not that sort of guy, you’re better than that. Just get rid, and find yourself someone who doesn’t flirt with other people in front of you, or give out your secrets to people you don’t like or stay over at friends houses who you are insecure about. It’s 2023, the dating game is strong, I’m sure you’ll land on your feet.

Butchyrestingface · 07/04/2023 22:46

she has three kids I practically co-parent, they live a mile away, I am there every three days for about an hour)

You're a funny guy.

pointythings · 07/04/2023 22:44

This is probably the first MN thread I've seen where both parties in the marriage are behaving equally badly. You both need to stop it, or get a divorce.

FloydPepper · 07/04/2023 22:40

DHsPoorBack · 07/04/2023 21:46

Wtf am I reading?

You are absolutely not being unreasonable. On what planet are these posters existing where this man massages your wife while she laps it up, in front of you... And you're the bad guy?!

The booking the hotel room was not controlling. At all. She conveniently at a time when you were abroad, locked herself out. And the only solution she was interested in, was staying at his. You simply gave her a perfectly acceptable alternative, yet she chose to sleep over at "massage man's". She then deflects and quite disgustingly attacks your culture, because she can't think of another reason why she can't use the hotel. I bet her keys miraculously turned up, no locksmith was needed.

No respectful, honest, decent partner, male or female, would behave like this.

Those posters will find a way for the man to be at fault, whatever it takes.

Redebs · 07/04/2023 22:35

Of course it's not ok for her to behave like this. If you are married, you go out if your way to avoid any ambiguous or potentially compromising situations.
I wonder what she is getting from this? Is she enjoying the attention?
She needs to stop playing games. After her comment that was culturally stereotyped, I think you might want to seriously think about splitting up. For real. Not pretending and showing fake intention to put pressureon her, but actually following through.

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