Are mums more attached to their babies than dads?

You and your husband sound like a great team, really mature and ready to be great parents. We were the same. It was in my birth plan that as soon as baby was out, I wanted him put in DH arms, with my hand on the top. We bottle feed, we share nights, and we took shared parental leave. Now both back at work we take turns to do nursery drop offs/collection. My kid loves us both, and both sets of grandparents too.

Presume if one parent is working away the other is still around?

I did leave my baby at three months for a honeymoon, with grandparents who helped out anyway as back then maternity leave rules meant I was back by 9 weeks. I’d been really ill all pregnancy and benefitted hugely from the recovery time. We all survived just fine but impossible not sure I would have done it with subsequent children-maybe the honeymoon was significant enough to balance it.

If a mum of breastfeeding then oxytocin’s is a real factor but if not I think it’s equal- or should be.

Biologically, yes, mums are more attached/baby is more attached to them. Babies don’t even realise they are separate to mum for a good while, I can’t remember how long.

You haven’t said how old baby will be. I think that makes a difference.

Mine were both bf so I’m coming from that perspective and not just from practicality but from attachment. I wouldn’t have wanted to leave them overnight, especially not to go abroad.

Yes there are different expectations of Dads societally but also biologically. They bond too but it is different.

Default parenting is absolutely a thing. The experience a mother has is hugely different from a father and the bond you have is different.

Some mums are quite happy to relinquish the responsibility of motherhood and leave baby for a night. Some wait years. You will never know how you feel, or what kind of baby you have. Some are easy going, some are little clingers. The type of mum you will be will be influenced by that.

That doesn’t mean that it’s detrimental for a baby or mum to be away from each other though, does it?

My son was held pretty much all the time we were awake from birth (he slept beside us in a crib during the night but on us during the day) - he would cry if not being held, but was equally settled when being held by either of us.

My partner was the first one to hold him, to feed him, etc. - I couldn’t stop vomiting for his entire first day.

I bonded to my son instantly, but it took longer with my daughter. Interestingly though, my daughter had a stronger attachment to me, whereas even now my son doesn’t care who holds him, as long as he’s being held.

Even if the father is the primary caregiver, that does not erase the biological bond between mum and child. Baby still thinks they’re the same person as mum for months.

I left all three of my DC with DH as soon as I could go back to the gym! DH also took each of them to visit his grandparents at less than a week old so I could sleep. Obviously breastfeeding does restrict things a bit eg after 3-4 hours I would need to feed or pump and DD never accepted a bottle (DS1 and DS2 did which made things easier). I did keep in touch days with work and left DS2 with my mum when he was about 2 months old, wouldn’t have managed overnight due to breastfeeding. I had to pump at work.

We left DD overnight (weekend away) with my MIL and FIL as soon as she was happily sleeping consistently all night and drinking nicely from a bottle I think at 7 months.

You are missing the point that fathers CAN be the primary caregiver, and not every mother feels the “biological desire” to have their child strapped to them 24/7. Especially if the mother doesn’t form an instant bond or get that initial gush of love (which is completely normal and okay)

Well it is important to understand a baby’s biological desires. You can’t go into parenting with your eyes shut.

You need to be looking into things like the fourth trimester, sleep expectations etc.

Of course baby won’t feel equally close to both of you. Baby doesn’t even realise they’re a separate person to mum until they’re about 7 months old.

And it’s not until 9 months old that babies start to form attachments to anyone other than their primary caregiver.

You are woefully ignorant and naive on parenting and you need to do some research on it because it’s important.

Dad can be an equal parent in that he helps with nappy changes, baths etc but he will never be equal in the eyes of your baby, and you are really misunderstanding the strong emotional pull you will have to your little one that makes it hard to leave them.

There is not biological reason for babies to have a stronger attachment to their mam,

I mean. Very obviously there is.

Even if you ignore breastfeeding.

We're just primates - you do realise that, right?

I personally don't understand the consensus that mothers can't leave their child/won't be ready etc. You will hear a lot of martyrs on here OP about "I didn't leave my baby overnight until they were 3, 7, 18" etc. It's exhausting.

I'm on a mum whatsapp group where a mum didn't want to leave her 2.5 year old with her DH to go for a birthday dinner (so latest home, maybe 11pm?), and there was big support about "well you're never going to remember a random dinner, but when you look back, you will remember you were there for your baby day in, day out". I just thought, by the time that kid is older and she feels ready to leave them, she would have probably lost a bunch of her friends. I'd stop inviting someone out if in 2.5 years they always said no. It also begs the question of how useful/useless is DH.

As for me, I ebf for 6 months.

I left my 4 month old for 3 days, 2 nights for a long weekend hen party and DH looked after him the whole time.

A few months later, we left DS again, now 8 months with grandparents to go to a destination wedding in Spain with DH. I had a bloody good time, drank, stayed late, enjoyed myself. And baby was totally fine when I got back. It was actually DH that kept bringing up DS in conversation, asking my parents to send pics etc, I was totally checked out and loving it.

A few months later, we left DS (now 17 months) with GPs again for 2 weeks whilst we went to Asia on a holiday of a lifetime. Again, totally fine.

There are more holidays booked for 2023, and I can't wait.

We have made it a rule that once a month DS stays overnight at GPs so that we have our own date night time, he's now a happy, confident 2 year old.

Everyone's different, but I have and use the support system I have, including DH.

Every family has a different set up. I get that you will be a first time mum but surely you can appreciate that? My dh took 2 weeks pat leave and a weeks holiday with out eldest, the same with our son and then 6 weeks with our youngest plus two weeks annual leave. We've shared night wake ups from the get go and all chores are equal in this house. Just because he worked full time wasn't a good enough excuse not to do night wake ups with out children when I was struggling. I have higher expectations in a spouse than a lot of people I'm starting to realise. He has always been an equal parent though. I think those women that mystically believe the mother is somehow all encompassing do men a disservice and actually make a rod for their own back. If they always think they know best, often they jump in and undermine the other parents efforts or completely take over. This can be manageable when it's just the one child but add in going back to work and a second or third child and resentment builds.

I left my son at 6 weeks to attend a 2 day family wedding and I regretted it. I couldn't sleep without him and missed him so much. With my current baby who is 17 months old, I left her at 3 months old to go to see a panto. I have not left her overnight nor will I anytime soon. I do not have family nearby that are willing to help nor would I ask them. I want to take care of my kids myself and dh and I are fortunate not to need nursery this time around. My sil is completely different and gives her baby to my mil overnight to do the wake ups and is happy to leave her with mil whenever she wants. It's whatever suits your family.

Best of luck with the rest of your pregnancy. x

What a lot of bosh about ‘the patriarchy’, gender stereotyping, etc. Of course many mothers - I’m not saying all of them - feel a visceral bond with their infants - it’s Nature’s way of ensuring that babies - human and animal - weren’t just dumped in the forest for predators to eat. Of course some mothers - both human and animal - show little or no interest, but it’s hardly the norm.

As for men being wired differently, well of course they are - their sex is evident in every cell of their bodies - it’s not just their ‘bits’. I had thought this nonsense about any differences except genitals being entirely down to stereotyping/societal expectations, etc., went out with the more extreme forms of 1970s feminism. Which I’m old enough to remember.

But that’s not to say that many men are not fantastic, loving fathers. Of course many are.

Oh there was a dads club in our area - it was the only one to welcome dads. It was on a Saturday morning, because obviously big important men only have that small window of time that they could take their children out - they are doing big important man jobs all week, aren’t they?

As a working mum, I wanted to take my daughter to a class. Guess how many weekend clubs for mums there were? None. Because obviously women are going to give up or reduce their work to look after their children, so they can go midweek.

Exactly right. It’s in everything and self-perpetuates generation after generation.

Exactly. These things are directly damaging women, and some people seem to not see that by making parenting equally accessible to mums AND dads, they are actually allowing the financial playing field to be evened out a little.

My partner is my daughters primary emergency contact, yet they automatically phone me. If my partner is home, I don’t even offer to contact him for them, I simply ask them to call the primary contact (we have never been in a position where a real emergency occurred - obviously I would not be deliberately awkward if she was hurt or badly unwell) - when he is at work, it’s still easier for him to be the one to leave work and go get her, but there is an assumption that the woman has a job where she can just leave, or is at home, and the man is doing an important job he can’t leave.

@CherLloydbyCherLloyd

“The problem is, society is set up to let them fail.”
Yes, agree society has thrown significant barriers up against gender nonconforming fathers that are doing the traditional mother role. It does cause failures in too many cases.

“Often, the changing table is in the ladies toilet.” This was definitely true for my DH. Nowadays there are more private unisex family or changing room so fathers can have access to a changing table. The way my DH got around this was a roll up changing mat and he’d usually change them in the boot of the car. It meant walking back outside the shops or back to the car park…but needs must. Although by the 3rd baby, he’d just pick a park bench or discreetly use a bench seat in a restaurant booth, or a bench in a less busy area of a shopping centre. He was very fast at nappy changes by then and didn’t care about what random passers-by might mutter.

“Lots of baby classes are called “mums and babies” Very true, in fact my DH went to various advertised baby and toddler play groups that didn’t have ‘mum &’ in the name and was turned away in some cases, but there are groups out there that do accept SAHDs and he found one at a local church and an informal one at the local play park. He and other SAHDs on one base had their own play group as well. They called it the OHC (Officers Husbands Club) making fun of the traditional OWC (Officers wives club)

“Nappy bags are generally feminine in their design -” My DH is of opinion a bag is a bag and he simply bought a back pack from an outdoors shop to use as a nappy bag.

“pushchair handles are generally at a height that is more comfortable for a smaller framed person” also true, so DH had a sling and baby Bjorn and simply carried them that way. Being a man, he could carry baby plus back pack nappy bag easily and have his hands free for the older toddlers. He also modified a cheap push chair by adding bigger wheels and a handle bar extension for when they were 2+ and too big to carry but too small to walk very far.

“Doctors surgeries have asked my partner if I’m at work when he has taken the kids to the doctors.” haven’t had this that I know of….have to ask DH if this happened to him too.

“The school automatically phone me rather than my partner if my daughter isn’t well, despite him being the primary contact.” God, yes had this. Although I never changed my surname, so a few schools when we told them to list him as primary contact looked at his surname matching the DCs surname and then seeing mine was different assumed I was a girlfriend and he was a single dad. So since they assumed I wasn’t the DCs actual mother, they’d call him first. We let them assume that as it suited us. By the time they realised I was the DCs mother, they’d established the habit to call him first. The kids would also tell the school nurse “call my dad to come get me” as well.

It is proving the exact opposite of what you think - it’s patriarchal that these things are set up for women - it shows that society intends that these things will be used predominantly for women, women should know their place (doing childcare rather than in the workplace)

By making childcare items equally accessible for both genders, it puts the expectation on men to “do their share” and therefore makes it easier for women to leave men to “do their share” whilst they do things like further their career.

Specifically speaking about the examples of baby changing tables being in the ladies toilets - in those instances, my partner goes into the ladies toilets (after letting a staff member know he will be doing so to change our child) - but it was very isolating for him as a SAHD that most of the clubs available were not inviting. How are we going to force men to “do more” if we continually tell them parenting is for women?

I think any baby will be fine with their primary care giver, whoever that may be and will bond the most with that person. In saying that, of course a baby is most likely to bond the most with their birth mother, having already bonded for 9 months, as someone else said childbirth is primal, breastfeeding is too. Your body does all these amazing things to care for your baby, both physically and mentally. And it's also brutal on the mother, and perhaps that's also why some of that bond and motherly instinct comes from too. I can truly say that motherhood has changed me, not even necessarily for the best (for me), but I definitely changed. Maybe it's knowing that I am entirely responsible for this little being that I created and have nutured. Yes my DH is too, but I really don't think it's the same. I don't even know why I don't, it just isn't.

Sorry off topic, but ... and so what? Society in general is set up for a white male, and yet still we all survive and some even thrive ...

There is not biological reason for babies to have a stronger attachment to their mam, but we live in a patriachal society that is structured in a way that encourages it.

Everything from kicking dad's out of the hospital after the baby is born (so that mum is already the expert parent by the time they get home) to women being paid less so they are more likely to take time off to care, for sick days etc. All the messages we internalise about mum being the main parent. They all mean that mums do more care, so they become more attached.

Pfft, the world is mostly set up for an unencumbered adult male to get about, I couldn’t care less if some limited items are actually designed for the average woman. A man can just crack on even if it is a bit embarrassing for him or uncomfortable, just like women do. As though going around with children is easy for women and you aren’t constantly being criticised for taking up space with your buggy. Absolutely zero energy to get sympathetic about a man complaining about it being awkward pushing a buggy that’s designed for a smaller woman or carrying a flowery nappy bag. If that’s his excuse for not getting involved then it’s pathetic.

The problem is, society is set up to let them fail.

Often, the changing table is in the ladies toilet.

Lots of baby classes are called “mums and babies” which I totally get if it’s postnatal fitness or something, but this was for things like baby massage, and toddler groups.

Nappy bags are generally feminine in their design - either handbag style, or the rucksack ones are so small they don’t fit on an average male frame - although admittedly there is more choice now than when my eldest was born. Now my partner felt totally comfortable carrying a female looking bag, but the full point is that society is set up to assume men won’t be the ones carrying the bag.

pushchair handles are generally at a height that is more comfortable for a smaller framed person - although admittedly more were adjustable when buying a pram for my youngest than my eldest (large age gap)

Doctors surgeries have asked my partner if I’m at work when he has taken the kids to the doctors.

The school automatically phone me rather than my partner if my daughter isn’t well, despite him being the primary contact.