To ask if school mum cliques upset you, or how do you deal with cliques?

Why do you care?

Just a bunch of losers with too much time on their hands.

I think if you think this you have never actually encountered a clique.

I'm a pretty straightforward person as able as the next person to smooth over behaviour I might find uncomfortable in the moment but which probably has other causes. I've also been subject to some really childish and bitchy behaviour at the school gate. As an example of something quite conclusive I think that if someone asks you a small-talk based question it's not polite to laugh hysterically and call your mates over, repeat the question and laugh together over what is clearly an in-joke. I didn't care on a deep level because I already had older kids and had made friends at school when they were little, but it was bloody offensive in the moment. Had I been feeling more delicate at the time it would have really upset me. As it stood it was just evidence it was them, not me.

Thet are not cliques, they are just people who already know each other, maybe the kids were at nursery together, or other toddler groupss or perhaps they have older kids at the school.

A clique isn’t people who already know each other or are already friends though. It’s people who still behave like school children and it absolutely does go on in all areas of life. So I don’t know why some people are so determined to undermine the experiences of others. (Maybe they are the sort of people who do this and reading about it touches a nerve?)

Although the OP hasn’t clarified what she means.

@FourTeaFallOut well we’ve got to year 6 from reception so we’re not doing too badly, and our kids will probably all go to the same senior school. However our DC aren’t all friends now, they’ve branched out into different friendships in their year. We’re still friends as mums regardless of who our DC are friends with. I don’t see why my kids being in year 7 would stop any of us socialising outside of school.

There is a a snobbishness about mum groups. ‘I just keep my head down and drop off’, ‘I don’t need to make new friends, I’ve got friends already’. Wtf is that about? It’s so unnecessary.

I find making friends bloody hard, I hate small talk and really had to put myself out there, it paid off. Maybe some playgrounds are worse than others.

Thet are not cliques, they are just people who already know each other, maybe the kids were at nursery together, or other toddler groupss or perhaps they have older kids at the school. Or maybe they didn't know each other before but are making an effort to get to know their kid's new friend's parents.

So you either make an effort to ingratiate yourself with the other parents, which makes school life easier, friendship groups easier for your kids, play dates, info re school, help with picking up, organising parties, finding out about clubs after school, lift sharing or just passing the time. Or don't bother and keep yourself to yourself.

I moved to a new area for schools for my kids and my best friends are parents from school.

I totally get you!

I tended to talk to loads of different mums at the school gates as opposed to getting into a “friendship group”, I just felt I wasn’t one of those who needed to be part of a group. I also looked out for the ones often standing on their own and befriended them.

Some groups were just so huddled up together it wasn’t always easy to try and join…

A friend belongs to a health spa and often finds she’s outside of the friendship groups coz she feels more comfortable not being part of the weekly coffee mornings, meals out, etc..It can all get quite intense and it feels good to be independent of that.

There is a vast difference between people who are genuine friends and people who make WhatsApp groups and then bitch about other people or try to shut others out. There are frequently threads about those sorts of situations.

In any other situation no one would have an issue with a group of friends not including people they didn’t know.

I don't have any qualms about people building friendship groups and not inviting others in. I did say that in my first post. The post you quoted was in response to the accusation of, snobbery I suppose, that people look down on school friendship groups. I don't do that either.

Although it is my experience that these friendships are time limited and they drift apart. Now maybe you have a group of mum friends who continue to invest in that friendship when the kids move to secondary - I'd say that wasn't the norm at all.

Once people get beyond the convenience of picking each others kids up from school, needing to facilitate their children's friendships in a more concrete hosting and ferrying about manner, helping each other remember key dates or forgotten homework - it fades. That's fine too, but if you think this is a friends for life situation - you might find yourself a bit cheated by the time y7 comes around.

@CallTheMobWife

I remember a woman ranting at some school thing about "cliques and bitchy women and alphas being mean girls" and so on....and pointed at a group of 4 women who were always chatting together in the school yard by themselves. I had to say "you mean X and her 2 sisters and her best friend of 30 years"?

Exactly this. The people who cry "clique" are usually just people who are outraged at the idea that other women can maintain friendships which don't include them.

Because, it's just a temporary, transactional friendship that runs its course when kids switch schools and there's no more benefit to it.

Maybe in your case. But a lot of life long friends are made at the school gate. It’s no different from making friends at baby groups or NCT.

In any other situation no one would have an issue with a group of friends not including people they didn’t know.

You, apparently for one.

Cliques aren't a thing. People are making friends, that's all, there is nothing at all wrong with that. Some of them are already friends, most likely.

The people who don't make friends are the people who don't understand them and call them cliques and ask how to deal with it....just drop the attitude and act like a normal person and you might make friends too.

I remember a woman ranting at some school thing about "cliques and bitchy women and alphas being mean girls" and so on....and pointed at a group of 4 women who were always chatting together in the school yard by themselves. I had to say "you mean X and her 2 sisters and her best friend of 30 years"?

Cliques are petty. I never bothered to make friends on the school run. Women can be really childish.

@Mardyface

A friendship group= a group of people who are secure enough in their affection for each other that they can invite new people in sometimes, meet separately sometimes, realise that in jokes etc are not for public places. Really not related to those around them/not in the group as is about friendship within.
A clique: a group of people who try to create closeness by excluding others, some members don't actually enjoy the friendships within but feel safer than if they were excluded, in jokes are used in public as a way of excluding others, is ALL about who isn't in the group and whether you're accepted or not

I understand what a clique is but my point is that all these "school gate mums" posts are based on the thinnest of evidence.

If you actually unpack what has triggered the evidence of "cliques" its always incredibly inconclusive. "She looked straight past me" or "She was talking to another mum and had her back to me." It's the sort of behaviour will people engage in all the time, unconsciously, because they are busy or preoccupied or not feeling themselves or whatever.

But for some reason the sort of behaviour which would be shrugged off in the workplace or at the bus stop takes on this huge almost spiritual significance when its at the "school gate". I'm pretty certain that in 90% of cases these incidents don't even register with the people who are alleged to have done it, they are getting on with their day.

This is a lot of fairly insecure people who subconsciously feel they are "owed" a friendship network when their kids go to school, often because they haven't bothered to keep their old friendship networks up when they had kids, who then get the hump about other people who have more social skills than them. It's jealousy pure and simle.

The solution is to get on with your life, do what you do and develop actual friends with actual shared interests. And stop caring about a bunch of randoms who you happen to cross paths with at school. Chances are they are thinking a lot less about you than you are about them but you certainly won't help your chances of making friends by getting huffy and sulking about perceived sleights all the time.

I worked so never did school runs. I had my own friends so didn't need to find them at the school gate.

Just because people have children the same age doesn't mean they have anything else in common.

Just get on with your own life.

Just smile and chat away to all and sundry. You'll soon gauge which people you click with, then you only need to be polite with the rest.

FGS don't start getting paranoid about cliques because that's a surefire way to end up always standing alone in the playground.

i have two dc in first school (a small school), my first is in yr3 and the mums all get along great, we're pretty similar and i could stand and chat to any and all but one of them. my youngest is in reception and its totally different. There's a group of 5/6 who stand in a group and when i try to smile just look at me like "what the fuck are you looking at?", then there's 2 who stand away from everyone else but will say hello on their way through the gate and a couple who mingle with the rest of us. I dread parties with my youngest

Because, it's just a temporary, transactional friendship that runs its course when kids switch schools and there's no more benefit to it.

Maybe I'm a little jaded. I have three kids, I've been doing the school run consecutively for 11 years. I only have to do this for another two years tops and then the youngest will be able to walk alone. Other than passing the time, chatting to others who are nearby, I'm just running the clock down at this point.

There isn't an issue though, mums having a chat for 5 mins after dropping the kids off. Smile, wave, they are probably discussing the bloody weather.
The OP is making this into a bigger deal than it needs to be and if more people were told this then maybe things won't escalate.

I never understand on threads like this why (some) people are so against making school mum friends. That attitude is just as bad as accusing people of being in a clique.

Since when is having too many friends a bad thing? Why does it matter how you know someone?

You might be over thinking this and need to push yourself to chat to people.

People might think I'm in a clique. I'm
Not. We are just people that have become friends because our kids have been friends since eyfs and want to see each other out of school or coincidentally go to the same clubs.

We are not mean or nasty people we don't leave people out, we always include other people to chat if they are stood nearby.

I always extend invitations to play dates to parents I don't know so well if the kids mention other kids they want to join us somewhere.

I don't know why people are pretending there are not cliques at the school gates.

A friendship group= a group of people who are secure enough in their affection for each other that they can invite new people in sometimes, meet separately sometimes, realise that in jokes etc are not for public places. Really not related to those around them/not in the group as is about friendship within.

A clique: a group of people who try to create closeness by excluding others, some members don't actually enjoy the friendships within but feel safer than if they were excluded, in jokes are used in public as a way of excluding others, is ALL about who isn't in the group and whether you're accepted or not.

If you haven't come across the second type of group at the school gates you are lucky - but that doesn't mean they don't exist.

OP the way to deal with it is by genuinely but caring (you may need to work at this). Be friendly and appear confident even if the clique has hurt you. In this way you will find that people entrapped by the clique will slowly realise there is life outside it and you can guarantee at least one or two will approach you for your easy and friendly manner. Tricky though, but worth trying. Takes a while but works ime.

I've purposely started chatting to a mum who seems quite lonely at school.

We're going out for gins at the pub soon 😁 I actually think she's amazing. But I wouldn't know if I hadn't said "Hey, how's XX getting on at school?"

Hand on heart, I hope our friendship continues to develop as she makes me laugh so much and she's really down to earth.

Why do you need to deal with them? Just take your kids to school then go home. You don't need to deal with groups of clicky mums loitering outside.

I have a clique but it's because we were friends before school started.

I'm making a conscious effort to talk to everyone there! That's what you need to do too.

Just say "how's <kids name> getting on?"

And go from there.