How much responsibility do you feel to look after parents in old age?

My dad I imagine will be one of those who die shortly after retirement. He has no hobbies and is quite a boring person so I think once the first initial few months of excitement have worn off he'll struggle. That's if my already retired step mum doesn't kill him first ha! My mum I can't imagine in retirement, she's a stubborn mule and does well to look after herself despite some health conditions. My in-laws are older and in their mid 70's. DFIL has had a few health scares but seems to manage well. DMIL acts like she's in her 40's, she does not sit still. I'm hoping the in-laws will move closer in the next 5 years or so, they are three hours away at the moment. I feel that when DFIL can't manage the drive any more then they'll admit defeat and move. Wouldn't bother me too much them being closer.

I see it as my responsibility, yes.

My dad died 5 years ago after some mental health problems. My older sister, who lives 45 minutes closer than I do, was unbelievably useless. Wouldn't visit him when he was ill, and when he died, refused to have any role in planning the funeral or supporting our mum. She was all "I'm putting in some boundaries", which is all well and good, but what about me? When do I get to put in MY boundaries?

At the moment, mum is well and happy, but I know that any potential care needed in the future will be all on me. I've accepted that, and will do what I need to do in order to sleep peacefully at night. I already know that sister can't/won't do anything. It hasn't done our relationship any favours. But I love my mum, and I won't see her go without because my sister is a useless person.

Also I feel the same as many here in that as I feel at this point in my life, having experienced these issues with parents I never ever ever want my children to have to feel a fraction of the mental anguish, pain and sadness or responsibility that I have been through. I don’t want them to look after me. HOWEVER both my parents used to say exactly the same. They absolutely categorically used to say they didn’t want us looking after them. Honestly once they or you become frail, fragile and dementia creeps in stealing away thoughts from the past and confidence- they and you will most likely cling to anyone who will care or help them. Especially if there is familiarity. It’s the human survival instinct. We don’t just have this Christ like ability to sacrifice ourselves in old age for the benefit of others.

Some expensive care homes give an illusion of being better. They might have nicer decor and the menu looks fancy. They might have a lovely lounge area for families to have posh coffees and biscuits. That’s not what is important. It’s how they interact with patients, how the staff are treated and I would say cleanliness of your parent/ other residents. Watch closely how they interact with other residents and not doing the trying to impress performance when they know you are there. I’ve heard absolutely heart warming exchanges between staff and residents but equally in the same home we have seen and experienced less positive situations. It’s never ideal but expensive doesn’t mean it’s all fine. Also you still have to be on the ball and advocating for your parent. It’s not a case of them being in a home “ job done”. You’ll need to still do a fair amount if you want to ensure they are ok

I also ended up putting mom in a care home in a needs improvement care home . I was recommended to it by one of her carers whose own mom had been in it .
pit only has 11 residents and quite basic in that they have commodes in their room rather than en suite at night.
I used my own judgement in how I found it and also reading between the lines with the QCC reports. They had always been rated good up until covid. I have found the home to have a family atmosphere and the staff have remained the same .Not agency . Mom can still use the toilet a year after being there. She has dementia.
I would say go for the one you find the best suited to your parent but also one you can get to regularly if you don’t want them to forget you and you still want that contact .

I do think you're right @Quisquam that you need to be alert when looking at care homes and 'present' with visits etc., It does give you a better feel for a place and staff know you're on the ball (and that you will also support them if they need back up with social service etc)

In my mum's case we chose a 'needs improvement' care home over a 'good' care home which seems insane.

However, the residents in the 'good' care home seemed very quiet compared to those in the 'needs improvement' - too quiet for adults who had dementia and other needs.

There was a lot of laughter in the 'needs improvement' home when we went. We were encouraged to have a chat with the residents whilst the person showing us round went off to get us a cup of tea - so no fear of what we may find out. The 'good' home rushed us through at each point.

And the 'needs improvement' home we chose felt 'home like'. The residents ate in one shift (the 'good' care home had a rota which mum wouldn't have understood - she had dementia). They had a lovely conservatory dining room overlooking the garden with a menu in big letters outside it and we were encouraged to book a meal with mum (obviously we paid for that) whenever we wanted.

We had regular phone calls if mum had been unwell or if she'd had a fall - even if there was no need for an ambulance to be called they kept us informed.

When we went she was always clean and tidy. One of the care home staff always painted the ladies nails for them if they wanted it. He would also set their hair in between hairdresser visits which mum loved!

Most telling from my point of view was that mum had gone there from respite in another home. At that respite home (which had a good reputation locally) mum had been put into incontinence pants because of a few accidents - double incontinence was on her notes from them to the final care home. She was also on a zimmer frame. Both of which she hadn't been using when she went from a long hospital stay to that respite home.

At the 'needs improvement' place they reassessed her and told us they were keeping the pants but only as a precaution as she was a slow walker. She was perfectly capable of using the loo and they'd seen no double incontinence at all. Until she finally died in hospital from a chest infection the staff said they'd never needed to changed her pants. They were as dry coming off at night as they were going on, like normal pants. And my mum was a 'cup of tea whenever it's offered' person so was always on the loo!

And they did an assessment on her walking when she arrived. They decided the zimmer frame was going and got her back to using a walking stick. In their words the frame was totally unnecessary, was holding her back and she couldn't use it properly so hated it. They said to us they had no idea what possessed the respite home to get her on it in the first place - her walking was fine, slow but steady with her stick. The difference, to me, was that the respite home had lino flooring - the care home had carpet so more 'grippy'. She never used a zimmer frame or anything other than her walking stick from that day until she went into hospital for her final few weeks.

So you do wonder who all these things are useful for.

Oh and the 'needs improvement' rating? The care home manager was newly promoted so had forgotten some paper work to the inspectors when she'd had an accident case and a death at the home. She'd also had a member of staff 'lose' some medicine cabinet keys (found in a residents bedroom) - which is obviously very bad from a safeguarding point of view.

However, the paper work had gone to the proper authorities (council, social services etc) but she'd left the inspectors out of the loop. The care home put an experienced manager in as mentor. By the time we got mum in there the mentor was phone based only as the new manager had found their feet. She had put in new policies around medicine cabinet use and paper work was being done properly. Their next inspector visit (after mum joined them) got them a 'good'.

So yes, you do have to trust your gut, read the reports and show your face.

DM and FiL had dementia - FiL came to live with us for about a year until I simply couldn’t cope any more (we’d had no idea what dementia could involve - talk about blissful ignorance!) and he moved to a care home.

When it came to my DM some years later there was no way she was moving in (I loved her but she was never the easiest person anyway) but supported her as far as poss, visiting and staying over, until she simply wasn’t safe to be left alone at all any more - again time for a care home.

After many years of all this, there absolutely no way I ever want dds to look after me - I will pay for care if and when needed. I hope I will never be a worry and a burden to them.

It looks like my mum.has degenerative brain condition but dispite repeated efforts I can't 1) get dm to share info with me or allow me to accompany her to hospital visits 2) convince my sibling that mum might be losing capacity. I feel that in the months since I have known this I'm making myself stressed just trying to raise concern in mum or sibling to deal with the nhs consultants. I was going to try to get lpo for mum but I feel like I'm already flogging a dead horse. Where do you even start when everyone is in denial? I'm currently wondering if I want to continue getting stressed when no one else is yet.

*Yes, DH wants to refuse to pay the care home fees; although MIL had only been there a few weeks and they hadn’t charged her; before they sent her to hospital. She left hospital with CKD level 3 and went back with sepsis and CKD level 5. The staff told us, it was the worst kidney function they had ever seen; and they wondered how long she’d been left without food and drink by the care home.

We had the suspicion, they decided she was over a certain age, and put her on the Liverpool care pathway, without any consultation with anyone else!*

Have you read my posts - that is mine about MIL on the Care Home Neglect thread, started by someone else, shocked at the neglect of her mother. CKD is chronic kidney disease. The hospital staff could not believe how downhill MIL had gone in a month, from them discharging her the first time into a care home. The consultant at the hospital called me in, while I and DC were visiting her, after she had been re admitted with sepsis, to say MIL’s kidney function was 5% and that meant dialysis, however she was too frail for that. She was going to die, and the choice for the family was where - at her home or the hospital? She died the next morning.

Do you really think, after her funeral on Friday, someone I’d known for 37 years, I’d be bothered with making political points? I don’t want to see that happen to any elderly person, especially one who’d worked hard all her life to care for her family!

I would also add that having cared for my mum for a few months in my home before she died. It’s truly exhausting. Just the burden of having to notice anything amiss, it honestly felt like a full time job. Getting showered and dressed used to take me an hour for example. I’m glad I was able to do that for her but I couldn’t have managed without my husband and two very helpful and caring children. I will admit the times she was in hospital it almost felt like a break for me. Mentally above everything else.

This is completely correct. When we looked around care homes we were very cautious and vigilant about how they all interacted and I even asked a few residents. One man shook his head and said “don’t come here”. I ever asked any further than that. I would say well as well that they’re not all the same and unfortunately money does give you better options. My dad is in a fantastic one but is £7k a month and he has a lot of money.

You do need to seem very present I think, no daily or anything but frequent calls etc like hospitals. If you’re loved one is in one, they are much more on the ball if they know the relatives are on the ball.

Exactly what is the POINT of sharing that article on a thread full of posters - me included - who are laying out the reality of dealing with a very frail parent or a parent with advanced dementia? Are you trying to make us feel guilty for "putting mum into a home"? Inadequate for not being able to cope at home? Or are you just being an insensitive, goady fucker who didn't actually read any of the posts and just thought they'd made a political point?

I was replying to a pp, who said there are risks to not sending someone to a care home. Actually, I was pointing out, there are risks to care homes too. I think some posters are naive, because they seem to think their parents can afford to pay for a care home, and that will take care of everything. Exactly what is the POINT of sharing that article on a thread full of posters - me included - who are laying out the reality of dealing with a very frail parent or a parent with advanced dementia? Are you trying to make us feel guilty for "putting mum into a home"? Inadequate for not being able to cope at home? Or are you just being an insensitive, goady fucker who didn't actually read any of the posts and just thought they'd made a political point?*

I have a DD, who lives in a care home because she needs 1:1 care all her waking hours, on-site consultant care and a medical centre 24/7. She is too complex for a care home, with just a team of nurses and local GP. She comes home 30% of the time.

MIL has just died, after being sent for four weeks, to a care home for the elderly by social services, for rehabilitation, hopefully to enable her to return home with an enhanced care package.

So, no I am not making a political point, I am writing with years of experience of watching how care homes work; and listening to social workers, and friends, who have either worked in them or visited their parents every day. Social Services go to visit DD every 6 months and then they give me their professional opinions orally and comprehensively in writing. Some posters are naive imo, and seem to think as their parents can afford a care home, that will take care of everything. Imo, relatives still need to coordinate things like finances, benefits, etc and keep a watchful eye. Some care homes are very good and some aren’t. As an adult, I would have thought you would prefer to be forewarned, and forearmed? You didn’t have to read the article; it was pretty obvious from the link what it was about. Personally, I’d prefer to know what to look out for, rather than find out the hard way through hindsight.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't I think. Mum stayed in her own home til death. Her advanced dementia meant that the last few months of her life she was in bed staring at the ceiling of her room with a carer coming for 36 hours a week and me there too keeping the bills paid etc. she stopped eating really about 3 months before she died. She would take a tiny mouthful but shake her head and really only wanted warm tea or water. She was clearly dying and had a peace plan, which meant no more antibiotics or hospital admissions.

District nurses came every day to change her dressings on her ulcers. A week before she died I was called round and given a bollocking from the district nurses who told me she was getting too thin and not enough nutrition to 'thrive'. I was told to make nutritious casseroles, blend them and get them down her any way I could. She died a week later with me feeling I had let her down.

My df, none. We were estranged by the time I was 16.

My dm, I paid her gas bill and took her shopping occasionally. Used to see her maybe once every 8 weeks. She lived at home, independently until about 2 weeks before she died. I spent 7 of the last 14 days at her bed side. I was there if she called.

DBro and I jokingly fight over who gets mum and dad when they are old (as in we both want them!)

Culturally lots of people have an elderly gran at home/or nearby and pop in every day.

I supported my dad a lot when he was dying, in terms of advice, planning but he was relatively young and fit until the end (cancer 😓)

I now support my mum who has multiple serious health issues and is incredibly stubborn/ neglects herself and refuses most help. This will only get more tricky with time. I love her, she was a wonderful loving mum in my childhood but has become very withdrawn and difficult as she has got older. I will support her as much as I can.

I'm still in my thirties and most of my peers are still relying on their parents for childcare/help. It's not been easy balancing life with young children and ill/ elderly parents.

Exactly the opposite in my family. My parents always said they would not want or allow me or my siblings to compromise our own lives/plans to look after them in their old age. My Mum passed away and Dad is living with my sister but has private carers that come in daily (thankfully he can afford them) so he has been able to stay at home.

Not going into care homes does come with quite a lot of risks you're probably unable to eliminate even if you live close-by

Here are some of the risks from going into a care home:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/mar/27/social-care-britain-business-plan-elderly-mistreated-homes-profit

Well, my parents are both dead, so not much… but my DM did express on several occasions that when DH and I moved out of London she was very indignant that we did not move to be closer to her so that I could look after her in her dotage. But then she died, so that turned out to have been the right decision for us!

However, my PILs have recently moved to be closer to us so that they can help out a bit with the DC, and DH and I are aware that the upshot of that is that we will need to take care of them in turn when the need arises.

I'm not sure many of you are very realistic. My father 93 has plenty of money for care but he didnt have the confidence, wherewithal or know how to sort his own care living independently. We had to arrange everything - which is not straightforward at all - I hope you're not thinking we have a simple to navigate social care system in this country even for self funders.

Then add in confusion, determination that they don't need extra care and the health crises - the falls, acute health crisis, and ambulances called for emergencies. I've spent countless evenings in A&E, and then battling to prevent my Dad being admitted and trying to get him discharged. Money won't prevent any of that. My Dad had care morning and night but fell (because of low blood pressure) 3 or 4 times a week, smashing furniture as he went. And then, beyond all of the physical ailments remember the loneliness. After his wife (my beloved mum) died my poor Dad needed more of his children's company - paid for company is not enough.

But till you have to be on call enjoy your freedom. I moved from caring for my kids and seeing them off to uni to spending more and more time looking after my Dad. When he goes I won't have any guilt - I've absolutely been there for him - for kindly chat and for the crises. We do what's right. I dont resent it for a minute.

I have a brother and culturally there is an expectation that he will take on that responsibility. I live 4 hours away so wouldn't be of much help practically but would be willing to help with groceries or bills.

I do not want to care for mil. She doesn't help me out whereas she does sil so they can do it. I have no issues with dh doing whatever he wants to help his mum but I won't commit to physical care. I know that makes me sound horrible but she favours bil over my dh and their kids so I have less time for her.

It's the sheer amount of time it takes to do something as a carer that I don't think people may understand until they have done it themselves. My mum had dementia and for the last few years of her life was more or less continent. She needed help getting on and off the loo and was wheelchair bound. It would take upwards of 30 minutes every time she needed a wee because once I had got her out of her wheelchair, and safely on the loo she would forget what she was there for, have a little sleep and then when she was sure she had finished would get 3 sheets of toilet paper and fold them in half, in half again, and again, then perhaps use them or more likely start again with another 3 sheets. Every process was slow.

There were phone calls through the night while she could still use the phone, and when she couldn't use it anymore she would scream out to my brother to ring me.

I’m expecting to do near to nothing. We’ve had no help from them with our DC when we were both working and juggling. Both sets of parents live about 3 hours away. We see my dad about twice a year for a flying visit (no help when here) and PIL once a month (nearly no help when here, maybe read 1 DC a bedtime story 🙄).

My dad can fund his own care. PIL retired at 60 “because that’s when people retire” despite having little in the way of pension savings and a small bungalow that can’t be downsized. They do prioritise bucket list holidays. They seem older now at 75, but they’ve made clear what they prioritise and it hasn’t been helping family. So quid pro quo.

I’ll be spending my 50s prioritising our DC. DH is welcome to do anything he fancies to help his parents, but I doubt that will amount to much, as it’s always been down to me to arrange cards and presents for any occasion… somehow I can’t see him nipping up the A1 to make meals or help with care!! 😂