AIBU to think rape is now legal in the UK?

Yes.

Why don't you go and have a read about what Starmer did as DPP and what was immediately reversed when he left?

Heres some material to start you off:

https://www.channel4.com/news/factcheck/factcheck-did-rape-conviction-rates-fall-when-starmer-led-the-cps

https://www.bevanfoundation.org/news/2014/01/keir-starmer-urges-protection-for-victims/

https://www.thejusticegap.com/analysis-has-the-cps-changed-its-policy-on-rape/

https://www.civilserviceworld.com/professions/article/director-of-public-prosecutions-alison-saunders-to-step-down

All civil servants enact the policy of the government in power so let's not pretend that politics has no impact on rape convictions

The issue mentioned the prvsious poster resonates with me. There are several people that have been suspects in multiple crimes, but there is not enough evidence, and in my heart I know they are guilty. So many repeat offenders.

Also, I'd also add that the reported crimes (subjectively, from what I've seen) seem of a much more serious nature. I won't be explicit, but rape cases today typically involve a lot more "activities" than 20+ years ago. I strongly believe this is the influence of porn. In the past, the standard case involved what everyone understands as standard male->female rape, now there is a lot more, which has a huge impact on victims.

Julie Bindel said the exact same thing in 2007
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2007/feb/01/penal.genderissues

Possibly a stupid question as I'm no expert, but could they change the system to allow those past accusations to be re-taken into account? Rape is usually a pattern of behaviour, and whilst an individual incident might come down to "one person's word against another", over the course of a decade it's often many victims of the same man describing the same pattern.

Radi0 · Today 16:01
A good friend of mine was raped, violently. She will never be the same again. She did the right thing and reported it straight away, she had wet herself while she ran from the property.

It went to court. He was let off. It turned out he had been in court five times for rape. Got off every time. Absolutely sickening

Horrendous - i would want to put him behind bars for the rest of his life

But the court 'system' will need to change to do this. The fact that it has got to court means that the police & CPS have supported a prosecution against him every time, its at the court where the conviction fails.

In the legal aspects of this for many years, but no longer working in the UK, but still have good contacts in the areas/teams I worked with (SE England).

I'd have huge amount to complain about with respect the system, enough to write a book! But I also think (subjectively) the situation is better now than at any time in the past. This is not in any way meant to suggest the situation is acceptable, it IS NOT.

But there is more police training, medical training, support services, more integrated police services and improved tech than at any point in the past. The different between 30 years ago and today is staggering.

verdantverdure
If there were contemporaneous photos of a black eye and a split lip and testimony from a medic about vaginal or analysis tearing it would at least give the jury something to consider.

I agree - but if the suspect denies he has caused the black eye and the vaginal tear its still going to be one word against another. The jury can consider it, but it has to add to the burden of proof.

I am not agreeing with it - but the law currently stands by proving beyond reasonable doubt.

What can be put in place to change this?

That's awful

A good friend of mine was raped, violently. She will never be the same again. She did the right thing and reported it straight away, she had wet herself while she ran from the property.

It went to court. He was let off. It turned out he had been in court five times for rape. Got off every time. Absolutely sickening

Apologies, i haven't read the full thread but remember the Belfast trial with the rugby players? That tells you everything you need to know about how victims are treated. You can absolutely see why women don't put themselves through that.

GobbieMaggie
What section of PACE are you referring to?

L1ttledrummergirl
Women need to know before it happens, that if it happens, it's not their fault.
Women carry no blame if they are raped.
Women carry no shame if they are raped.
Women need to know that if they are raped, they call the police straight away and they will be believed.
Women need to know that the police will do everything possible from the minute they call to gather evidence for a prosecution.
Sadly, Women need to know ahead of any rape occurring that any evidence will be on their clothes and body and need to be preserved.
Women should be able to get a fast prosecution, they should not have to face the perpetrator in court.

I agree with the above

I always speak to victims/survivors in the initial contact that their account is not to be challenged - and i don't challenge unless there is something really obvious.

We do gather as much evidence as we can in the initial contact - clothing, scenes, medical examination, early evidence kits. The suspect is arrested as soon as possible as they are a scene in themselves. They get medically examined, clothing seized, their home often becomes a scene, etc etc

Safeguarding will be put in place with support services - there are also a host of measures that are put in place at court - video links, screens etc etc

I see PACE has completely passed you by.

TooBigForMyBoots
properly functioning police, forensics and justice system would definitely help.

Forensics will not help you in the case where the suspect states that it was consensual

The CPS & Courts work on proving beyond reasonable doubt - do propose to change this?

I agree - lazy, institutionalized cops should be gotten rid off, and i have said this on several other threads. Betting & continued vetting and PDR's - and no 'rainbow' culture etc

I've also posted some suggestions upthread. I also agree with this.

I did put forward my recommendations upthread. I'd also recommend a complete restructuring of the police force so that lazy, institutionalised police officers with learned helplessness be put out to pasture.

So what can change in the judicial system that will increase the conviction rate?

Do we abandon the burden of proof and go along the 'balance of probabilities' as in civil courts?

The Police do not convict anybody, the justice system is responsible for that. Although I'm sure you'd want to change that- a 21st-century Star Chamber perhaps ?.

Radi0
Exactly - and a lot don't want to go through it all again at court

We should not be putting pressure on them to do so if they don't

TooBigOhForMyBoots
Oh, our resident rozzer has arrived to Tansplain why piss poor rape convictions are in no the fault if a misogynist culture in policing.

So put a constructive argument together then. Do you honestly think that the whole police, CPS and judicial service is deliberate making the conviction rates for rape as low as they can? Or trying to legalise it?

And there are a shit load more that aren't reported. I certainly wouldn't report it after what I've seen people go through

MrsTerryPratchett
I'm not blaming the victims/survivors - and stop just falling back on the 'police apologist' line when you can't add anything constructive - it starts to get boring.

I'm putting my opinion across

What ways do you think we can improve things based on the current burden of proof for crimes at court?