"All men cheat, you just never find out about it"

I don't agree that the "majority" of men and women cheat. Some do and it may, possibly be a fairly high number, but no way is it the majority.

I have been married for over 40 years. I have never ever in those years wanted sex with anyone but my husband. I am just not interested in any other man. I also believe strongly in marriage and the vows we took. I believe cheating wrong, totally wrong.

My DH holds the same views and morals as I do and I believe him when he says he would never cheat. I am not naive or stupid but not all men and women have the morals of alley cats

It's not pretending. Some of us love and desire our spouses and are loved and desired in return. It may not be quite the same as it was x years ago before children etc, but as Mohammed Ali said, a man who is the same person at 50 as he was at 20 has wastes 30 years of his life. I had a damn good time when I was younger and so did he, so maybe that helps. I don't feel I missed out and I'm as sure as I can be that it doesn't get better than this. Even if it can, it's good enough for me. I simply don't want anyone else.

I don't recognise the sentiment that marriage is "suicide for the soul", as a PP said. Though I probably would if I were unhappily married because that does sound awful.

Some men cheat. So do some women.

But not most. Or maybe just not in the circles I move in.

I couldn’t imagine my husband cheating on me: and he works with nearly all women

I’ve been in male dominated industries for many years and I would say, more men cheat than you’d think. Even some of the ‘nice’ guys.

I’d show up to work events where they brought their wives along, bold as brass. I used to hate the lies.

BUT, it was by no means all. I’d say 50% given the chance when out of the country would cheat. And that’s a mixture of guys, from professionals to entry level, old, to young.

Yes. I don't think most people who cheat intend to cause hurt, in fact I think most of them assume they won't get caught and no hurt will ensue.

This certainly doesn't make it right. It's often not true either. Even if the spouse doesn't find out, if you are distant or acting strangely, they can still be hurt and confused. That might even be worse.

But it does inform how I feel about other actions that can ruin a marriage that were most certainly intended to cause hurt. And about people who insist that if you find out about an affair, even when it's absolutely nothing to do with you, you should always tell, and even take pleasure in watching the fallout. The cheater, as selfish and unworthy as they were, probably intended no hurt. Tellers, in these circumstances, are often motivated entirely by causing hurt...even take pleasure in it, if it means bringing a cheater down.

But if all this is true, then why do we have to pretend that people love each other and romantic (romantic, not sexual) love exists?

Why aren’t we just honest, that people just want to fuck whatever comes their way, and for those who wans to have children - just have some kind of commune or something.

Why all this pretending?

Why bully single people, if relationships are this useless?

I agree. This is an important distinction. Because the question boils down to 'would you have sex with someone else if that was an acceptable thing to do' and I can imagine most people, not just men, would probably say yes to that. Or at least couldn't give it a catagoric and lifelong no.
Most people don't restrict themselves to sex with one person because they have no interest in sex with anyone else from the day they set eyes on their partner; but because the potential consequences of straying from monogamy in terms of hurt caused, losses risked are too great.
So, I suppose that's cheating in a nutshell. People cheat when their desire for sex with someone else outweighs their fear of the consequences.

@Longerthanfiveweeks

sorry for the repeat post i forgot to quote

Not his podcast listeners, podcast guests who are actively arguing with him and against his ideas 😂

Not his podcast listeners, podcast guests who are actively arguing with him and against his ideas 😂

I’d imagine most people who are against cheating are actually against hurting somebody they love. In this thought exercise, if the person they love is never going to find out, they aren’t going to be hurt. So it’s just sex with somebody else, which is a morally neutral act.

I think a lot more men cheat than most women realise.

I definitely know that some men you would never in a million years would think were cheating, are cheating. The good guys, the devoted to their partner guys, the strong moral conscious guys. Some of the guys I've found out were cheating - made me realise any guy could cheat.

Sorry to mention his name but A.Tate asked so many men this question on his podcasts, men who were so against cheating.

Right. Not exactly an unbiased audience selection then, since those are his podcast listeners.

Sorry to mention his name but A.Tate asked so many men this question on his podcasts, men who were so against cheating. In the end they all agreed if they were able to keep their wife and Everything was to stay they same but also be able to have a bit on the side would
they do it and it was always a “yes” in the end

😑

A LOT of men do in fact cheat, on some level in my experience. I've just sat here now and thought through a list of the men I know well through work, and there's more of them that have cheated than not.

@5128gap

There's definitely a correlation between leery behaviour and likelihood of cheating.
Some men are simply way more interested in women than others. You can easily pick them out if you observe behaviour.

I'm not sure about that actually. There's definitely parts of male society where cheating would be more likely to be tolerated than others.

But big groups of pissed up lads on nights out sometimes almost feel obliged to play up the "bloke with a wandering eye" image to impress their mates and the group gives them cover to do it (and the alcohol). I'm not sure that necessarily means these types of blokes are likely to follow through on cheating on their wives than more reticent and less lairy ones. It just means they hang out with people who are less likely to call them out on it.

I've known plenty of serial cheats who would never in a million years chat a woman up in a bar in an obvious way. The subtler ones are often more dangerous as they have very plausible deniability.

Yes, I agree. My point is that just because they don't cheat now, I suspect everyone will cheat at some point.

I don't think it's possible to say someone's not the cheating type because I think stress, bereavement, financial worries, general unhappiness, anger etc lead people to do things they wouldn't usually do.

@Creasedlinen I don't think anyone is saying that they will chat at ANY opportunity where there are women available. those men you were with might not have felt the urge with the women they saw on the night, but still fancy a bit of a fling with one particular women that serves at their local Bar.

Are some men more interested or are some better at hiding it? It is perfectly normal afterall and most of what we call "manners" is us repressing basic human instincts.

I was away with a group for a sports thing last weekend. Somewhere beautifully sunny (so lots of skimpy clothes) and the beer was very freely flowing.

Only one other woman in the group (and she was with her husband). The men were variously married, in long term relationship and single.

There was lots of drunken conversation about sex, including some occasions when they had to be "told" about their comments regarding passing young women, but AFAIK no one actually had any sex with the wrong person. Certainly no one came on to me.

That said, I do know for a fact that at least 2 of the men have been previously unfaithful, although they have unhappy tales about the circumstances that led to it. So, I think most people will cheat in their lifetime, but I don't think most are at it all the time.

I do think lots of men make lecherous comments, but I don't think they necessarily mean it and would run a mile if the women were a real possibility for them. The men I was with genuinely thought they were admiring beauty rather than causing harm.

There's definitely a correlation between leery behaviour and likelihood of cheating.
Some men are simply way more interested in women than others. You can easily pick them out if you observe behaviour. In a group of men on a night out you'll see the ones who have little interest in much outside of their beer and interaction with their mates, compared with the ones who's eyes are everywhere, making comments to women, trying to engage them. Its pretty obvious that the man with the greater interest in women is the one more likely to cheat. Not guaranteed to, obviously, but way more likely if he got the chance.
Its exactly the same with a partner. The man who can't walk down the road with you without giving the side eye to every passing female, or hold a conversation with a woman as a person without needing flirting or sex to be on the agenda, will be more likely to cheat due to his heightened interest in women and his poor sense of propriety.

I'd have to say after working in bars in my youth, most of the "family" guys that came in and pleasantly socialised with their wife were completely different when they came in on their own and their wives would have been shocked and yes most of them had confessions of infidelity but I don't believe all the stories were true but they seemed to want their friends to think they were cheats and want all available woman to know they were willing to.

Well my partner doesn't and neither do any of my male friends, even the ones I know do cheat. I don't think there's a correlation.

In addition to previous post - to my mind overriding someone's consent, even to the extent of being a heckler/sex pest to random women in public, is worse than sexual infidelity with a consenting partner.

*naive
Agree wholeheartedly with @5128gap

I travelled at least once a week in my late 20[s/30[s. Completely normal, happily married family men (some still good friends) threw all morals out the window when away with work (women too, but less so) they got home... did not think about it again.

I don't know about 'cheating'. It would certainly indicate an attitude toward females I find completely unacceptable, to the extent that should I ever find out about it, it would be an immediate deal-breaker.

'Not my Nigel' is a thing, though, apparently. And women have been known to stick by men who are irrefutably proven - trial and conviction - to have done horrible things against another person's consent. The media is full of them.

They can actually lie down with a proven rapist, coercer, even child molster. There are many documented cases of it.

I really, really can't compute it.